Pristine

[NetChaplain]

Regeneration is not a change of the old Adamic life, but the introduction of a new; it is the implantation of the life of the Last Adam. This is by the operation of the Holy Spirit, founded upon the accomplished redemption of Christ and in full keeping with the sovereign will or counsel of the Father. The moment a sinner receives the Savior by faith, he becomes the possessor of a new life, a totally new creation—and the source of that life is the Lord Jesus; he is born of God and His child for all eternity.

Nor does the introduction of this new life alter, in the slightest degree, the true, essential character of the old. This latter continues what it is and is made in no respect better; yes, rather, there is the full display of its evil character in opposition to the new creation. “The flesh lusteth against the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another so that ye cannot do the things ye would” (Gal 5:17). There they are in all their distinctness and the one is only thrown into relief by the other.

I believe this doctrine of the two natures in the believer is not generally understood; and yet, so long as there is ignorance of it, the mind must be utterly at sea in reference to the true standing and privileges of the child of God. Some there are who think that regeneration is a certain change which the old Adamic life undergoes; and moreover, that this change is gradual in its operation, until, at length, the whole man becomes transformed. Wesleyan, Arminianism is the general source of this teaching today.

That this idea is unsound can be proved by various quotations from the New Testament. For example, “The carnal mind is enmity against God.” How can that which is thus spoken of ever undergo any improvement? The Apostle goes on to say, “It is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.” If it cannot be subject to the law of God, how can it be improved, how can it undergo any change? Again, “That which is born of the flesh is flesh.” Do what you will with flesh and it is flesh all the while.

Paul does not say, Ye have improved, or are seeking to improve, “the old man,” but rather, “Ye have put off the old man” (Col 3:9). Passages might easily be multiplied to prove the unsoundness of the theory with respect to the gradual improvement of the old mam—to prove that the old man is dead in sins and utterly un-renewable; and moreover, that the only thing we can do with it is to keep it under our feet by reckoning upon the death and new life that we have in union with our risen Head in the heavens.

If present or future blessedness were made to depend upon even a divine change wrought in nature, flesh would glory. But when I am introduced into a new creation, I find it is all of God—designed, matured and developed by the Father Himself—He is the Giver and I am the receiver.

This is what makes Christianity what it is; and moreover, distinguishes it from every system of human religion under the sun, whether it be Romanism, or Protestantism, or any other ism whatsoever. Human religion gives the creature a place, more or less; it keeps the bondwoman and her son in the house; it gives man something to glory in. On the contrary, Christianity excludes the creature from all interference in the work of salvation, casts out the bondwomen and her son and gives all the glory to Him in Whom alone it is due. –C H Mackintosh

 

[james1523]

Regeneration is not a change of the old Adamic life, but the introduction of a new; it is the implantation of the life of the Last Adam. This is by the operation of the Holy Spirit, founded upon the accomplished redemption of Christ and in full keeping with the sovereign will or counsel of the Father. The moment a sinner receives the Savior by faith, he becomes the possessor of a new life, a totally new creation—and the source of that life is the Lord Jesus; he is born of God and His child for all eternity.

Nor does the introduction of this new life alter, in the slightest degree, the true, essential character of the old. This latter continues what it is and is made in no respect better; yes, rather, there is the full display of its evil character in opposition to the new creation. “The flesh lusteth against the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another so that ye cannot do the things ye would” (Gal 5:17). There they are in all their distinctness and the one is only thrown into relief by the other.

I believe this doctrine of the two natures in the believer is not generally understood; and yet, so long as there is ignorance of it, the mind must be utterly at sea in reference to the true standing and privileges of the child of God. Some there are who think that regeneration is a certain change which the old Adamic life undergoes; and moreover, that this change is gradual in its operation, until, at length, the whole man becomes transformed. Wesleyan, Arminianism is the general source of this teaching today.

That this idea is unsound can be proved by various quotations from the New Testament. For example, “The carnal mind is enmity against God.” How can that which is thus spoken of ever undergo any improvement? The Apostle goes on to say, “It is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.” If it cannot be subject to the law of God, how can it be improved, how can it undergo any change? Again, “That which is born of the flesh is flesh.” Do what you will with flesh and it is flesh all the while.

