Child like faith?

[complete]

Hello again,

The following verses extend this a little, and have a application at the end of the age, but I believe that the 'little child' of Matthew 19, and 'the babes and sucklings' of Matthew 21, are illustrative of those who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. The 'Little child' came to Him, it was the disciples who restrained them, but the Lord rebuked them and received them gladly. They approached Him because they believed in Him, why otherwise would they do so. It is such that come, 'as a little child'. It is not a 'child-like' faith, but faith and trust in Him that is being highlighted by the Lord.

‘And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones
a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple,
verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.’
(Mat. 10:42)

‘But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me,
it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck,
and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. ‘
(Mat.18:6) (Luk.17:2 )

‘Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you,
That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. ‘
(Mat.18:10 )

‘Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven,
that one of these little ones should perish. ‘
(Mat.18:14 )

‘And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me,
it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.’
(Mar.9:42 )

‘Then shall they also answer Him, saying,
“Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst,
or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison,
and did not minister unto thee?”
Then shall He answer them, saying,
“Verily I say unto you,
Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these,
ye did it not to me.”
(Mat 25:44-45)

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Br. Bear]

Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.

Who is this King of glory? The LORD strong and mighty, the LORD mighty in battle.

Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in. Who is this King of glory? The LORD of hosts, He is the King of glory. Selah. Psalm 24:7-10

Greetings again,

If I may address you both, KingJ and Chris, I should like to consider what you have shared here and also bring back the post given by Chris earlier (post #83)

And while I am writing, I am prompted to ask, what of Saul, the persecutor and enemy who would become such a humble and love stained man and Apostle of God and Christ? Who would have ever thought to think such of one so cruel and determined against the Church and Body of Christ, that he, with all his learned skill and deliberation, would be the one who taught so much to those to follow, which includes even us? [As you might see here, in this, the topic and discussion of 'child-like faith' is not a mere skim-over few words randomly thrown together for filling our time with, but one that, if addressed with sincere hearts will bear good fruit, for us and all who care to partake, even if only to inhale some of the sweet and rich aroma.]

I would also like to comment more specifically to you @KingJ regarding what you have written but may do so in a separate post. See how we go.

There are so many verses and passages of Scripture that reference children in regards to our position before the Father.

There are two 'points' I would like to mention first, one being Faith, the other, Kingdom, both of which you have mentioned. keeping in mind the topic of 'child-like'. I am not disputing either of you but would like to go a little further.

Is it correct to say that there is a difference between 'child-like' and simply 'being' (or becoming) a child? I think so. And this is mainly what i have been writing about, here.



Considering the whole 'picture' of the Kingdom of God and the kingdom of Heaven near demands that we consider the status of all children of the 'Kingdom'. There is but one King of Whom we become His Children and with that, we inherit all the rights and obligations of such royal decree.

Regarding Old Testament

What was their concept of the kingdom? Borne of a knowledge of the Old Testament Scriptures.

There are plenty of Scriptural references to the Kingdom, such as,
For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given: and the government shall be upon His shoulder: and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of His government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon His kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. Isaiah 9:6-7 (see also Isaiah 11:1-9)

In all fairness I suggest that such a topic ought be reserved for another thread? One could easily sway from this thread that Dave has started. But enough it is to say that there are very good reasons why the people of the time were knowledgeable and even expecting such a Kingdom to come. Consider also the men from the east who came bearing gifts shortly after the birth of our Saviour. There is no specific mention (that i am presently aware of) that states that they were of the household of God, being of Israel, yet they had been aware of the birth of a King. On that note alone it is something that our King came as a babe, a child before a man.

