Mat_22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

[spirit1st]

We are All called ! Then tested and tried!
We must be willing to follow Only Him and obey Him !
He wants a relationship with us and the very best for us !

He thinks first for our eternal life ! Then rewards awaiting us ! then the things of the flesh !

1Th_2:4 But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts.

1Pe_1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

Joh_10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

The Holy Ghost is willing and waiting to teach each of GOD children !

I believe many will be left at the Catching away ! Because they are following religions , pastors , popes or others ?

I believe in going to church ! But only followimng our LORD JESUS! We can work for our LORD in churches or other places . But It must be for our Lord ! And we must seek His approval !

this is just my thinking by the scriptures ! I do not mind if you disagree!

We must all stand alone with our LORD one day ! We will not be able to say He told me or I was following Him or HER! God bless All who Love our LORD JESUS and want to obey and work for HIM !

2Co_6:15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
1Ti_5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

He expects us to take care of our own families first!

 

[james1523]

Actually according to the bible there's nothing wrong with following another person as long as they are following Christ themselves:
1 Cor 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

So if your pastor is following Christ, then there is nothing wrong with following them. We can follow Christ through another person in other words.. we are not following the person we are following Christ in that person, if that makes sense.

To put this in symbolic terms.. Christ is the Head of the Body,, but we know that the fingers are joined to the hand which is joined to the arm, shoulder.. chest.. neck, and then the head. So some parts of the body are joined to the head via other parts.. the hand is not joined directly to the head etc. So in a way following Christ by following others ( and it doesn't have to be your pastor, it can be anyone who is following Christ in your church), is not really a problem.

 

[spirit1st]

Our Father God wants to teach each of Us and lead each of His Holy children ! I doubt there are many Pauls if any on the earth !

I can only give my testimony !
I came home from church when new in the LORD!
The Lord ask me ? who is the most righteous in the church ? I said ? The Pastor LORD! He said / He no different than you ! I said ? But LORD , He your shepherd ! He Said ? I am the Shepherd , You going to Follow Me or Him ? I said ? You Lord ! He said DO IT THEN ! Not very nice1 It scared me so bad ! Since then ? I only Follow My LORD JESUS , learning from the Holy Ghost !


I Listen to preachers all the time! but do not accept anything , Until I know it confirmed by the HOLY GHOST! Lots of things sound good ? but are not always Truth !

Act_17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
These guys knew , Paul was a great man of God , They saw the miracles and suffering of Paul for our LORD Glory !
Yet did not accept it all !Until they studyed the scriptures them selves!

God called them More Noble! I see this as Good ! After all ? We All want to be Pleasing in our Fathers Eyes !

 

[will]

So if your pastor is following Christ, then there is nothing wrong with following them. We can follow Christ through another person in other words.. we are not following the person we are following Christ in that person, if that makes sense.

Brother James,
As I understand the Scriptures, we are all called to grow in the Spirit. Those who are already ahead of us (approaching maturity) in Spiritual growth should eagerly want us to experience the growth also. And they would show it through their teachings, reliance upon God, and real life actions. This is the fulfillment of the Great Commission in them. But we follow the Lord, through the enabling by The Holy Spirit, not through any men or women.

 

[james1523]

Brother James,
As I understand the Scriptures, we are all called to grow in the Spirit. Those who are already ahead of us (approaching maturity) in Spiritual growth should eagerly want us to experience the growth also. And they would show it through their teachings, reliance upon God, and real life actions. This is the fulfillment of the Great Commission in them. But we follow the Lord, through the enabling by The Holy Spirit, not through any men or women.

That's not strictly true. How do you expect to grow if not connected to the body? Which scripture in the New Testament do you read and follow? Whenever we read and follow the letters written by Paul, we are following the Lord through following Paul.
Paul exhorts us in a number of places to follow him:
See See 1Cor 11:1; 1Cor 4:16; Phil 3:17; 1Thess 1:6; and 2 Thes 3:7, 9.

Today we can follow Christ by following Paul by reading the New Testament. But Paul is not the only servant of Christ. There are 'fathers' in your local church, maybe an elder, maybe a pastor.
We can grow in the Spirit by following those who are following Christ. If we are attending church as individuals and not connected to others then we are not growing in the body but apart from the body. Any part your body cannot grow by itself, it needs others.

We need to understand that the Spirit does not only operate by our personal relationship with God, but also through the other members of the body in your local church.
Following the Lord by following others is not against Scripture, but sadly is foreign to many individualistic and self-focussed Christians and churches/denominations.

To give an example, there may be a very spiritual person who spends 3 hours a day in prayer.. but in church they cannot accept the teaching or spiritual advice from any pastor, or any man, and only what "God told them so" is right. This is not a spiritual person this is an individual person who is in themselves. In the book of Acts we see that corporate fellowship was a key part of their ministry and calling. Even the apostle Paul when He received revelation of the gospel went to fellowship with others, not remain an individual person in their individual walk with Christ.