Paul does not say, Ye have improved, or are seeking to improve, “the old man,” but rather, “Ye have put off the old man” (Col 3:9). Passages might easily be multiplied to prove the unsoundness of the theory with respect to the gradual improvement of the old mam—to prove that the old man is dead in sins and utterly un-renewable; and moreover, that the only thing we can do with it is to keep it under our feet by reckoning upon the death and new life that we have in union with our risen Head in the heavens.

If present or future blessedness were made to depend upon even a divine change wrought in nature, flesh would glory. But when I am introduced into a new creation, I find it is all of God—designed, matured and developed by the Father Himself—He is the Giver and I am the receiver.

This is what makes Christianity what it is; and moreover, distinguishes it from every system of human religion under the sun, whether it be Romanism, or Protestantism, or any other ism whatsoever. Human religion gives the creature a place, more or less; it keeps the bondwoman and her son in the house; it gives man something to glory in. On the contrary, Christianity excludes the creature from all interference in the work of salvation, casts out the bondwomen and her son and gives all the glory to Him in Whom alone it is due. –C H Mackintosh

Amen. The old man is the fallen self. It is the "I" which has been crucified with Christ. The new man is "Christ in us" the hope of glory. It is Christ and us together as one.
The 'old man' is the independent self (soul) separated from Christ, the 'new man' is the soul dependent upon Christ.
There is a change which takes place in the soul and this is from a carnal mind at enmity towards God, being changed into the 'mind of Christ'.

The soul is the middle ground between God and the fallen natural life (carnality).

 

[NetChaplain]

Amen. The old man is the fallen self. It is the "I" which has been crucified with Christ. The new man is "Christ in us" the hope of glory. It is Christ and us together as one.
The 'old man' is the independent self (soul) separated from Christ, the 'new man' is the soul dependent upon Christ.
There is a change which takes place in the soul and this is from a carnal mind at enmity towards God, being changed into the 'mind of Christ'.

The soul is the middle ground between God and the fallen natural life (carnality).

Hi James and God's blessings to your Family! Your comment contains the right script, but my placement of the characters aren't quite the same as yours.

I see it that the soul and spirit are nearly the same, as the soul (the thought element) and the spirit make up the individual or person. The soul and spirit are influenced by another element, the original nature, which is "the old man" and the body reacts to the decisions of the individual. The believer is influenced (tested), but not controlled by the old nature, because it is the "new man" (new nature) in the hands of the Spirit that controls him (Gal 5:17). The old self or old nature isn't considered fallen because it's not a person but a nature, which has never been elevated. It (old nature) cannot change (Rom 8:7) but our mind (soul - Rom 8:6; 1 Cor 2:16) does, by way of the new man, which isn't Christ but is a nature from Him--Col 3:10; and is how we are "partakers of the (His) divine nature" (2 Pet 1:4).

I do not want you to consider my reply as a contention of your reply (not that I'm accusing you), but as one just sharing his opinions in fellowship with you.

 

[DHC]

Regeneration is not a change of the old Adamic life, but the introduction of a new; it is the implantation of the life of the Last Adam. This is by the operation of the Holy Spirit, founded upon the accomplished redemption of Christ and in full keeping with the sovereign will or counsel of the Father. The moment a sinner receives the Savior by faith, he becomes the possessor of a new life, a totally new creation—and the source of that life is the Lord Jesus; he is born of God and His child for all eternity.

Nor does the introduction of this new life alter, in the slightest degree, the true, essential character of the old. This latter continues what it is and is made in no respect better; yes, rather, there is the full display of its evil character in opposition to the new creation. “The flesh lusteth against the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another so that ye cannot do the things ye would” (Gal 5:17). There they are in all their distinctness and the one is only thrown into relief by the other.

I believe this doctrine of the two natures in the believer is not generally understood; and yet, so long as there is ignorance of it, the mind must be utterly at sea in reference to the true standing and privileges of the child of God. Some there are who think that regeneration is a certain change which the old Adamic life undergoes; and moreover, that this change is gradual in its operation, until, at length, the whole man becomes transformed. Wesleyan, Arminianism is the general source of this teaching today.