It is easy to overlook with children that a boy is actually a man-child, a man in the making. So getting back to the topic at hand, we can also see that as children we enter and begin our life as what we refer to as Christians. We mature from babes with milk to children to men of the faith. Our experience is one that takes us through all the stages with precision; our early years are full of the wonder of the glory of God and His tender ways with us; on to the more 'serious' fact that our Father means what He says. At no point, however, will he cease from being a son. We see this also in Jesus, Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever He doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. John 5:19

May I make note that the only requirement given to children in the Letters (Epistles) is that they should obey their parents Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord. Colossians 3:20 I make note of this in the light of our topic here, in that, for all the 'child-like' faith etc we might care to discuss, one might question that this alone is the one and only address to children found in the Epistles of instruction to the Church. Does it speak to us that being child-like is not the principal in our manner, or better put, that while remaining children of the Most High, we are not as such children in the age sense? Does that make sense to you? And so what does it mean, to become as little children or to receive the Kingdom as a little child?

And, regarding Faith, what faith are we to possess or walk by? Is it to be 'child-like'? KingJ, you wrote about the ways of children with fathers (parents). While I shall question too much child psychology as a prerequisite for entering in (in other words, I doubt that the Disciples had to take the words of Jesus and decipher them with any child psychology in mind when He spoke about becoming as little children. I dare to say it was much simpler than that and perhaps rested in their inbuilt knowledge of a coming Kingdom and the simple truth that they were yet to realize that in entering in, one must by the nature of the change wrought by God in each man converted, become a a child of His?

(please note that i appreciate much of what you wrote and there are some things that ought to be underlined and brought more starkly to attention, that you have written)

At Peace (@At Peace ) mentioned the 'age of reason'. (Post #89) Perhaps there is more to this? Of all those who left Egypt, it was only the children and two others who entered in to the promised land. Was this due to adults reasoning too much instead of being as children?

'And they brought young children to Him,
that He should touch them:
and His disciples rebuked those that brought them.
But when Jesus saw it, He was much displeased, and said unto them,
"Suffer the little children to come unto Me,
and forbid them not:
for of such is the kingdom of God.
Verily I say unto you,
Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child,
he shall not enter therein.
And He took them up in His arms,
put His hands upon them, and blessed them.'
(Mark 10:13-16/Luke 18:17)

Hello, @Br Bear,

Thank you for responding to me.
The word, 'child-like' is not used in Scripture I agree. Yet the Lord says in the verses above, 'Verily I say unto you, whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.' This refers to the reception of the kingdom of God.

In Matthew eighteen, at another occasion, the Lord says the following,
'At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus,
saying, "Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"
And Jesus called a little child unto Him,
and set him in the midst of them, and said,
"Verily I say unto you,
except ye be converted,
and become as little children,
ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child,
the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven."'
(Matt.18:1-4)

* Conversion leads to becoming 'as little children' here. Does 'receiving the Kingdom', have the same meaning as being 'converted'? Entry into the kingdom of heaven is consequent on being 'converted' and becoming, 'as little children' in these verses.

The Lord Jesus was talking to the lost sheep of the children house of Israel. To whom He had come. What was their concept of the kingdom? Borne of a knowledge of the Old Testament Scriptures.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

I notice that a new reply has come in while I have been writing this. I shall therefore post now before it gets too far behind!


Bless you ....><>

 

[complete]

Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus prayed this prayer: "O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, thank you for hiding these things from those who think themselves wise and clever, and for revealing them to the childlike.

Blessings to you

Hello @Wired 4 Fishen,

This verse also came to my mind as I thought on the subject of this thread. These words of our Lord, also come in yet another place (Luke 10:17-22, on the return of the seventy, whom the Lord had equipped and sent out to preach the Kingdom of God and to heal those who were sick. They were excitedly telling Him of what had occurred, so full of the wonder of it, and it is with reference to them that those words were spoken. Which makes the Lord's intention in Matthew 11:25 clear I think. The disciples, who believed on Him, and rejoiced in His service were the ones who were referred to as 'babes'. The wise and prudent, were those to whom Matthew 11 was addressed, to the Pharisee, the Priests and Scribes, to whom this knowledge was not given.

