Lawrence, E, Will and jaa all of you made good points but I disagree. Jaa IDK if you read what I wrote in my last reply but I believe you should read it. Its all Biblical and it deals with what is going on and the characteristics of God's remnant church. To Lawrence very simply put Jesus in the new testament distinguished people by denominations. Read John 4:20 Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, and you Jews say that in Jerusalem is the place where one ought to worship." 21 Jesus said to her, "Woman, believe Me, the hour is coming when you will neither on this mountain, nor in Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews. To simply break it down the woman worshipped God. She new that was Jacobs well. Jesus then said "you do not know what you worship, salvation is of the Jews. If that is not denomination I dont know what is. And like then there are people nowadays following traditions and believe they know but till they REALLY come to Christ they will "know His voice" and will "come out of Babylon". Will this maturity thing well the Holy Spirit is the one who brings us into truth John 16:13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. So if we yield to the Holy Spirit He will show us which doctrines or teachings are true. There are alot of false doctrines in diff. denominations that as Paul put it is from another gospel. Ephrem IDK if you know but when Jesus stated thate His Law will never be abolished in Matt 5: 17 "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven", He really meant it. In Rom13:8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, "You shall not commit adultery," "You shall not murder," "You shall not steal," "You shall not bear false witness," "You shall not covet," and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." The first 4 Commandments is the "You shall love your God with all your heart and the last 6 Commandments are the "You shall love your neighbor as yourself". IDK if you read my last reply but it will help. Keeping gods Commandments is a must for His church or people in these last days as I stated in my last reply. Dont be deceived with traditions and doctrines of man like Jesus said in Mark 7: 6 He answered and said to them, "Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written: 'This people honors Me with their lips, But their heart is far from Me. 7 And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.' 8 "For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men--the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do." 9 He said to them, "All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. God is awesome and has His peolpe in every religion and denomination and calls them out of it to HIS FOLD Rev.18: 4 And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues. Isn't He awesome. Paise God and make sure you here His voice everyone . God bless
The true church
- Thread starter truth speaker
- Start date
Yes, of course.
I should have mentioned the obvious, that the only way to grow into maturity is by listening to the Holy Spirit, in fact, be controlled by Him.
But my point is, if we are talking about Christians that are not mature, we will only get bickering about doctrines based on who can speak the loudest or the most eloquent. That is human standards.
We *all* need to strive to reach this mature state through the Holy Spirit. That's what the Scriptures teach. And most people (including myself) are sometimes too preoccupied by differences that does not matter.
And bgsda, please consider breaking down your post into paragraphs. It's hard to read when all sentences runs together like that :bot:
yeah it will be better your right Will. But Will that is a good notion and reply but there is one problem. Theres alot of different doctrines or teachings that they all (denominations) preach. No good. Its like if I was to tell you that the Catholics believe and are right in what they believe. Truth is they aren't right. I love them and even my mother and relatives are Catholics we do not have the same faith. Same thing goes with diff. denoms. thank God He points out the characteristics of His end time church or people. Its true some bickering are on small stuff but many, many more are on things that will lead to destruction
Here's an excerpt from God's Spiritual House by T.Austin Sparks.
What the Church Is
What, then, is this spiritual house? What is this Church? Let us not have an objective mentality about this, thinking of it as something somewhere outside of and apart from ourselves. What is it? The answer is a very simple one. The spiritual house of God is Christ Himself. Yes, but not Christ personally alone, but Christ in you, in me, the hope of glory. Oh, it is just here that all the mistakes have been made about the Church, with such disastrous results.
The Church, the House of God, is simply Christ Himself in undivided oneness found in all those in whom He really dwells. That is all. That is the Church. Seek to root out of your mentality any and every other idea of the Church. It is not Christ divided into a thousand or a million fragments amongst so many believers. It is still one Christ. You and I are not the Church. It is Christ in you and in me that is the Church. We still remain what we are outside of the Church still on our natural ground, but it is the measure of Christ in us that constitutes the Church, a spiritual Church, a spiritual house, the one Christ by the one Spirit in all those in whom He dwells. That is the Church.