A child grows mainly by observing, watching and copying their parents. Similarly we can all grow spiritually by observing, watching and copying our spiritual parents.

 

[will]

That's not strictly true. How do you expect to grow if not connected to the body? Which scripture in the New Testament do you read and follow? Whenever we read and follow the letters written by Paul, we are following the Lord through following Paul.
Paul exhorts us in a number of places to follow him:
See See 1Cor 11:1; 1Cor 4:16; Phil 3:17; 1Thess 1:6; and 2 Thes 3:7, 9.

Today we can follow Christ by following Paul by reading the New Testament. But Paul is not the only servant of Christ. There are 'fathers' in your local church, maybe an elder, maybe a pastor.
We can grow in the Spirit by following those who are following Christ. If we are attending church as individuals and not connected to others then we are not growing in the body but apart from the body. Any part your body cannot grow by itself, it needs others.

We need to understand that the Spirit does not only operate by our personal relationship with God, but also through the other members of the body in your local church.
Following the Lord by following others is not against Scripture, but sadly is foreign to many individualistic and self-focussed Christians and churches/denominations.

To give an example, there may be a very spiritual person who spends 3 hours a day in prayer.. but in church they cannot accept the teaching or spiritual advice from any pastor, or any man, and only what "God told them so" is right. This is not a spiritual person this is an individual person who is in themselves. In the book of Acts we see that corporate fellowship was a key part of their ministry and calling. Even the apostle Paul when He received revelation of the gospel went to fellowship with others, not remain an individual person in their individual walk with Christ.

A child grows mainly by observing, watching and copying their parents. Similarly we can all grow spiritually by observing, watching and copying our spiritual parents.

Of course, we ought to connect and learn from one another.
I wasn't implying otherwise.

But our relationship with others within the Church is that of fellow disciples of Christ.
We are never to become a disciple of other man or woman, no matter how mature they are.

Saying that we follow Christ through following another person is not correct, if we use the same sense as when the Lord says "Follow me." (Matthew 4:19, in which He used the word: 'opiso', meaning to follow as in going wherever He goes).

The apostle Paul said "imitate me" (mimetai in Greek, as in to mimic someone) points to the fact that he also imitate Christ's example (the context is doing everything to the Glory of God). Absolutely cannot be taken to mean: "Follow me." as when the Lord said that.

 

[spirit1st]

WE can reveal the scriptures ! Hopefully we were Taught by the HOLY GHOST ?

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Act_17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

1Co_2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

1Co_2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1Co_2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

Listen God Wants to Teach each of His children ! Just as We want to teach our children !

We have so many religions , because people are teaching people and it causes great divisions and many false teachings !
Many church even hate other churches ? i heard many times in church , them talking bad about other churches !

Because each type church thinks they are the perfect one or the closest to perfection ! that a lie of course!

The true church is unseen ! Raised up by Jesus Christ though the power of the HOLY GHOST !

I heard lots of people say they follow there pastor over even the bible or there religion over everything !

The pastor is no different than anyone else in the true church ! vHe not perfect outwardly and never will be while in this weak flesh ! He too is subject to sin in His life ! Many church have parted and been even destroyed . Because of the pastor caught doing evil !


I Believe we only follow our LORD JESUS and should be taught as much as possible by the Holy Ghost and not mankind!

We should not take any persons word as perfect truth ! Until we know from the Spirit of truth it is perfect truth ! This does upset some?

I heard the pastor where I go say Everyone Must think just like Him ! Or we will not be in unity!

He Not who I follow , nor is He the being I gave my life and All I have too ! I belong to only jesus !

Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Just because GOD gives us a anointing for a job ! It does not make us More than others or wiser or have greater understand or have more of the POWER of GOD in our lives !
Each job has in that spirit being the anointing they need ! But He can use any of us at any time He wants ?

 

[spirit1st]

1Co_3:2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
Heb_5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
Heb_5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
1Pe_2:2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

 

[james1523]

Of course, we ought to connect and learn from one another.
I wasn't implying otherwise.

But our relationship with others within the Church is that of fellow disciples of Christ.
We are never to become a disciple of other man or woman, no matter how mature they are.

Saying that we follow Christ through following another person is not correct, if we use the same sense as when the Lord says "Follow me." (Matthew 4:19, in which He used the word: 'opiso', meaning to follow as in going wherever He goes).

The apostle Paul said "imitate me" (mimetai in Greek, as in to mimic someone) points to the fact that he also imitate Christ's example (the context is doing everything to the Glory of God). Absolutely cannot be taken to mean: "Follow me." as when the Lord said that.