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors;
and the King of glory shall come in.
Who is this King of glory?
The LORD strong and mighty, the LORD mighty in battle.
Lift up your heads, O ye gates; even lift them up, ye everlasting doors;
and the King of glory shall come in. Who is this King of glory?
The LORD of hosts, He is the King of glory.
Psalm 24:7-10

Greetings again,

If I may address you both, @KingJ and @Chris, I should like to consider what you have shared here and also bring back the post given by Chris earlier (post #83)

And while I am writing, I am prompted to ask, what of Saul, the persecutor and enemy who would become such a humble and love stained man and Apostle of God and Christ? Who would have ever thought to think such of one so cruel and determined against the Church and Body of Christ, that he, with all his learned skill and deliberation, would be the one who taught so much to those to follow, which includes even us? [As you might see here, in this, the topic and discussion of 'child-like faith' is not a mere skim-over few words randomly thrown together for filling our time with, but one that, if addressed with sincere hearts will bear good fruit, for us and all who care to partake, even if only to inhale some of the sweet and rich aroma.]

I would also like to comment more specifically to you [B]@KingJ[/B] regarding what you have written but may do so in a separate post. See how we go.

There are so many verses and passages of Scripture that reference children in regards to our position before the Father.

There are two 'points' I would like to mention first, one being Faith, the other, Kingdom, both of which you have mentioned. keeping in mind the topic of 'child-like'. I am not disputing either of you but would like to go a little further.

Is it correct to say that there is a difference between 'child-like' and simply 'being' (or becoming) a child? I think so. And this is mainly what i have been writing about, here.

Considering the whole 'picture' of the Kingdom of God and the kingdom of Heaven 'near' demands that we consider the status of all children of the 'Kingdom'. There is but one King of Whom we become His Children and with that, we inherit all the rights and obligations of such royal decree.

Regarding Old Testament

There are plenty of Scriptural references to the Kingdom, such as,
'For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given: and the government shall be upon His shoulder:
and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Of the increase of His government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon His kingdom,
to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever.
The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.
Isaiah 9:6-7 (see also Isaiah 11:1-9)

In all fairness I suggest that such a topic ought to be reserved for another thread?
One could easily sway from this thread that Dave has started. But enough it is to say that there are very good reasons why the people of the time were knowledgeable and even expecting such a Kingdom to come. Consider also the men from the east who came bearing gifts shortly after the birth of our Saviour. There is no specific mention (that i am presently aware of) that states that they were of the household of God, being of Israel, yet they had been aware of the birth of a King. On that note alone it is something that our King came as a babe, a child before a man.

It is easy to overlook with children that a boy is actually a man-child, a man in the making. So getting back to the topic at hand, we can also see that as children we enter and begin our life as what we refer to as Christians. We mature from babes with milk to children to men of the faith. Our experience is one that takes us through all the stages with precision; our early years are full of the wonder of the glory of God and His tender ways with us; on to the more 'serious' fact that our Father means what He says. At no point, however, will he cease from being a son. We see this also in Jesus, Then answered Jesus and said unto them, 'Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever He doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. ' John 5:19

May I make note that the only requirement given to children in the Letters (Epistles) is that they should obey their parents 'Children, obey your parents in all things: for this is well pleasing unto the Lord.' Colossians 3:20 I make note of this in the light of our topic here, in that, for all the 'child-like' faith etc we might care to discuss, one might question that this alone is the one and only address to children found in the Epistles of instruction to the Church. Does it speak to us that being child-like is not the principal in our manner, or better put, that while remaining children of the Most High, we are not as such children in the age sense? Does that make sense to you? And so what does it mean, to become as little children or to receive the Kingdom as a little child?

And, regarding Faith, what faith are we to possess or walk by? Is it to be 'child-like'? @KingJ, you wrote about the ways of children with fathers (parents). While I shall question too much child psychology as a prerequisite for entering in (in other words, I doubt that the Disciples had to take the words of Jesus and decipher them with any child psychology in mind when He spoke about becoming as little children). I dare to say it was much simpler than that and perhaps rested in their inbuilt knowledge of a coming Kingdom and the simple truth that they were yet to realize that in entering in, one must by the nature of the change wrought by God in each man converted, become a a child of His?

