The abuse of Grace.

[B-A-C]

Most of us are aware of people who abuse the law. They say you must follow it to the letter or else.... As most of you know, this is called legalism.
There is another group of people who lean too far the other way. They say sin all you want to, it doesn't matter if you are saved. The King James Bible
calls this lasciviousness. ( Jude 1:4; ) NASB calls it licentiousness.

Every sin we commit costs someone. Before we were saved, Jesus purchased us. We were bought with a price. ( 1 Cor 6:20; 1 Cor 7:23; Matt 20:28; 1 Tim 2:6; )
Our ransom for sin was paid. We couldn't do this ourselves, so Jesus did it for us. This undeserved favor is called grace.
A good example of this is in Luke 7.

Luke 7:39; Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet He would know who and what sort of person this woman is who is touching Him, that she is a sinner."
Luke 7:40; And Jesus answered him, "Simon, I have something to say to you." And he replied, "Say it, Teacher."
Luke 7:41; "A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty.
Luke 7:42; "When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?"
Luke 7:43; Simon answered and said, "I suppose the one whom he forgave more." And He said to him, "You have judged correctly."
Luke 7:44; Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, "Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair.
Luke 7:45; "You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet.
Luke 7:46; "You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume.
Luke 7:47; "For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little."
Luke 7:48; Then He said to her, "Your sins have been forgiven."

There are people who got saved at a young age. Perhaps they were raised in church by Christian parents. For whatever reason, they decided to pursue a life of Christianity.
These people didn't need as much grace to become saved, because they didn't commit a lot of sins before they got saved. On the other hand, there are people who live pretty wild and worldly lives. Perhaps they never heard of Jesus until later in life. Perhaps they didn't get saved until much later in life. Now age doesn't have as much to do with this, as the lifestyle you live.
Some people sin less than others. Some people sin more. ( maybe they are bargain shoppers ) So it took less grace or more grace for these people to become saved as the
case may be.

What some people don't realize, is that there is still a cost for sin, even for believers. Oh, we are forgiven of them, if we confess and repent. I'm not arguing that point. But someone still has to pay for them.

Rom 5:20; The Law came in so that the transgression would increase; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
Rom 6:1; What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?

Yes Jesus died "once for all" our sins. He has an unlimited checkbook ( or grace book ) but he still has to write the checks.
If we keep choosing to sin a lot, there still has to be more grace. Jesus will keep paying for your sins because he loves us. The grace continues even after we are saved.
But just because there is grace doesn't mean we should abuse it.

Jude 1:4; For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into a license to sin and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.

Heb 12:15; See to it that no one comes short of the grace of God; that no root of bitterness springing up causes trouble, and by it many be defiled;

Maybe this why Jesus said...
John 14:15; "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

 

[Barny]

Most of us are aware of people who abuse the law. They say you must follow it to the letter or else.... As most of you know, this is called legalism.
There is another group of people who lean too far the other way. They say sin all you want to, it doesn't matter if you are saved. The King James Bible
calls this lasciviousness. ( Jude 1:4; ) NASB calls it licentiousness.....

Jude 1:4; For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into a license to sin and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.

Heb 12:15; See to it that no one comes short of the grace of God; that no root of bitterness springing up causes trouble, and by it many be defiled;

Maybe this why Jesus said...
John 14:15; "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

B-A-C, my friend. Are you speaking about Antimonianism here when referring to those you describe as "you can sin all you want"?
If so then you have failed to describe we so called "Antimonianists" correctly.
We may not agree in doctrine but it would be nice to try to portray anothers view accurately.

And you misunderstand the scriptures you quoted.

You spoke on Jude 1:4; in terms of physical lifestyle/behavior. This is incorrect.
Note the context of Jude to see that it does not refer to physical behavior.
Jude 1:3-5
Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. For there are certain men crept in unawares (to preach works of the law), who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not

Here we see in Jude that it speaks about unbelief in Jesus. About those who creep in amongst believers to try to deceive them in to turning back to justification by the law.

And anyone who does turn back to the law is in unbelief. They have fallen short of the grace of God, Heb 12:15.

Believers however keep his commandments.
1John 3:22-23
we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.

And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

 

[Rev T.S.Perkins]

I'm pretty sure that God showed us what He thought about the abuse of grace when We sent Christ to the cross ,and Christ said Father forgive them ,they know not what they do !...Rev

 

[Eddy Fire]

I'm pretty sure that God showed us what He thought about the abuse of grace when We sent Christ to the cross ,and Christ said Father forgive them ,they know not what they do !...Rev

that sure silenced the flesh in me, brother
preach on

 

[Fragrant Grace]

The world or christ?

But just because there is grace doesn't mean we should abuse it.......