That this idea is unsound can be proved by various quotations from the New Testament. For example, “The carnal mind is enmity against God.” How can that which is thus spoken of ever undergo any improvement? The Apostle goes on to say, “It is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.” If it cannot be subject to the law of God, how can it be improved, how can it undergo any change? Again, “That which is born of the flesh is flesh.” Do what you will with flesh and it is flesh all the while.

Paul does not say, Ye have improved, or are seeking to improve, “the old man,” but rather, “Ye have put off the old man” (Col 3:9). Passages might easily be multiplied to prove the unsoundness of the theory with respect to the gradual improvement of the old mam—to prove that the old man is dead in sins and utterly un-renewable; and moreover, that the only thing we can do with it is to keep it under our feet by reckoning upon the death and new life that we have in union with our risen Head in the heavens.

If present or future blessedness were made to depend upon even a divine change wrought in nature, flesh would glory. But when I am introduced into a new creation, I find it is all of God—designed, matured and developed by the Father Himself—He is the Giver and I am the receiver.

This is what makes Christianity what it is; and moreover, distinguishes it from every system of human religion under the sun, whether it be Romanism, or Protestantism, or any other ism whatsoever. Human religion gives the creature a place, more or less; it keeps the bondwoman and her son in the house; it gives man something to glory in. On the contrary, Christianity excludes the creature from all interference in the work of salvation, casts out the bondwomen and her son and gives all the glory to Him in Whom alone it is due. –C H Mackintosh

Hello NetChaplain.

I agree with this post, the difference between the spirit and the flesh.
We are a new creation, a new spiritual person in Christ. Probably the
misunderstanding derives from Plato's philosophy which the early
church absorbed. It is very observable in the theology of the older
churches.

 

[james1523]

Hi James and God's blessings to your Family! Your comment contains the right script, but my placement of the characters aren't quite the same as yours.

I see it that the soul and spirit are nearly the same, as the soul (the thought element) and the spirit make up the individual or person. The soul and spirit are influenced by another element, the original nature, which is "the old man" and the body reacts to the decisions of the individual. The believer is influenced (tested), but not controlled by the old nature, because it is the "new man" (new nature) in the hands of the Spirit that controls him (Gal 5:17). The old self or old nature isn't considered fallen because it's not a person but a nature, which has never been elevated. It (old nature) cannot change (Rom 8:7) but our mind (soul - Rom 8:6; 1 Cor 2:16) does, by way of the new man, which isn't Christ but is a nature from Him--Col 3:10; and is how we are "partakers of the (His) divine nature" (2 Pet 1:4).

I do not want you to consider my reply as a contention of your reply (not that I'm accusing you), but as one just sharing his opinions in fellowship with you.

No contention received brother . You have a torch which shines light and I have a torch which shines light, as we direct our light to the topic at hand we will both see things clearer.

The old nature is the soul and human spirit without the Spirit of God. The new nature is the soul and human spirit with the Spirit of God.

The soul and spirit are certainly nearly inseparable just like bone and marrow.. the Word of God can separate them Heb 4:12
There are some differences between soul and spirit:
Physical death - separation of body and "soul with spirit".. man or God can do this.
Spiritual death - separation of soul and spirit, only God can do this.

The soul is the part which contains the self, the "I", it is the emotions (feeling), mind (thoughts), and will (intents). A person's nature is the content of their soul. Whatever is in your mind, emotions, and will, that is your nature. Old nature is the soul without God, new nature is the soul with God. Animals have a soul, but only humans have a spirit.
The human spirit is the spiritual "stomach" to contain God. If God is a hand then the human spirit is a glove, designed to be filled with the hand and which looks like a hand.

The old nature is the human soul without God joined to the human spirit. This is a state of spiritual death, the man lives according to the nature of his soul, doing, thinking, willing, and feeling what he chooses, apart from God. The old self, old nature, is fallen in the sense that it is the nature of sin and death inherited from the fall. This nature contains elements of good and evil, since man ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. There is kindness, love, compassion, in this nature, but there is also hatred, cruelty, greediness etc.