(please note that i appreciate much of what you wrote and there are some things that ought to be underlined and brought more starkly to attention, that you have written)

At Peace (@At Peace ) mentioned the 'age of reason'. (Post #89) Perhaps there is more to this? Of all those who left Egypt, it was only the children and two others who entered in to the promised land. Was this due to adults reasoning too much instead of being as children?

@Complete:I notice that a new reply has come in while I have been writing this. I shall therefore post now before it gets too far behind!

Bless you ....><>

Thank you, @Bro. Bear,

* I agree with your thinking regarding the term 'child-like faith', that is is a false assumption.

* I also, like yourself, thought of Numbers14:30-31, in regard to this subject: for the generation who doubted God's Word and believed the word of the 10 spies who sowed doubt among them died in the wilderness: it was their children, with Joshua and Caleb and their families, who entered into the promised land. So also, it was the believing remnant that was the firstfruit unto God of that generation, to whom the Lord Jesus Christ came, who entered into faith in Christ, the nation itself failing to do so (at that time).

* Regarding Matthew 18:2-4:-

And Jesus called a little child unto Him,
and set Him in the midst of them,
And said, "Verily I say unto you,
Except ye be converted, and become as little children,
ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child,
the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven."’

* The emphasis here is on humility isn't it? A childlike humility.
* It was said in response to the disciples question in Matthew 18:1:-

'At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying,
"Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"

* The Lord's answer silences all thought of who would be greatest among them.

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

Thank you, @Bro. Bear,

* I agree with your thinking regarding the term 'child-like faith', that is is a false assumption.

* I also, like yourself, thought of Numbers14:30-31, in regard to this subject: for the generation who doubted God's Word and believed the word of the 10 spies who sowed doubt among them died in the wilderness: it was their children, with Joshua and Caleb and their families, who entered into the promised land. So also, it was the believing remnant that was the firstfruit unto God of that generation, to whom the Lord Jesus Christ came, who entered into faith in Christ, the nation itself failing to do so (at that time).

* Regarding Matthew 18:2-4:-

And Jesus called a little child unto Him,
and set Him in the midst of them,
And said, "Verily I say unto you,
Except ye be converted, and become as little children,
ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child,
the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven."’

* The emphasis here is on humility isn't it? A childlike humility.
* It was said in response to the disciples question in Matthew 18:1:-

'At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying,
"Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"

* The Lord's answer silences all thought of who would be greatest among them.

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

yes, Praise the LORD!

I am reminded (thanks be to God) of Psalm 131
Lord, my heart is not haughty, nor mine eyes lofty: neither do I exercise myself in great matters, or in things too high for me. Surely I have behaved and quieted myself, as a child that is weaned of his mother: my soul is even as a weaned child. Let Israel hope in the LORD from henceforth and for ever.


Bless you ....><>

 

[KingJ]

The faith the Jews in the wilderness needed was 1. Faith in the prophets actually being prophets who hear from God. 2. Faith in the God they were hearing from, being truthful. They obtained 1 and 2 from seeing literal miracles. God using Moses to open the red sea. Daily food and shade. They did not need 'child like faith'. They just needed to ''add''' what they saw with what they were told, to grasp God being literally with them. The word faith was only mentioned because the promised land and visually seeing God were not present / literal realities. It was not a faith that could waver. They died in the desert, not due to a lack of faith, rather sin. Literally, just sin.

It was not / is not 'child like faith' in the slightest. Child like faith for me speaks to 1. the faith only a child can have and 2. As Complete touched on the nature of it.

Just a thought on Matt 18. Why were the children so eager to come to Jesus?

 

[At Peace]

The faith the Jews in the wilderness needed was 1. Faith in the prophets actually being prophets who hear from God. 2. Faith in the God they were hearing from, being truthful. They obtained 1 and 2 from seeing literal miracles. God using Moses to open the red sea. Daily food and shade. They did not need 'child like faith'. They just needed to ''add''' what they saw with what they were told, to grasp God being literally with them. The word faith was only mentioned because the promised land and visually seeing God were not present / literal realities. It was not a faith that could waver. They died in the desert, not due to a lack of faith, rather sin. Literally, just sin.