God has never seen in that Church, in that Temple, anything but His Son. He is the Temple of God and you and I can never belong to the Church save as Christ is in us. I know that is a simple thing to say, but if we would just fasten on that and see what that means; it is one of the great factors of unspeakably great power against the enemy, if only we would live on that basis, if only we would abide there.
What the Church Is
What, then, is this spiritual house? What is this Church? Let us not have an objective mentality about this, thinking of it as something somewhere outside of and apart from ourselves. What is it? The answer is a very simple one. The spiritual house of God is Christ Himself. Yes, but not Christ personally alone, but Christ in you, in me, the hope of glory. Oh, it is just here that all the mistakes have been made about the Church, with such disastrous results.
The Church, the House of God, is simply Christ Himself in undivided oneness found in all those in whom He really dwells. That is all. That is the Church. Seek to root out of your mentality any and every other idea of the Church. It is not Christ divided into a thousand or a million fragments amongst so many believers. It is still one Christ. You and I are not the Church. It is Christ in you and in me that is the Church. We still remain what we are outside of the Church still on our natural ground, but it is the measure of Christ in us that constitutes the Church, a spiritual Church, a spiritual house, the one Christ by the one Spirit in all those in whom He dwells. That is the Church.
God has never seen in that Church, in that Temple, anything but His Son. He is the Temple of God and you and I can never belong to the Church save as Christ is in us. I know that is a simple thing to say, but if we would just fasten on that and see what that means; it is one of the great factors of unspeakably great power against the enemy, if only we would live on that basis, if only we would abide there.
Last edited:
Thats very true jiggy. But then theres the problem with everyone saying they have Christ in them and teaching another gospel as in pauls day. Gal. 1:6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. It so happens nowadays as well. That is why God has a true people now to teach others to come out of spiritual Babylon (confusion). It does sound great that all you need is Christ, which is true, but which Christ. Many people make up there own christ. Lord loves us and doesn't want us to be deceived because it will only lead us to destruction.
EphremHagos
Member
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2009
- Messages
- 245
"Listening to the Holy Spirit, in fact, being controlled by Him" is easier said than done!
Knowledge of Jesus Christ, as perpetually and personally revealed in his Spirit-active, perfect and diacritical death on the cross, is what it is all about as testified by his works.
Knowledge of Jesus Christ, as perpetually and personally revealed in his Spirit-active, perfect and diacritical death on the cross, is what it is all about as testified by his works.
EphremHagos
Member
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2009
- Messages
- 245
There is a good match between the words of T. Austin Sparks and the blueprint of the church as drawn, sealed and built by Jesus himself. (Matt. 16: 13-28; 26: 26-29; 27: 50-56)
Thank you for that.
Thank you for that.
EphremHagos
Member
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2009
- Messages
- 245
I don't understand at all! Which of my points are you refuting in your last paragraph?
Last edited:
Jaareshiah
Member
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2009
- Messages
- 177
Jesus established the only true religion, the "pure religion", that James describes as "unspotted from the world".(James 1:27, King James Bible) It is identified by its "fruits", for Jesus said that there are those who "come to you in sheep’s covering, but inside they are ravenous wolves", and "by their fruits you will recognize them."
He further said: "Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they? Likewise every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit; a good tree cannot bear worthless fruit, neither can a rotten tree produce fine fruit. Every tree not producing fine fruit gets cut down and thrown into the fire. Really, then, by their fruits you will recognize those [men]."(Matt 7:15-20)
Hence, what are the "fruits" of the religions of the world, including the churches of Christendom ? Of the Catholic church, it has shown itself as having "worthless fruit", such as the over 12,000 priests that have been identified as pedophiles since the 1940's. It was during John Paul II's tenure that the issue of pedophilia priests became a focal point, with the Catholic Church having paid out over 1 billion dollars in claims. Though over 12,000 priests have been found guilty of child molestation, the Catholic hierarchy tired to hide them or moved guilty priests to another parish, where these committed wicked acts again.
