Whatcha Think? Yay or Nay?

Travis · Mar 28, 2015

So, say I were to come on the radio, or on your television set, and I tell you somewhere along the lines of the following:

"The main reason for Jesus coming to earth was not to go to the cross. .... He (Jesus) said, the reason why I came was to deliver to you a kingdom."

"So, our Gospel is the good news about a kingdom. Therefore, our message, or good news, is not about Calvary. Our good news is not even about the resurrection. These are important aspects of the work of redemption, but these are not the good news."

Basically, I told you that the gospel is not about Jesus dying on a cross for our sins, but instead the gospel is about God bringing us the kingdom, giving us dominion and authority to rule over the earth, to subdue it and take it back for our own. All that stuff about the cross, about the blood, about the perfect sacrifice... ya ya, ok that's sort of true, but it's not what's important, what is important is that we have the Kingdom here on earth, and we need to take up our role in it, that's what's important.

Would you accept what I have to say, or not? Why or why not?

Blessings,

Travis

Dovegiven · Mar 28, 2015

Jesus did many things to accomplish his ultimate mission. 1 John 3:8-10 (KJV)
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

His purpose is not recorded "to die on the cross". That was part of God's plan. His purpose is not stated that his mission was to rise from the dead. He did those marvelous things. He did it all to defeat Satan, that in so doing released mankind from dominion by Satan through fear of death. By faith in Christ, his crucifixion, death, and resurrection man has one way to escape the reign of the Devil. By Jesus, God holds the door open for man to walk through to do his will on earth.

Dovegiven · Mar 28, 2015

In other words, there was a purpose for Jesus to live a sinless life, to suffer the cross, to shed his blood, to die, to be buried 3 days and nights, to arise from the grave, to walk among men alive again, to ascend to heaven, to reveal himself to men as to Paul, to send the Holy Spirit in his place, to reveal himself as he is to John in Revelation, and to be known quite personally to millions of believers since those days.

So what ultimate purpose all that?

Travis · Mar 28, 2015

Dovegiven said:
His purpose is not recorded "to die on the cross".

Yes, that's part of what I am asking. Was the central theme, the whole point of Christ coming his death on the cross, and his resurrection from the dead?

Thank you for the input.

Anyone else have anything to share?

Travis

Curtis · Mar 28, 2015

It was not because of Jesus's death on the cross that we are saved, it was the fact that he died, and then rose again from the dead!!

1Co 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

@Curtis,

So, would you reject my initial post then? And instead say that the central theme of the scriptures, of what Jesus Christ taught, was his death and resurrection? That this would be front and center in importance?

Blessings,

Travis

DHC · Mar 29, 2015

Hello Travis.

I will disagree with you regarding what is identified as the Gospel in the scripture.

Luke 13:32
And He said to them, “Go and tell that fox, ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today
and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.

Jesus died and was resurrected to save humanity, which was His primary mission and goal.

The death and resurrection of the Christ is referred to as the Gospel in the scripture.

1 Corinthians 15
15 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you
received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved...
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins
according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day
according to the Scriptures

This is the Gospel that was proclaimed by Paul, this is the Gospel you must believe to be saved.

1 Corinthians 2:2
For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.

All very simple Travis, Paul specifically desribed what the Gospel was, Paul tells us what he
taught.

Wired 4 Fishen · Mar 29, 2015

Travis said:
So, say I were to come on the radio, or on your television set, and I tell you somewhere along the lines of the following:

"The main reason for Jesus coming to earth was not to go to the cross. .... He (Jesus) said, the reason why I came was to deliver to you a kingdom."

"So, our Gospel is the good news about a kingdom. Therefore, our message, or good news, is not about Calvary. Our good news is not even about the resurrection. These are important aspects of the work of redemption, but these are not the good news."

Basically, I told you that the gospel is not about Jesus dying on a cross for our sins, but instead the gospel is about God bringing us the kingdom, giving us dominion and authority to rule over the earth, to subdue it and take it back for our own. All that stuff about the cross, about the blood, about the perfect sacrifice... ya ya, ok that's sort of true, but it's not what's important, what is important is that we have the Kingdom here on earth, and we need to take up our role in it, that's what's important.

Would you accept what I have to say, or not? Why or why not?

Blessings,

Travis

that stuff about the cross, about the blood, about the perfect sacrifice... ya ya, ok that's sort of true, but it's not what's important, what is important is that we have the Kingdom here on earth, and we need to take up our role in it, that's what's important.