The new nature is the human soul with God joined to the human spirit. Now God's Spirit permeates the mind, emotions and will of the believer and this changes their old soul into the new soul, into a Christ-like nature.

The old nature has been crucified with Christ on the cross because Christ who was crucified comes to dwell in the spirit of the believer as the Spirit of Christ, and therefore the old nature, the independent self, no longer rules. Unless - the believer frustrates the Spirit and does not allow the Spirit into his mind, emotions, and will, which is resisting and quenching and grieving the Holy Spirit.

So the old nature does not and cannot change.. it is crucified.. but the soul is where all of this is taking place, and in this sense, the soul (mind , emotions, will) does change from old nature to new nature.

The old nature is soul+ human spirit, the new nature is soul+human spirit + God's Spirit. God's nature comes to us by being transmitted into our soul and spirit. This is how we spiritually practically partake of His nature.

 

[james1523]

Yes old traditional churches deny the Holy Spirit and the spirit of man, they live according to their soul and the good side of their old nature and don't emphasise or explain a personal spiritual relationship with God and living according to the new nature. Basically I've just said they are legalistic and religious (in the bad sense) but without genuine spirituality. I know because I spent 30 years in them but God in His mercy showed me the difference between His people and satan's people and now I am free from this fornicating satanic religious system.

Those who live according to their old nature are serving the purpose of satan and make up spiritual Babylon which includes fornication with the world and the beast of iron and clay, the Roman Empire. The Roman Empire includes all western democracies founded on the principles of Rome and the Romanish religious system. Those who live according to the new nature will be part of Christ's bride, the church, and will rule and reign with Him. And we could go into end times and biblical prophecy here to see the result of multitudes of people living according to old nature and multitudes living according to new nature.

Perhaps I have been harsh to only mention the old traditional churches. It is also in the new modern churches. It is cleverly disguised in the 'self help' books and 'self help' gurus who tell you how to be richer, happier, healthier etc. Living according to the old nature includes "self improvement" theologies. There's nothing wrong with self improvement teachings or books, as long as they are dependent upon Christ for the improvement and not dependent upon the self.

The old nature is the independent self. It is also in the opinions of man. When Peter told Christ he should not go to the cross, Jesus rebuked him, called him satan. In this case Peter's opinion was from his independent soul and so it was humanistic and satanic.

Whenever another person or we give an opinion and advice without God, then that is the old nature and we are doing satan's will which is for mankind to be independent of God.
Satan rules the world by the default position of man being independent from God.
Satan rules the soul (mind, emotions, will). by default, by the soul of man not relying upon God.
Satan knows that when we don't rely upon God we don't do His will and therefore satan's purpose is accomplished.
Satan will then use this against us by accusing us (the accuser of the brethren) but God in His mercy forgives us and does not condemn us.

So the matter of old nature versus new nature is very important and we have to make sure we live according to the new nature at all times.

To live according to the new nature is to make God the center of your life and to make Him everything in your life.
This requires constant fellowship with God in spirit, rejoicing, praying, thanking, always: 1 Thessalonians 5:16 etc.
Then the Spirit will permeate our mind, emotions, and will, and so whatever we do, think or say, will be coming from the Spirit of God and not our independent soul which is subject to fallen thoughts that lying and deceiving demons inject.

In every day practical terms this comes down to turning to God in every situation and every time by prayer. Whenever someone offends us, if we react we are using our independent mind, emotions, and will, to hit back at the person. But we should pray to God in this time, and then He will give us the strength to not react. Prayer shows our dependence upon God and gives Him permission to come into our mind, emotions and will.
Similarly if we are faced with a decision, we should turn to God by prayer and not think we know what is best for us or other people.

Now I can tell what you may be thinking right now. You may be thinking "how can I pray when I'm so busy", you think to pray you have to find a quiet room, kneel down and pray with your hands together and eyes closed for 15 minutes. That's not the kind of prayer I'm talking about. I'm talking about communicating and fellowshipping with God in spirit wherever you are and whatever you are doing. Doing shopping, in the car, at work, at home watching TV, whatever you are doing. You may not even be able to speak but you can at least pray in your mind and thoughts to God.