If they had any faith at all, they would not have sinned.
It is written..."Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul." (Heb 10:38-39)
"Draw back unto perdition" vis-a-vis "live by faith".
Opposing elements, eh?

It was not / is not 'child like faith' in the slightest. Child like faith for me speaks to 1. the faith only a child can have and 2. As Complete touched on the nature of it.
Just a thought on Matt 18. Why were the children so eager to come to Jesus?

I don't see that mentioned in Matt 18.
Perhaps you missited the scrip'?

 

[KingJ]

If they had any faith at all, they would not have sinned.
It is written..."Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

What faith shall the just live by? What faith would stop them from sinning?

I don't see that mentioned in Matt 18.
Perhaps you missited the scrip'?

Matt 18:2 and Matt 19:4. When children were called, they came. There was no debate. They followed / listened / came to Jesus as the disciples did / would / do. As the lady that touched Jesus garment.

The follow up question is what is everyone's thoughts on Matt 18:10 See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.

 

[complete]

What faith shall the just live by? What faith would stop them from sinning?

Matt 18:2 and Matt 19:4. When children were called, they came. There was no debate. They followed / listened / came to Jesus as the disciples did / would / do. As the lady that touched Jesus garment.

The follow up question is what is everyone's thoughts on Matt 18:10 See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.

'Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones;
for I say unto you, that in heaven their angels
do always behold the face of My Father which is in heaven.'
(Mat 18:10)

Hi @KingJ,

Hebrews 1:14 explains this I believe. In regard to angels it says,

'Are they not all ministering spirits,
sent forth to minister
for them who shall be heirs of salvation?'
(Heb 1:14)

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[KingJ]

'Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones;
for I say unto you, that in heaven their angels
do always behold the face of My Father which is in heaven.'
(Mat 18:10)

Hi @KingJ,

Hebrews 1:14 explains this I believe. In regard to angels it says,

'Are they not all ministering spirits,
sent forth to minister
for them who shall be heirs of salvation?'
(Heb 1:14)

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Correct me if I am wrong. I interpret ministering spirits as ministering to God. Not as Jesus does. Jesus defends us before God. The Holy Spirit teaches and comforts. The devil accuses. The angels give 'feedback'. ''Did you see what 'Ethan' did today? So cute. Innocence is so precious. All glory to you God''.

Now I think it works both ways. God wants to discuss us with the angel in question. He looks forward to discussing children with the angels. Hence the angels representing children are often with God with something to discuss.

How do we become as that child that God can't hear enough of? How often do the angels representing us spend before God? So, angel, what did ''Complete'' do today? Is that a five second discussion, a 1 hour discussion or longer? :wink:

 

[complete]

Correct me if I am wrong. I interpret ministering spirits as ministering to God. Not as Jesus does. Jesus defends us before God. The Holy Spirit teaches and comforts. The devil accuses. The angels give 'feedback'. ''Did you see what 'Ethan' did today? So cute. Innocence is so precious. All glory to you God''.

Now I think it works both ways. God wants to discuss us with the angel in question. He looks forward to discussing children with the angels. Hence the angels representing children are often with God with something to discuss.

How do we become as that child that God can't hear enough of? How often do the angels representing us spend before God? So, angel, what did ''Complete'' do today? Is that a five second discussion, a 1 hour discussion or longer? :wink:

@KingJ: 'How do we become as that child that God can't hear enough of? How often do the angels representing us spend before God? So, angel, what did ''Complete'' do today? Is that a five second discussion, a 1 hour discussion or longer?'

Hello there,

Oh dear! That's a bit alarming in a way. I hope the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart are acceptable in the sight of my Strength and my Redeemer.

* The children here are 'believing children' whatever their age aren't they, 'heirs of salvation'?
* Angels are very much associated with Israel in the Word of God.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[KingJ]

* The children here are 'believing children' whatever their age aren't they, 'heirs of salvation'?
* Angels are very much associated with Israel in the Word of God.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

I wouldn't say Heb 1:14 applies to children. ''Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?''

'Those who will' speaks to the 'whomsoever' accept Jesus John 3:16. They, inherit salvation.