Last year, the "Order of the Jesuits in the United States agreed to pay 166 million dollars in the settlement of lawsuits filed by 500 Americans, the victims of pedophile priests" that occurred between the 1940's down till the 1990's.(The Telegraph, March 26, 2011) In February 2008, CNN News revealed that a Roman Catholic nun, Norma Giannini, was found guilty of sexually abusing two boys in the 1960s.
Lawrence Murphy, priest at the St. John's School for the Deaf in Wisconsin, abused as many as 200 students over a period of almost 25 years (1950-1974), and though many of these students revealed these abuses to other priests and three archbishops of Milwaukee, it all fell on "deaf" ears, until it became national news in The New York Times (March 26, 2010).
The report further said: "Some allegations became public years ago. But they received renewed attention "after documents obtained by The New York Times showed Murphy was spared a defrocking in the mid-1990s because he was protected by the Vatican office led by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, now the pope."(March 26, 2010, The Telegraph) Also in 2010, 102 Catholic priests in the archdiocese of Dublin, Ireland, are alleged to have sexually abused at least 350 children over the past decades, some dating back to the 1940's.
On the other hand, what are some identifying marks of true Christianity that bears "fine fruit" ? Note please:
(1) Those who practice it have genuine love among themselves.(John 13:34, 35; 1 John 4:8)
(2) All their beliefs are based on the Bible.(John 17:17; 2 Tim 3:16,17)
(3) They pray for God's name of Jehovah to be hallowed or sanctified. (Matt 6:9; Ps 83:18)
(4) They proclaim God's kingdom in all the earth, not some political or social philosophy.(Matt 24:14; Acts 28:23)
(5) They keep separate from the world's affairs, untainted by the world's politics or conflicts, remaining neutral in time of war.(James 1:27; John 17:14)
(6) They put God's kingdom and his righteousness first in their lives.(Matt 6:33)
(7) They cultivate the fruitage of God's spirit, not condoning war or personal violence.(Gal 5:22,23; Rom 12:17-21)
(8) They obey all human laws not contrary to God's law.(Rom 13:1-7)
(9) The true religion successfully unites people of every race, language, and tribe. It does not preach nationalism or hatred, but love worldwide.(Isaiah 2:2-4; Col 3:10,11)
(10) The true religion teaches the truth regarding God's purpose for man and the earth.(Matt 5:5; Ps 115:16; Isaiah 45:18)
kamiller1972
Member
- Joined
- May 15, 2012
- Messages
- 92
Y'all are so knowledgeable here! I love this forum-being a new Christian, I have to say that this is one question I have asked my self over and over.
I'm attending an SDA church and I have to say that I don't agree with some of their teachings and as a result, I'm starting to get disheartened. They, too, claim to be the one and true church but I just don't see this and I'm finding myself more and more confused. (No offense to any SDA's here...it's just SDA's teaching isn't mixing well with me and I'm finding myself straying from the Bible and Jesus because I'm just so darned confused!)
I don't want to offend them or anyone here that may be SDA for they really did help me find Jesus in my heart and helped me to hear His call.
I'm just thinking that I need to branch out and find a church that I am truly comfortable with. Is this bad? *sigh*
Anyhoo, love to all brothers and sisters in Christ! And thank you all for your knowledge. I love reading them and learning from them! :air_kiss:
I'm attending an SDA church and I have to say that I don't agree with some of their teachings and as a result, I'm starting to get disheartened. They, too, claim to be the one and true church but I just don't see this and I'm finding myself more and more confused. (No offense to any SDA's here...it's just SDA's teaching isn't mixing well with me and I'm finding myself straying from the Bible and Jesus because I'm just so darned confused!)
I don't want to offend them or anyone here that may be SDA for they really did help me find Jesus in my heart and helped me to hear His call.
I'm just thinking that I need to branch out and find a church that I am truly comfortable with. Is this bad? *sigh*
Anyhoo, love to all brothers and sisters in Christ! And thank you all for your knowledge. I love reading them and learning from them! :air_kiss:
Last edited:
AbbysAunt
Member
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2004
- Messages
- 561
I believe the true church is us...all of us. We are the church and when we are together no matter where it is that is a meeting place or church. This site is church to me because its a meeting of two or more brothers and sisters in our Lord and we gather to worship and lift His name on High and to help each other. That to me is the true and real church...We are the body of the church. As far as myself personally I don't belong to a denomination because to me God isn't a denomination I'm a follower of Jesus Christ this is where I find myself and strive to be at daily.
