Calvanist!!! Yuck!!

[Bendito]

Ok....So what's a Calvanist? And what is so bad about their beliefs. Please use Word. That's the only real authority.

 

[Ivar]

No specific mention of the word Calvanist in the word. unless by another name.

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Definition of CALVINIST

Definition of Calvinism

: the theological system of Calvin and his followers marked by strong emphasis on the sovereignty of God, the depravity of humankind, and the doctrine of predestination
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Definition seems spot on. However Man also has the capacity to be joined unto The Lord and be good.
Predestination is also a fair word. On the micro level we seem to have an abundance of choices which is true but concerning the Macro level our micro level choices have already been factored in and based off our micro choices the end result can be only two. Success or Non Success.

 

[Fragrant Grace]

Greetings @Bendito

Calvininism is evil. Through intellectualism and philosophical debate it strips away the gospel message.

Firstly read the history of John Calvin.

Here also is a message from an ex calvinist

Calvinism Critiqued by a Former Calvinist

 

[bibleguy]

I'd say a good 3 or 4 (of the 5) elements of TULIP calvinism are likely unbiblical.

 

[KingJ]

Ok....So what's a Calvanist? And what is so bad about their beliefs. Please use Word. That's the only real authority.

They miss-represent God. Terribly so.

They imply He is partial. Hence wicked and evil as we 'should' all know and agree that partiality is wicked and evil. Right?

Arriving at the conclusion that ' God is partial' with their belief system is inevitable.

They take a verse (very popular) like Rom 9:21 'Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour' and interpret as therefore God ''does'' make a vessel unto dishonor. Just because God can, does not mean He does. The rest of scripture tells us what God ''does''. He wills that all be saved 1 Tim 2:4 / He died for all mankind John 3:16.

We can forgive a person for arriving at the belief that God is partial. He is described in scripture as being omniscient and omnipotent. Therefore partiality is an inevitability? No. There is no excuse for a reborn Christian to make such a claim of God. A Christian has grasped God's love. God's goodness. A Christian can like Peter did, grasp that God is impartial Acts 10:34 ''Of a truth I perceive, God is no respecter of persons'.

We need to grasp that God is as good as He is great. This is the message we have heard from the beginning. Calvinism says otherwise.

1 John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.

God ''cannot'' be partial. It is a darkness that does not / cannot exist in Him. Everyone has the ability to repent and make right with God this instant.

 

[Ivar]

Partial to the righteous; merciful to the repentant wicked I suspect. In my opinion is all about context and fluidity pertaining the scriptures.

It can be good to punish those that are not good so they may learn, repent,etc.

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Luke 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

At the same time non partial to infractions concerning his word.

Genesis 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

 

[Bendito]

They miss-represent God. Terribly so.

They imply He is partial. Hence wicked and evil as we 'should' all know and agree that partiality is wicked and evil. Right?

Arriving at the conclusion that ' God is partial' with their belief system is inevitable.

They take a verse (very popular) like Rom 9:21 'Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour' and interpret as therefore God ''does'' make a vessel unto dishonor. Just because God can, does not mean He does. The rest of scripture tells us what God ''does''. He wills that all be saved 1 Tim 2:4 / He died for all mankind John 3:16.

We can forgive a person for arriving at the belief that God is partial. He is described in scripture as being omniscient and omnipotent. Therefore partiality is an inevitability? No. There is no excuse for a reborn Christian to make such a claim of God. A Christian has grasped God's love. God's goodness. A Christian can like Peter did, grasp that God is impartial Acts 10:34 ''Of a truth I perceive, God is no respecter of persons'.

We need to grasp that God is as good as He is great. This is the message we have heard from the beginning. Calvinism says otherwise.

1 John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.

God ''cannot'' be partial. It is a darkness that does not / cannot exist in Him. Everyone has the ability to repent and make right with God this instant.

I think I'll dig into that a bit deeper. I have little to no use for what I call 'denominationalism' A child of God is a child of God, so why do we separate ourselves from one another?

 

[KingJ]

Partial to the righteous; merciful to the repentant wicked I suspect. In my opinion is all about context and fluidity pertaining the scriptures.

It can be good to punish those that are not good so they may learn, repent,etc.