Travis,
With out the things that your are playing off as not as important are the very things that will get you there.
The Blood of Christ is the only thing that will save you on judgment day so I would say that is very important.
The only reason Jesus came to this earth was for the cross. He could have taught all of us and left or there have been plenty of other saints and prophets and priest who could have taught us about the kingdom.

Jesus came for the ultimate sacrifice pure and Holy and unblemished lamb offered up for us all. With out this you would not stand a chance of ever operating or seeing the kingdom of God in your life.
Further more we see in John 12:27 KJV
Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour; BUT for this cause came I unto this hour .
So when you say this is not the reason or the important thing........you make a huge NAY..............
Blessings
Jim

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

Th

DHC said:
Hello Travis.

I will disagree with you regarding what is identified as the Gospel in the scripture.

Luke 13:32
And He said to them, “Go and tell that fox, ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today
and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.

Jesus died and was resurrected to save humanity, which was His primary mission and goal.

The death and resurrection of the Christ is referred to as the Gospel in the scripture.

1 Corinthians 15
15 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you
received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved...
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins
according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day
according to the Scriptures

This is the Gospel that was proclaimed by Paul, this is the Gospel you must believe to be saved.

1 Corinthians 2:2
For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.

All very simple Travis, Paul specifically desribed what the Gospel was, Paul tells us what he
taught.

Thank you for expressing your opinion on the subject at hand DHC.

God bless you,

Travis

Fragrant Grace · Mar 29, 2015

Nay @Travis in answer to your opening thread

The gospel message is simply the most beautiful message of the Lord's abundant saving grace

Now, brothers and sisters, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand.
By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.
For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that He was buried, that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,
1 Corinthians 15:1-4

And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath He reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;
Colossians 1:21-23

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth
Romans 1:15

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

Wired 4 Fishen said:
BUT for this cause came I unto this hour

Thanks for posting that scripture. Very fitting to the subject at hand.

Blessings,

Travis

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

Thank you all, for chiming in,

Anyone else like to share their opinion about my original post?

Curtis · Mar 29, 2015

Travis said:
@Curtis,

So, would you reject my initial post then? And instead say that the central theme of the scriptures, of what Jesus Christ taught, was his death and resurrection? That this would be front and center in importance?

Blessings,

Travis

The Gospel in the good news. Jesus preached the Word of the Kingdom, yet no one can reach the Kingdom without Jesus's death, and resurrection from the dead. You can not separate the Gospel into different topics, we must proclaim the whole council of God not just one.

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

Curtis said:
The Gospel in the good news. Jesus preached the Word of the Kingdom, yet no one can reach the Kingdom without Jesus's death, and resurrection from the dead. You can not separate the Gospel into different topics, we must proclaim the whole council of God not just one.

Ah, OK,

So you would accept my first post then?

Curtis · Mar 29, 2015

Travis said:
Ah, OK,

So you would accept my first post then?

The benefits of receiving the Kingdom can not be had until the death and resurrection of Christ which is the main point of the Gospel.

1Co 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

amadeus2 · Mar 29, 2015

If the word, "Gospel" means, good news, is not the good news that now there is Life to replace the death? Were not all men dead before Life was available again? Who is the Life what does it require for us to obtain it? Is the not answer, the good news?

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

Curtis said:
The benefits of receiving the Kingdom can not be had until the death and resurrection of Christ which is the main point of the Gospel.

1Co 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

So then the focus is on the Kingdom? Jesus died and rose again, in order to give us the Kingdom, right? He did all this so that we could have the Kingdom here on earth, and we can walk in that reality, in the Kingdom, here on earth? The focus then is on the Kingdom, right? You would agree with that?

Or no?

I can't seem to understand whether you agree or not.

Travis

Curtis · Mar 29, 2015

Travis said:
So then the focus is on the Kingdom? Jesus died and rose again, in order to give us the Kingdom, right? He did all this so that we could have the Kingdom here on earth, and we can walk in that reality, in the Kingdom, here on earth? The focus then is on the Kingdom, right? You would agree with that?

Or no?

I can't seem to understand whether you agree or not.

Travis

You first have to lose your life before you find life. What good is the Kingdom if you can not access it?

Travis · Mar 29, 2015

Curtis said:
You first have to lose your life before you find life. What good is the Kingdom if you can not access it?

OK, so you agree then.

Thank you for the input.

Travis

Purrl Sugar · Mar 29, 2015

“We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed… Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.” 2 Peter 1:19-21

I love the Bible because it answers all questions.

"Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner. Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.” Acts 4:10-12

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