Rev 20:3 speaks to children / all those not yet properly tested. God is impartial. Children can only qualify for salvation if they stay children. They won't. So they do, like the rest of us need to be tested when they come of age.

Matt 18:10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, that in heaven their angels do always behold the face of My Father which is in heaven. If we just read this 'as is'. It is saying that the angels of the children spend more time (always?) in God's presence.

 

[At Peace]

What faith shall the just live by? What faith would stop them from sinning?

Faith that God's word was true.
He said they would receive a new land, but they wanted something else...things of the flesh: so to speak. They didn't believe God would give them drink or food or guidance.
But He did.

Matt 18:2 and Matt 19:4. When children were called, they came. There was no debate. They followed / listened / came to Jesus as the disciples did / would / do. As the lady that touched Jesus garment.

The follow up question is what is everyone's thoughts on Matt 18:10 See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.

Don't despise the faithful.

 

[Born Again 2004]

I have 3 grandsons, 12, 10 and 4. Just like my two boys once had, they all have this "child like faith". If Jesus appeared to them today, they would flock to him. They might not understand it but they would too have this deep trust in him and be drawn to him like magic. Yet they would have sin....how many kids, though we mainly excuse it at this age, how many possess a child like selfishness, a (self-centered)...me, me, me, their constant "melt-downs" ! Yet, Jesus praised them for their faith in him for it's simplicity and in it's purest form....not their apparent sin.,,,so I reject the thought that to have faith is to to be sinless.....I think it is the exact opposite....despite our sin, we can still have a child like faith in Jesus. Though I am not perfect, I can honestly say I have this type of faith:....a faith based on even more......believing and yet not seeing!

 

[At Peace]

I have 3 grandsons, 12, 10 and 4. Just like my two boys once had, they all have this "child like faith". If Jesus appeared to them today, they would flock to him. They might not understand it but they would too have this deep trust in him and be drawn to him like magic. Yet they would have sin....how many kids, though we mainly excuse it at this age, how many possess a child like selfishness, a (self-centered)...me, me, me, their constant "melt-downs" ! Yet, Jesus praised them for their faith in him for it's simplicity and in it's purest form....not their apparent sin.,,,so I reject the thought that to have faith is to to be sinless.....I think it is the exact opposite....despite our sin, we can still have a child like faith in Jesus. Though I am not perfect, I can honestly say I have this type of faith:....a faith based on even more......believing and yet not seeing!

If we have faith, we will believe script's like 1 Cor 10:13..."There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it."
With faith, we look for the escapes.
And Gal 5:24..."And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts."
And 1 Peter 4:1-2..."Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God."
Lots of others too, that speak of our freedom from sin.
Praise be to God!

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings,

The faith the Jews in the wilderness needed was 1. Faith in the prophets actually being prophets who hear from God. 2. Faith in the God they were hearing from, being truthful. They obtained 1 and 2 from seeing literal miracles. God using Moses to open the red sea. Daily food and shade. They did not need 'child like faith'. They just needed to ''add''' what they saw with what they were told, to grasp God being literally with them. The word faith was only mentioned because the promised land and visually seeing God were not present / literal realities. It was not a faith that could waver. They died in the desert, not due to a lack of faith, rather sin. Literally, just sin.

It was not / is not 'child like faith' in the slightest. Child like faith for me speaks to 1. the faith only a child can have and 2. As Complete touched on the nature of it.

Just a thought on Matt 18. Why were the children so eager to come to Jesus?

May I suggest that the faith you mention that the Jews in the wilderness needed was the same faith we all need, for without it it is impossible to please God*... and that faith is to believe Him, to believe what He has said, to believe His Word, take Him at His Word, for what He has spoken will come to pass.
This is where those in the wilderness went wrong.

A bit like, I believe, help my unbelief**...
I believe in God, but i need help in believing what He has promised, His Word. Of course I believe totally in the fact that God exists. He has proven that to me/us. But believing anything other than what I now see with my natural eyes? Help Lord! Where does that help come from? The LORD.
He is our helper.... we simply have to believe it!
So, those in the wilderness doubted what God had promised. They did not doubt God's existence, how could they?
That is what faith is about.