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Luke 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

At the same time non partial to infractions concerning his word.

Genesis 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

I am not sure what your angle is. I am currently assuming the worse in that you quote Isaiah 45:7 open ended. You think a Christian can / should quote that verse without explanation? Especially in a discussion on Calvinism? Are you a Calvinist?

 

[Ivar]

Partial to the righteous; merciful to the repentant wicked I suspect. In my opinion is all about context and fluidity pertaining the scriptures.

It can be good to punish those that are not good so they may learn, repent,etc.

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Luke 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

At the same time non partial to infractions concerning his word.

Genesis 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

I am not sure what your angle is. I am currently assuming the worse in that you quote Isaiah 45:7 open ended. You think a Christian can / should quote that verse without explanation? Especially in a discussion on Calvinism? Are you a Calvinist?

@KingJ
:shades:
Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

 

[Bendito]

@KingJ
:shades:
Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Interesting how you use that verse to slam others into allowing what you say. Strong meat is true! Strong meat is not fanciful imaginings like a lot of what you push. You hit me with that verse a few times when I challenged what you said.

 

[Christ4Ever]

Okay brothers.
We can ask questions of each other, but let's keep the personal innuendo's to a minimuuu....none.
Someone, has a question, then ask it with courtesy, and the reply should be done in like manner.
After all we are Brothers & Sisters in Christ Jesus. If we treat each other this way, in front of the world, what does that say of us and how we deal with others who are not?

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
<><

 

[Ivar]

Interesting how you use that verse to slam others into allowing what you say. Strong meat is true! Strong meat is not fanciful imaginings like a lot of what you push. You hit me with that verse a few times when I challenged what you said.

@Bendito
Joh 6:60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
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Also just because I you does not mean I cannot others. What is between us should not be monopolized.

Mat 3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
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Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
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Being good may require punishing the bad or visiting the bad with evil.
Any parent or Teacher or Master or Instructor or Sensei or Commander or Lord or any person of Authority should know this.
I cited three scriptures and gave context however the only thing @KingJ seemed to have saw was Isaiah 45:7
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Heb 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Essentially someone who is well versed or mature in scripture and precepts should be able discern what is being said and whether it is good or evil.
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Partial to the righteous; merciful to the repentant wicked I suspect. In my opinion is all about context and fluidity pertaining the scriptures.

It can be good to punish those that are not good so they may learn, repent,etc.

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Luke 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

At the same time non partial to infractions concerning his word.

Genesis 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Essentially since God is good both the light and the dark will be used for good purposes.
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If I cite a scripture showing that God is a jealous God will I be mocked next?
Those of discernment will know the context.
----------------------------------------------------------------
:shades:

 

[Ivar]

Though partial can mean favor; Most of the time it is used in negative connotations so I see that it is not a good word to use. Can be a slippery slope. Better for me to use a plainer more recognizable word such as righteous.

@KingJ
my #2 post should be indication that I am not a Calvinist. First time I've heard of it so sometimes I just cited the dictionary so it can be known the context of what i am saying and why i am saying.

My response to you above was largely due to your words : "I am not sure what your angle is. I am currently assuming the worse in that you quote Isaiah 45:7 open ended. "

1. You say you are not sure angle then you say you are assuming the worst
2. You brought up Isaiah 45:7 but not Luke 18:19, or Genesis 4:7
3. By me quoting Luke 18:19 I saw no need for you to see the worse. It did not seem unreasonable.
4. Lastly it seemed like my angle was dismissed or hard speech
5. So it seemed reasonable for me to use the following verse with a cool emoticon :shades: and leave it that.

Heb 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

 

[Ivar]

Okay brothers.
We can ask questions of each other, but let's keep the personal innuendo's to a minimuuu....none.
Someone, has a question, then ask it with courtesy, and the reply should be done in like manner.
After all we are Brothers & Sisters in Christ Jesus. If we treat each other this way, in front of the world, what does that say of us and how we deal with others who are not?

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
<><

@Christ4Ever
Due to your response I made sure my words were circumcised from #12. Besides your words It helped that I did not see @Bendito words until after my excursion at taco bell and my flesh was satiated. :smile: