How to get free from dark spirits

[Sue D.]

Okay -- fine with me. And, no, I wasn't really expecting one.

 

[Bendito]

Okay -- fine with me. And, no, I wasn't really expecting one. :smile:

What's wrong Sue? Why are you in such a dark mood? What did I say that set you off? That God spoke and told me where to look?

 

[Sue D.]

Bendito -- you and I don't agree on lots of things. And if I'm in a dark mood -- it's Maybe that Resurrection Sunday is Usually also a family time and I don't have family around here.

And your comments regarding demons and such. I Don't agree -- simple as that. The world of the demonic is Dangerous and we are Not to go after it the way you suggest. It's a serious subject.

I Do have a lot on my shoulders these days.

 

[Bendito]

Bendito -- you and I don't agree on lots of things. And if I'm in a dark mood -- it's Maybe that Resurrection Sunday is Usually also a family time and I don't have family around here.

And your comments regarding demons and such. I Don't agree -- simple as that. The world of the demonic is Dangerous and we are Not to go after it the way you suggest. It's a serious subject.

I Do have a lot on my shoulders these days.

Ok...I can understand that. You do have a right to agree or disagree. I do wonder though...If you disagree, why are you stressing instead of simply backing away from the subject? It would be much easier on you.
I'me very sorry about your family. May I pray for you?

As far as my comments go, I only say what 1 The Word says. and 2 based on my experience....the subject is no different than talking about a janitorial job. It's everyday stuff. About a week ago I dropped a note to Chad asking him to delete this thread because of people not understanding it and taking offense over it....I guess he has not seen it yet.

 

[Sue D.]

Maybe it's my nature to get into conversation with people. I'm a lone-duck in a small strong Czec / RCC town. Very little communication as a result. So Forums tend to be my interaction.
You've made some Strong comments that I find it hard to back away from.

I've been widowed for 6 months -- it Has been hard.

I'll be going to another subject.

 

[Bendito]

Maybe it's my nature to get into conversation with people. I'm a lone-duck in a small strong Czec / RCC town. Very little communication as a result. So Forums tend to be my interaction.
You've made some Strong comments that I find it hard to back away from.

I've been widowed for 6 months -- it Has been hard.

I'll be going to another subject.

Bendito nods

 

[Quantrill]

The 1 Samuel 16:14 and 18:10

David and Saul. Back in That day -- the Holy Spirit came and went in people as did the spirit of evil. A footnote was reminding 'us' that God is in charge -- All the time. Satan / evil spirits Only have as much control / power as God allows.

When the evil spirit came upon Saul, David would be called to play music / the harp/ for him because it would sooth him.

In This day and age -- the Holy Spirit works differently. It doesn't come and go as it did back Then. Because of the Cross -- the Holy Spirit comes Permanently to indwell the born-again believer until the person is safe with Jesus Christ forever.

Quantrill -- I was just looking up the 1 Corinthians 12 passage -- the gift of discernment of spirits. Isn't that referring to distinguishing true and false prophesies. In that day - wasn't a false prophet supposed to be killed? Like nowdays there have been people Jean Dixon for instance -- trying to predict events. She was Mostly Wrong. Maybe Entirely wrong I don't remember off hand. I was particularly aware of Her because we share the same last name. NO not related. There are Lots of 'Dixon's' around.

usually the predictions are those trying to set a time for the rapture of the church. And since that event hasn't happened yet -- they would be false prophets. And predictors are generally laughed at.

Your comment about demonic activity in the various denominations would mimic normal activities in those various denominations. And a demon can mimic a perfectly healthy person? In an effort to fool believers into believing lies.

While it IS true that there is spiritual warfare going on, maybe you're carrying it to an extreme? Maybe?! That which Is Major is if the Gospel unto salvation is being preached. Any Other Gospel is False gospel. That doesn't mean that an evil spirit has entered Other preachers so that they Won't. There Are many preachers who teach anti - Christ. Who Jesus Christ Is. They teach work's based salvation. Which is Not salvation.

There Will be a time --in the future -- when the Antichrist Will appear and take over. He is mentioned in Revelation.

But the music of David did not just sooth Saul. It caused the evil spirit to depart. (1 Sam. 16:23)

Yes, we have the Holy Spirit always today as believers. But that does not mean an evil spirit cannot come and oppress us. Oppress our very soul.

I believe the gift of 'discernment of spirits' in (1 Cor. 12:10) speaks to being able to discern the spirit from which one is coming from. It is a supernatural gift from God. And those who have it are usually pretty miserable.

Concerning the spiritual warfare, it is extreme. Jesus told His disciples that they did not know what spirit they spoke of when they wanted to destroy a village in Samarian. (Luke 9:51-56). And Jesus told Peter, (Matt. 16:23) "Get thee behind me, Satan:"

Concerning the anti-christ, he is not going to come as one foaming at the mouth and raging and completely out of control.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

I usually do not like commentaries because they are only opinions of other readers of the Word, and not Word itself...In this case I'll share what Matthew Henry says...I do agree with him in this case.