I agree with you entirely and am not disagreeing, I am just throwing in some extra details. God has always worked through his representatives on Earth. The lesson we can learn from from Paul's conversion experience is that Christians are Christ on Earth, they are His body. If persecuting a Christian is persecuting Christ, then following a Christian is following Christ. It's that simple. So we should be more careful to represent Christ in our daily lives, particularly to unbelievers so they may be saved, but also to believers so they may grow. God has always worked by the principle of working through his representatives on earth. Imitate and follow essentially means the same thing. To follow Christ is to imitate Christ. Paul said imitate him as He imitates Christ.
If we follow those who are conformed to the image of Christ then we are following Christ. We are following Christ in them, we are not following the person themselves.
Most Christians follow Christ by reading the writings of Paul, or John or James and then live that out in their daily life. Essentially they are following Christ by following men. If we follow God by following men in the bible, I'm not sure why we cannot follow God by following godly men in our local church.

 

[james1523]

WE can reveal the scriptures ! Hopefully we were Taught by the HOLY GHOST ?

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

Act_17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

1Co_2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

1Co_2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1Co_2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

Listen God Wants to Teach each of His children ! Just as We want to teach our children !

We have so many religions , because people are teaching people and it causes great divisions and many false teachings !
Many church even hate other churches ? i heard many times in church , them talking bad about other churches !

Because each type church thinks they are the perfect one or the closest to perfection ! that a lie of course!

The true church is unseen ! Raised up by Jesus Christ though the power of the HOLY GHOST !

I heard lots of people say they follow there pastor over even the bible or there religion over everything !

The pastor is no different than anyone else in the true church ! vHe not perfect outwardly and never will be while in this weak flesh ! He too is subject to sin in His life ! Many church have parted and been even destroyed . Because of the pastor caught doing evil !


I Believe we only follow our LORD JESUS and should be taught as much as possible by the Holy Ghost and not mankind!

We should not take any persons word as perfect truth ! Until we know from the Spirit of truth it is perfect truth ! This does upset some?

I heard the pastor where I go say Everyone Must think just like Him ! Or we will not be in unity!

He Not who I follow , nor is He the being I gave my life and All I have too ! I belong to only jesus !

Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Just because GOD gives us a anointing for a job ! It does not make us More than others or wiser or have greater understand or have more of the POWER of GOD in our lives !
Each job has in that spirit being the anointing they need ! But He can use any of us at any time He wants ?

Being taught by and following God directly and being taught by and following God indirectly (through following others) are not mutually exclusive. We need both. Having one without the other is not ideal.
The Bereans searched the scriptures to confirm Paul's words. But they did not exclude Paul's teaching and did not say "sorry Paul, we don't need you, we have the Scriptures and will be taught by God directly". This is the attitude of some today. It is probably negative experiences of pastors and teachers that lead to this thinking.
I understand that the existence of false teachers and preachers has led many to discount the teaching of men altogether. The Roman Catholic system largely stifled man's personal relationship with God, and things were done through a priest or other man, but Protestantism has gone to the other extreme: individualism, where each man is an 'island', so to speak.

To experience genuine spiritual growth we need a private relationship with God but also we need a corporate relationship with God through other members of the body of Christ. To illustrate this..parts of our body move only when the other part moves first. E.g. our hand cannot reach a cup unless the arm moves first. In this sense, we have a relationship with God through another member of the body, and we follow other members of the body in order to do the will of the Head.

The situation today, and in the early church, was not everyone had a copy of the bible. So it became necessary to be imitators of others , who could be examples for us. e.g. I may not be able to read in the bible that I should give to the poor.. but if I see a Christian brother or elder giving to the poor.. I may copy them and do what God requires. In this sense I am following God by following others.

Christians are not meant to be light on the Earth just to look pretty, but so that others may see the light and follow it.

 

[will]

I agree with you entirely and am not disagreeing, I am just throwing in some extra details. God has always worked through his representatives on Earth. The lesson we can learn from from Paul's conversion experience is that Christians are Christ on Earth, they are His body. If persecuting a Christian is persecuting Christ, then following a Christian is following Christ. It's that simple. So we should be more careful to represent Christ in our daily lives, particularly to unbelievers so they may be saved, but also to believers so they may grow. God has always worked by the principle of working through his representatives on earth. Imitate and follow essentially means the same thing. To follow Christ is to imitate Christ. Paul said imitate him as He imitates Christ.
If we follow those who are conformed to the image of Christ then we are following Christ. We are following Christ in them, we are not following the person themselves.
Most Christians follow Christ by reading the writings of Paul, or John or James and then live that out in their daily life. Essentially they are following Christ by following men. If we follow God by following men in the bible, I'm not sure why we cannot follow God by following godly men in our local church.

James,
That is why I differentiate the two distinct meaning of the English word "follow."
If you mean "follow" as imitate, or to follow someone's example, then I agree with you and the apostle Paul.