Maybe this why Jesus said...
John 14:15; "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

The one who received the seed that fell among the thorns is the man who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it, making it unfruitful.
Matthew 13:22


This is the way in which those thorns served the wheat-- they starved it by devouring its food, and they choked it by keeping off the air and sun.
The poor thing became shriveled and weak, and quite unable to produce the grain which the sower expected of it.


So it is with many professing Christians.
They are at first worldly, but not so very worldly.
They are fairly religious, though by no means too zealous.
They seek the pleasures of the world, but by no means quite so much as others we could name.

But very soon the thorns grow, and it becomes doubtful which will win-- sin or grace, the world or Christ.
Two masters there cannot be...

Spurgeon: Sown Among Thorns


What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid
Romans 6:15

 

[B-A-C]

B-A-C, my friend. Are you speaking about Antimonianism here when referring to those you describe as "you can sin all you want"?
If so then you have failed to describe we so called "Antimonianists" correctly.

Yes you are right. For once I wasn't speaking of antimonianism. As I was speaking of grace for sins. Antimonianists say they have no sin.
A slightly different doctrine.

 

[Barny]

Yes you are right. For once I wasn't speaking of antimonianism. As I was speaking of grace for sins. Antimonianists say they have no sin.
A slightly different doctrine.

Good to hear that your not speaking of Antimonianism.

And just to clarify, we so called "Antimonianists", that some label we believers as, do not simply say "we have no sin". Instead we say that we abide in Christ (believing in him) and therefore our position in Christ is that "we have no sin". Our faith is counted for righteousness (Rom 4:5 instead of by works of the law.

 

[amadeus2]

These people didn't need as much grace to become saved, because they didn't commit a lot of sins before they got saved

Is this really the case? All of us, as unbelievers, were so far from God we were effectively dead to Him. God is merciful to any unbeliever by calling them to Him so that they could have Life. The ones that are dead know nothing so how can there be greater or lesser need for them? Jesus said of the ones who killed Him: "Forgive them, for they know not what they do".

 

[Rev T.S.Perkins]

As the word says ...we have all fell short of the Glory of God .for there is none Rightious no not one ..and God is not a respecter of persons..so that being said we all need Jesus the same ...no one is better than the other in Gods eyes....we are all stained with sin ,big or little ..does not a little leven change the whole lump.....? sp

 

[DutchChristian]

If someone would go ahead and just sin because "God Will Forgive me anyway" then you are in big trouble as indeed Grace is NOT a license for immorality.

Or that supposedly we can never out- sin the grace of God, But this is not true we need to resist the sin, if we choose wilfully to go ahead to sin and so being in rebellion to GOD, or not repent of sin we have a BIG problem yes even unto DEATH!

Here's an example: a formerly saved Christian man and his's flesh and own lust and mind enticed him and so drawed him toward loving drinking and alcohol (he is backslidden now) and so he goes out to drink each night being drunk, him knowing the Truth he must repent of this immediately if not he is abing in DEATH as no drunkard will inherit the Kingdom of God. But he might say: 'hey i am saved no matter what....' you see the complete foolishness and utter danger of this idea here! It is complete corrupt doctrine! and We must rather be more like Eph. 5:11 kind of People Amen and this man should Cry out to The Lord Jesus for his own Deliverance! Repent and confess always! we must hate the sin!

That is why i have trouble with the OSAS false doctrine: It justifies and promotes sin covertly, because 'hey in the end we are all going to be saved no matter what' but this is not the case!

In this lies a hidden danger!

Now there is a slight different variant called: 'Perseverance of the saints' which comes from the P from this corrupt system of TULIP, this one is more like "IF you are saved you will be always saved" but this doctrine is also plain error.

i have no doubt about Gods Keeping Power but we humans have a free will and we all know that sin and temptation at times comes knocking heavily at the door and we each of us have the responsibility to not open up that door!

Do not pick up something that is already dead, Jesus Christ has already put the sin to death already if you are the new creature in Christ Born anew from Heaven!

Here's an example: A girl might come along and satan and my own flesh would start to tempt me to either go and fornicate (in thought and deed), or me not to fornicate is a choice here where i need to submit myself to GOD resist the sin and draw near to GOD.

James 4:
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

i love the openings post, and indeed brother B-A-C already said it: John 14:15; "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.

1 John 2:
3 And hereby we do know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments.
4 He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth His word, in him verily is the Love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in Him.
6 He that saith he abideth in Him ought himself also so to walk, even as He walked.

Now consider this: That overall the more Holier a doctrine's result and working is, is overal more likely to be of good and true doctrine. (and i'm not talking about that 'sinless perfection' ordeal now!) But more of denial of self: Matthew 16:24. The less of me the more of Him!