I admit I did have a bit of trouble with this verse. I like to look at as many versions as I can but....
The Word says that God will not be tempted and does not tempt any man...Tempt meaning ' try, torment, etc The Word also says that God is the same yesterday, today and forever....So when the Book says God sent an evil spirit, you know its a problem in translation. Anyway, the Lord directed me to Matt Henry this morning. Mr Henry agrees with my understanding here and explains it better

No, you found a commentary that agrees with you.

You have trouble with this verse because it is clearly against what you want to believe.

You operate on a faulty method of interpretation. Just because you disagree with it, then it is a problem in translation. You literally make yourself the author of the Bible.

Quantrill

 

[Bendito]

No, you found a commentary that agrees with you.

You have trouble with this verse because it is clearly against what you want to believe.

You operate on a faulty method of interpretation. Just because you disagree with it, then it is a problem in translation. You literally make yourself the author of the Bible.

Quantrill

Mr Quantrill....I do not interpret the Book....I look at what it says....And my understanding follows what I know about God, from the Book.. The Book is written in English so I have no need to interpret...God can say what He wants to say as He means to say it, so again, it does not need interpreting...The problem come from when the scholars interpreted it from the Aramaic or the Greek. They took a few shortcuts and make a few mistakes. Now I don't expect you to believe it...But it's true. I already had my understanding before I asked Matthew Henry....He simply agreed with me. So..Yes, it was as I said this morning.

 

[Sue D.]

Bendito -- the Bible was originally written in Greek and Hebrew and some Armaic.. And, yes, it Has to be translated into English and many other languages so that people can read and understand it in their own language -- German, Italian, Spanish , etc. It was originally translated into Latin and then other languages.

The KJV we have Now was put together using the English used back in that time period. Back in 1611. And That was a reprint / update from the first one. Languages do change over time. A lot of the words used back then aren't used Now. So translators work very hard to get as close to the original meanings as possible.

No two languages have the same alphabet so translating from one language to another Will have some translating challenges. the translators go to great lengths to translate passages as close to original as possible and from one language to another. so they aren't Mistakes in translating -- simply finding the correct wording from language to language.

My sister and brother in law do translation work going from English to Brazilian Portugeese. My sisters' great strength is grammar. My brother in law does the computer graphics -- they work with college / university level courses. They work with Horizons --the group that does the translation projects.

 

[Sue D.]

But the music of David did not just sooth Saul. It caused the evil spirit to depart. (1 Sam. 16:23)

Yes, we have the Holy Spirit always today as believers. But that does not mean an evil spirit cannot come and oppress us. Oppress our very soul.

I believe the gift of 'discernment of spirits' in (1 Cor. 12:10) speaks to being able to discern the spirit from which one is coming from. It is a supernatural gift from God. And those who have it are usually pretty miserable.

Concerning the spiritual warfare, it is extreme. Jesus told His disciples that they did not know what spirit they spoke of when they wanted to destroy a village in Samarian. (Luke 9:51-56). And Jesus told Peter, (Matt. 16:23) "Get thee behind me, Satan:"

Concerning the anti-christ, he is not going to come as one foaming at the mouth and raging and completely out of control.

Quantrill

You're right about the Antichrist -- he won't be foaming at the mouth or anything obvious like that.

There will be a leader who people will follow -- everyone will be following him. But mid-way through he will change his tune drastically. He will basically turn on the people. No doubt that's why the 2nd half -- the last 3 1/2 yrs. will be Very bad. The Great Tribulation period. No one will really want to be around during that time. Born-again believers Now -- won't be. "We" get taken up and out 3 1/2 yrs Before that starts.

And, yes, believers Can experience Oppression but not Possession.

don't know Why having that particular gift would make a person Miserable. Being able To discern bad prophesy and being able To warn people would be your thing for God. unless you'd be concerned that people would choose to Not believe / heed your warnings. Maybe even retaliation against you?

 

[Bendito]

Bendito -- the Bible was originally written in Greek and Hebrew and some Armaic.. And, yes, it Has to be translated into English and many other languages so that people can read and understand it in their own language -- German, Italian, Spanish , etc. It was originally translated into Latin and then other languages.

The KJV we have Now was put together using the English used back in that time period. Back in 1611. And That was a reprint / update from the first one. Languages do change over time. A lot of the words used back then aren't used Now. So translators work very hard to get as close to the original meanings as possible.

No two languages have the same alphabet so translating from one language to another Will have some translating challenges. the translators go to great lengths to translate passages as close to original as possible and from one language to another. so they aren't Mistakes in translating -- simply finding the correct wording from language to language.

My sister and brother in law do translation work going from English to Brazilian Portugeese. My sisters' great strength is grammar. My brother in law does the computer graphics -- they work with college / university level courses. They work with Horizons --the group that does the translation projects.

You do know that Aramaic and Hebrew are related? As in dialects? I do know how the translators did the job. I read too.

 

[Sue D.]

Then why did you make the comment about their taking short cuts and making a few mistakes.

 

[Bendito]

Then why did you make the comment about their taking short cuts and making a few mistakes.