But "follow" also has another (arguably stronger or more common) connotation, that is "to become someone's follower."
The danger in applying this particular connotation of the word "follow" to a person other than our Lord Jesus Christ, is that we start to idolize and "worship" this individual. Please don't tell me you have not seen this in practice, when a particular pastor or teacher or bishop, or whatever became more influential in a believer's mind than the Scriptures and the Holy Spirit.

This is part of the problem we face today and it is real. Many Christians today do not have any confidence in the Scriptures because they never had the correct understanding of what it means to grow Spiritually. Most rely on other people to interpret the Scriptures, then they argue about whose interpretation is right or wrong. That is the wrong kind of "following" another believer.

I hope I made my case clearer, I have no intention to appear argumentative.
You are my brother in Christ and I respect you as such.

 

[james1523]

James,
That is why I differentiate the two distinct meaning of the English word "follow."
If you mean "follow" as imitate, or to follow someone's example, then I agree with you and the apostle Paul.

But "follow" also has another (arguably stronger or more common) connotation, that is "to become someone's follower."
The danger in applying this particular connotation of the word "follow" to a person other than our Lord Jesus Christ, is that we start to idolize and "worship" this individual. Please don't tell me you have not seen this in practice, when a particular pastor or teacher or bishop, or whatever became more influential in a believer's mind than the Scriptures and the Holy Spirit.

This is part of the problem we face today and it is real. Many Christians today do not have any confidence in the Scriptures because they never had the correct understanding of what it means to grow Spiritually. Most rely on other people to interpret the Scriptures, then they argue about whose interpretation is right or wrong. That is the wrong kind of "following" another believer.

I hope I made my case clearer, I have no intention to appear argumentative.
You are my brother in Christ and I respect you as such.

Amen! :coocoo:

 

[DHC]

1 John 2:27
As for you, the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you;
but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him.

John 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your
remembrance all that I said to you.

 

[james1523]

1 Cor 11:23 For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: The Lord Jesus, on the night he was betrayed, took bread,

1 Cor 11:2 I am so glad that you always keep me in your thoughts, and that you are following the teachings I passed on to you.

2 Thess 2:15 So then, brothers and sisters, stand firm and hold fast to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter.

2 Thess 3:6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers and sisters, to keep away from every believer who is idle and disruptive and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.

Acts 8:31 The man replied, "How can I, unless someone instructs me?" And he urged Philip to come up into the carriage and sit with him.

Eph 4:11 So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers,

 

[VitorA]

Hello All, Grace and Peace!


Vitor am, I'm new here on the forum and would like to participate!


I entered this topic because I like him in particular belong to a Church Name: Church of the Elect, so I like the theme and want to give my opinion!


Many are called but few are chosen, said Jesus!


When the call happens?


When we are chosen?


I think it is easier to understand both the election and called!


Scripture shows us that we were chosen before the foundation of the world, but we are called through the preaching of the Gospel!


What is the biggest, the election or the call?

 

[love_yeshua]

"Many are called but few are chosen" is a sobering thought. It means a very small percentage of the world is actually going to be saved. A lot of people nowadays think everybody will go to "heaven" or "a better place" when they die. That is not the reality if you check the Bible. The reality is, most people are not going to make it. If we accept that fact instead of fooling ourselves. we will be better positioned to get serious and actually make it to the Kingdom.

 

[VitorA]

Hello love yeshua Peace!
The Gospel of Christ is too glorious to be aceiter lightly.


It is necessary that the person gives value to the words of God as seriously important and not accept everything as God's word, just because someone speaks well and looks good!


Jesus said: What is the fruit that we know the true Christian.


Neither miracles nor prophecy or expel demons that shows that we are of God, nor the appearance of sheep (good works)!


The kingdom of God is spiritual, the Christians are in the spirit and the fruits that Jesus spoke, is spiritual!


These are the fruits of the Elect!

Remembering without ceasing your work of faith and labor of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, before our God and Father,
Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God;


1 Thessalonians 1:3-4

 

[amadeus2]

Both Saul and David were called by God and both were chosen to anointed as kings over Israel. Of the two, only David was faithful to the end.

"These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful." Rev 7:14

 

[spirit1st]

Rev_7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

I believe there will be millions in heaven [the Elect] Because Salvation is a Free Gift and not how little we sin here. If it was not a FREE GIFT? Who could have eternal life?
No one on earth lives a perfect life in the flesh . The difference is we try Hard Not to sin. where most could care less.

Because in the flesh we are all sinners.
2Co_10:12 For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise.


What we need to do is just try to help others over come. Never neat others down , They are already being attacked by demons all the time. People judging them and telling them they are too unworthy or demons put thoughts in there minds to bring them down or make them think they cannot live perfect lives , why try ?

We tell them it worth trying and they should ask the :LORD to help them , He Really Love them .