Bless you ....><>

*Hebrews 11:6
**Mark 9:24

 

[Br. Bear]

Only the children (and two others) entered in.
We must become like children. How can we? We have grown and set our ways? How can a man become a child?
We reason as men, we think as men, we know that children are not mature and need adults in order to survive.
So, add the fact that we are already men to the seeming backward move of being a child once more... even if we could, we can't... it's impossible to re-enter our mother's womb!!!
Perhaps we can attempt to rearrange our thinking so we appear as children so we can get in?
Surely we can avoid the same mistake the adults in the wilderness made?!
That's probably what was meant. Forget about everything you see and pretend you are a child and walk on in. Eeeek! they talk about faith! You'd need some mountain moving sort of faith to do that... the giants would have us for breakfast!
There must be another way?
How can a man be born again?

 

[complete]

Only the children (and two others) entered in.
We must become like children. How can we? We have grown and set our ways? How can a man become a child?
We reason as men, we think as men, we know that children are not mature and need adults in order to survive.
So, add the fact that we are already men to the seeming backward move of being a child once more... even if we could, we can't... it's impossible to re-enter our mother's womb!!!
Perhaps we can attempt to rearrange our thinking so we appear as children so we can get in?
Surely we can avoid the same mistake the adults in the wilderness made?!
That's probably what was meant. Forget about everything you see and pretend you are a child and walk on in. Eeeek! they talk about faith! You'd need some mountain moving sort of faith to do that... the giants would have us for breakfast!
There must be another way?
How can a man be born again?

Hello @Br. Bear,

Simply believing on the Lord Jesus Christ as our Saviour and Lord is enough to receive life through His Name, isn't it? We are then born from above by God's grace.

I personally recognized that I was a sinner, and needed a Saviour. Praise God! I also believed that God had provided a Saviour, in the person of His own Beloved Son, who had taken the penalty of my sin upon Himself and died in my place, in order that I might have life through His Name. That was sufficient for God, and for me.

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Br. Bear]

Greetings Chris,

Yes, praise The LORD

May I ask you a couple of questions, please?
Did you first become as a little child and then work those things out or come to realize them?
Was repentance a part of that process and again, as a little child (or, to keep in mind the topic of this thread, with child like faith)?

Thank you for sharing about this.


Bless you ....><>

Praise ye the LORD. Praise the LORD, O my soul.
Psalm 146:1

 

[KingJ]

Greetings,

May I suggest that the faith you mention that the Jews in the wilderness needed was the same faith we all need, for without it it is impossible to please God*... and that faith is to believe Him, to believe what He has said, to believe His Word, take Him at His Word, for what He has spoken will come to pass.
This is where those in the wilderness went wrong.

A bit like, I believe, help my unbelief**...
I believe in God, but i need help in believing what He has promised, His Word. Of course I believe totally in the fact that God exists. He has proven that to me/us. But believing anything other than what I now see with my natural eyes? Help Lord! Where does that help come from? The LORD.
He is our helper.... we simply have to believe it!
So, those in the wilderness doubted what God had promised. They did not doubt God's existence, how could they?
That is what faith is about.


Bless you ....><>

*Hebrews 11:6
**Mark 9:24

I think your argument is logical. Faith that God's promises will come to pass is what we all need. That is faith in God being good, true and committed to us.

I do see many Jews losing this. I wouldn't say it is because of that, that they sinned though. They sinned because they loved what is wicked. I would say it was 'more' a case of, they lost hope because they sinned. Not sinned, because they lost hope.

Thinking so much on the Hebrews in the wilderness has helped me better grasp that God wanted a people He could work with in the promised land. Those Hebrews who died in the desert, He just couldn't work with them. They were just too easily corrupted. Not sufficient backbone and commitment to God. He tried them, they failed. It makes me think a lot of us today. A Christian should be able to 'hang on' to God and Christianity despite whatever uncomfortable situation they are in.