I

Then why did you make the comment about their taking short cuts and making a few mistakes.

I said that because they took shortcuts and made mistakes. There are even a few words not translated. For example, the word 'Christ' is not translated...It's a Greek word. Not English....Because of that, many Christians think it's Jesus' last name...It's not, of course. In other places they used another translators work and modified it, continuing mistakes the previous person made. "God hardened pharaohs heart" According to scripture God does not do that....What He did was to force pharaoh into making a decision..
Another mistranslation; God sent an evil spirit to torment Saul....God withdrew from Saul because Saul withdrew from God...This left Saul open to attack by evil spirits. Not all translations are accurate. And not all learning is by the intellect...We have to learn from the Holy Spirit who talks to us...We need to learn to listen to Him.

 

[Quantrill]

You're right about the Antichrist -- he won't be foaming at the mouth or anything obvious like that.

There will be a leader who people will follow -- everyone will be following him. But mid-way through he will change his tune drastically. He will basically turn on the people. No doubt that's why the 2nd half -- the last 3 1/2 yrs. will be Very bad. The Great Tribulation period. No one will really want to be around during that time. Born-again believers Now -- won't be. "We" get taken up and out 3 1/2 yrs Before that starts.

And, yes, believers Can experience Oppression but not Possession.

don't know Why having that particular gift would make a person Miserable. Being able To discern bad prophesy and being able To warn people would be your thing for God. unless you'd be concerned that people would choose to Not believe / heed your warnings. Maybe even retaliation against you?

The person with that gift of discernment of spirits is not always miserable. Sorry I left that impression. But can be at times with that gift. Why? Because at times the one who has the gift can see clearly that the person or the teaching is not from God no matter how good or correct it may appear. They can tell the spirit of which it comes from. But believers around them will not always agree and see it. If a believer with this gift is in a church that does not recognize the gifts, it is more frustrating.

Stranger

 

[Quantrill]

Mr Quantrill....I do not interpret the Book....I look at what it says....And my understanding follows what I know about God, from the Book.. The Book is written in English so I have no need to interpret...God can say what He wants to say as He means to say it, so again, it does not need interpreting...The problem come from when the scholars interpreted it from the Aramaic or the Greek. They took a few shortcuts and make a few mistakes. Now I don't expect you to believe it...But it's true. I already had my understanding before I asked Matthew Henry....He simply agreed with me. So..Yes, it was as I said this morning.

No, you already said if the Bible says God sent an evil spirit, then it is a problem with the translation. You force your belief on the Bible. As long as you agree, then the translation is correct.

Which means in essence you write your own Bible.

I'm not sure what you mean by shortcuts. You have a poor view of the translators.

Stranger

 

[Bendito]

No, you already said if the Bible says God sent an evil spirit, then it is a problem with the translation. You force your belief on the Bible. As long as you agree, then the translation is correct.

Which means in essence you write your own Bible.

I'm not sure what you mean by shortcuts. You have a poor view of the translators.

Stranger

Sir, you can accept what I said or not. Its up to you. Personally, I don't care.

 

[Quantrill]

Sir, you can accept what I said or not. Its up to you. Personally, I don't care.

I do not accept what you say. Why? Because the Scripture says God sent an evil spirit. And this is only one example. (1 Sam. 18:10)

Quantrill

 

[Sue D.]

Bendito -- I don't want to sound mean -- but -- you really Don't understand what translating from one language to another means.

And Quantrill is right -- you want Scripture to say what You want it to say -- not what it really Does say. If you Really want a translation - as accurate at possible -- Go back to the original Greek / Hebrew texts.

There Are people who don't like what the English says and Go back to see what the original language says and find out it's exactly the same thing.

The Original was inspired by God through the Holy Spirit. It's Totally God's Word. And God Has given people the knowledge To translate from one language to another.

Lots of our reading material came from other languages. This country is made up of people from Many other nationalities.

Back in high school , in order to get into college, a person had to take at least One foreign language to qualify for admission. I started learning Spanish a few years ago. Here in Texas, most of our grocery stores are bi-lingual. And lumber stores are bi-lingual in their labels for Everything. Going down the aisles looking for produce / products. A person sees the English / Spanish side by side. It's normal around here. It's the result of translating from English to Spanish.

So, yes, I'd agree -- you have a very poor view of translators.

 

[Sue D.]

And you Also don't have a good understanding of doctrine. As in Jesus' name - Christ - Jesus Christ - Chris Jesus.

And generally speaking in translating from one language to another -- there Will be/ Are words missing / added in to make a sentence read smoothly. And the original language / manuscripts did not have Periods / Question marks / paragraphs like Our Bibles do.

Maybe you should read about how we got the KJ Bible.

'We' need to place our faith Also in the fact that the translators did Their very best to get Us the best possible translation in English.

There were 6 committees of many people who worked for several years to get the KJV into print and available to read. And That entire process had to be okayed by King James 1. Back in That day -- Any material that was printed Had to have his okay or it couldn't be printed.

The Bible that you cherish -- that Lots of people read -- went through a lengthy process to get to us.