Let us walk after the Spirit and not after the flesh! Let us continue to Abide in the Vine The Lord Jesus Christ more and more!

Praise The LORD!

Jude:1
24 Now unto Him that is able to Keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the Presence of His Glory with exceeding joy,
25 To the Only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

It is all His Work in us and Through us as we surrender to Him daily more and more!

By my flesh i cannot fight the sin, it is very difficult by my own But if i submit myself to GOD and surrender all of myself to Him, here is where the SIN STOPPING RESURRECTION POWER Comes in! Hallelujah!

Our Surrender to God is The Key! By faith! and not of works! By His Grace!

Glory to GOD!

 

[Fragrant Grace]

There is another group of people who lean too far the other way. They say sin all you want to, it doesn't matter if you are saved. The King James Bible
calls this lasciviousness. ( Jude 1:4; ) NASB calls it licentiousness.

I believe that one reason why the church at this present moment has so little influence over the world, is because the world has so much influence over the church!
Nowadays, we hear professors pleading that they may do this, and do that—that they may live like worldlings.
My sad answer to them, when they crave this liberty is:
"Do it if you dare. It may not cost you much hurt, for you are so bad already.
Your cravings show how rotten your hearts are. If you are hungering after such dogs food—go dogs, and eat the garbage"

Worldly amusements are fit food for pretenders and hypocrites.
If you were God's children, you would loathe the thought of the world's evil joys.
Your question would not be, "How far may we be like the world?"
But your cry would be, "How can we get away from the world? How can we come out of it?"
CH Spurgeon- The Soul Winner


Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.
Philippians 4:8

That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world; Holding forth the word of life
Philippians 2:15-16

 

[B-A-C]

Is this really the case? All of us, as unbelievers, were so far from God we were effectively dead to Him. God is merciful to any unbeliever by calling them to Him so that they could have Life. The ones that are dead know nothing so how can there be greater or lesser need for them? Jesus said of the ones who killed Him: "Forgive them, for they know not what they do".

J. Vernon McGee puts it like this.
There are two "dead" cars on the side of the road. One just has a dead battery. The other is missing an engine and transmission. With enough money you can get both of them to come back "alive".
But one will cost more to fix than the other one.

He goes on to say...
Some people think some cars are worth fixing up, maybe a 57 chevy bel-air for example or a 66 mustang. But they think other cars like Buick station wagon aren't worth fixing up.
God isn't that way. He thinks we are ALL worth his time, effort and "money" (grace). None of us are "junk" cars to God.
I like the way he ended this sermon. By the way, even new cars need an oil change every new and then. When is the last time you had a "renewing" of the Holy Spirit?

 

[revbrad]

Something to think about........

Feel The Nails
Words by Ray Boltz, Music by Ray Boltz and Steve Millikan

They tell me Jesus died
For my transgressions
And that He paid that price
A long long time ago
When He gave His life for me
On a hill called Calvary
But there's something else
I want to know
CHORUS:
Does He still feel the nails
Every time I fail?
Does He hear the crowd cry,
Crucify, again?
Am I causing Him pain?
Then I know I've got to change
I just can't bear the thought
Of hurting Him
It seems that I'm so good
At breaking promises
And I treat His precious grace
So carelessly
But each time He forgives
What if He relives
The agony He felt on that tree?
CHORUS
Holy, holy, holy is the Lord
Holy, holy, holy is the Lord
Do you still feel the nails
Every time I fail?
Have I crucified you, Jesus,
With my sin?
I'm tired of playing games
I really want to change
I never want to hurt You again
Holy, holy, holy is the Lord
Holy, holy, holy is the Lord
1989 Shepherd Boy MusicASCAP and SonWorshippersASCAP.

 

[amadeus2]

J. Vernon McGee puts it like this.
There are two "dead" cars on the side of the road. One just has a dead battery. The other is missing an engine and transmission. With enough money you can get both of them to come back "alive".
But one will cost more to fix than the other one.

He goes on to say...
Some people think some cars are worth fixing up, maybe a 57 chevy bel-air for example or a 66 mustang. But they think other cars like Buick station wagon aren't worth fixing up.
God isn't that way. He thinks we are ALL worth his time, effort and "money" (grace). None of us are "junk" cars to God.
I like the way he ended this sermon. By the way, even new cars need an oil change every new and then. When is the last time you had a "renewing" of the Holy Spirit?

Thank you very much for your explanation.

 

[Puddleglum]

I'm pretty sure that God showed us what He thought about the abuse of grace when We sent Christ to the cross ,and Christ said Father forgive them ,they know not what they do !...Rev

But some did know what they were doing and they are not forgiven.