 

[B-A-C]

If you aren't growing and maturing in your walk, you are doing something wrong.

Don't continue to be a spiritual infant. This takes practice and discipline.

1 Cor 14:20; Brethren, do not be children in your thinking; yet in evil be infants, but in your thinking be mature.
Eph 4:13; until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.
Heb 5:14; But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.

Pursue sanctification.

Heb 12:14; Pursue peace with all men, and the sanctification without which no one will see the Lord.

We are to practice discipline and self restraint.

Heb 12:5 and you have forgotten the exhortation which is addressed to you as sons, "MY SON, DO NOT REGARD LIGHTLY THE DISCIPLINE OF THE LORD, NOR FAINT WHEN YOU ARE REPROVED BY HIM;
Heb 12:7 It is for discipline that you endure; God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom his father does not discipline?
Heb 12:8 But if you are without discipline, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate children and not sons.
Heb 12:9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
Heb 12:11 All discipline for the moment seems not to be joyful, but sorrowful; yet to those who have been trained by it, afterwards it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness.

God isn't finishes with us yet. He is sill working on us.

Php 1:6; For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.

Php 3:12; Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus.
Php 3:13; Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead,
Php 3:14; I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

1 Pet 5:10; After you have suffered for a little while, the God of all grace, who called you to His eternal glory in Christ, will Himself perfect, confirm, strengthen and establish you.
Suffering often leads to perfection in God.

Some people believe all you have to do is put gas in a car, and it will get you were you're going. That's true for a while.
Eventually you will need a oil change, new tires, a tune up and some maintenance. God loves us where we are, but he loves us too much to leave us there.
We can certainly learn to love more in our walk with Christ.

Luke 9:23; And He was saying to them all, "If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross daily and follow Me.
1Cor 15:31; I affirm, brethren, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.

1 Cor 9:27; but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

 

[will]

I believe this doctrine of the two natures in the believer is not generally understood; and yet, so long as there is ignorance of it, the mind must be utterly at sea in reference to the true standing and privileges of the child of God.

This is true. Infant Christians naturally do not understand the distinction and therefore live on earth with confusion (and stress) caused by the two conflicting natures. The only thing that can grow a Christian from infancy to maturity is the regular consumption of the Scriptures which is used by the Holy Spirit to nurture and grow us. Sadly more often other Christians surrounding this infant one also actually are still infants. Only they have been a Christian for a long time, hence the infant one perceives them as "mature" -- and they should be, but they are not. Their lives are no different than the world, and the do not bear the fruits of the Spirit. It is a vicious-cycle that only produce more infant Christians with stunted growth. Any wonder why Christianity cannot stand together against the world?

The only thing that can break this cycle, is for a mature Christian to enter the scene. A disciple of Christ who is already grown by God and has the capacity to lovingly make disciples out of these group of "new" and "old" infant Christians. Fulfilling what the Lord commissioned us to do (Matthew Matthew 28:18-20).

I was one of those "old" infants described above. Until a more mature Christian told me to rely on God in my Scripture readings. That is the starting point of my Spirit-guided growth. And now God has given me enough understanding and burden to break other cycles going on around me. And that is my calling.

 

[NetChaplain]

This is true. Infant Christians naturally do not understand the distinction and therefore live on earth with confusion (and stress) caused by the two conflicting natures. The only thing that can grow a Christian from infancy to maturity is the regular consumption of the Scriptures which is used by the Holy Spirit to nurture and grow us.

Hi Will - Your reply is very applicable concerning the maturity level of the average modern believer and it's due to lack of Scriptural drive. Many get its knowledge but do not progress much from there because of inaccurate teaching while growing up in their spiritual walk. It's not from lack of desire for God's Word but in our desire to learn, we find difficulty in momentum and I believe it's from not being familiar enough with sound Scriptural rudiments to cause us to be Word-hungry, which is all related to, as you've indicated, Scriptural dearth.