AA
AA
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2007
- Messages
- 12,493
Let's be straight forward here. Do you believe that the Jehovah Witnesses is the one true church? Yes or No will suffice. Thanks.
kamiller1972
Member
- Joined
- May 15, 2012
- Messages
- 92
No. I've spent some time with them and did not feel they were teaching me Biblical truths but rather their own "truths". Just my opinion!
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2007
- Messages
- 12,493
Actually the question was directed to jaareshiah and not to you little sister.
kamiller1972
Member
- Joined
- May 15, 2012
- Messages
- 92
Oops...sorry about that. Had a bad experience with them and just sort of jumped the gun there...:embarasse
Last edited:
kamiller1972
Member
- Joined
- May 15, 2012
- Messages
- 92
Oops...sorry about that. I've had a bad experience with them a just sort of jumped the gun there....:embarasse
Jaareshiah
Member
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2009
- Messages
- 177
Yes, since that will suffice.
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2007
- Messages
- 12,493
Thank-you for answering. I will respect the thread starters desires to not have disrespectful comments made. We will be at odds, and should another thread get started on the subject I look forward to your answers on some of my queries.
In Christ Jesus
C4E
In Christ Jesus
C4E
I have to disagree with you, Jesus never started any religion, but Jesus did come to set us free. Religion is man-made, the English word "religion" comes from the Latin word religio and it means to bind again.
Brighthouse
Active
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2009
- Messages
- 1,567
Brother Truth Speaker. First welcome here! I think it is very cool for some to ask a question they already know the answer to. The true Church in my humble opinion should always be based upon what Jesus himself, not only said!! But also did!( James 1:22) To be a servant! The foundation of the Church should always be based first on this.From being a servant of the Most High God,one understands how to be served by another. For how can a man ever be given any authority through our Jesus unless one has served under His authority? And what one comes to understand from Holy Spirit is that we are always under God's own authority!
In this, the teaching of our beloved Jesus become self evident, not just to us,but also to whom we serve in the church.( Colossians 3:14-17) (2 peter 2:1-9)The Church looks to meet the very needs of each other,for it is by this, that they can come to not only help,but show the outside world who Jesus truly is,and what the nature of our Living Lord represents!!( James 2:14-26) Many churches have lost there first love,( rev 2:4-5)and have looked to replace Jesus love, with there own idea of what love should be.Worse then this,they say this represents Jesus as well! We know different!
Because my brothers and sisters we do not walk to have others serve us,but rather to serve another by our Jesus in us! This to me is the huge difference between the doctrine of our Living Word,and the man made doctrine many are presently under. This to me is what the true church of Jesus Christ is made to be!! FOLLOWED!!! Not Led by man to look like Jesus!( 1cor 2:5,1 cor 4:20!!) And God's Own Word will always confirm what the church is doing,or is not doing. good question brother.hope I have helped!
In this, the teaching of our beloved Jesus become self evident, not just to us,but also to whom we serve in the church.( Colossians 3:14-17) (2 peter 2:1-9)The Church looks to meet the very needs of each other,for it is by this, that they can come to not only help,but show the outside world who Jesus truly is,and what the nature of our Living Lord represents!!( James 2:14-26) Many churches have lost there first love,( rev 2:4-5)and have looked to replace Jesus love, with there own idea of what love should be.Worse then this,they say this represents Jesus as well! We know different!
Because my brothers and sisters we do not walk to have others serve us,but rather to serve another by our Jesus in us! This to me is the huge difference between the doctrine of our Living Word,and the man made doctrine many are presently under. This to me is what the true church of Jesus Christ is made to be!! FOLLOWED!!! Not Led by man to look like Jesus!( 1cor 2:5,1 cor 4:20!!) And God's Own Word will always confirm what the church is doing,or is not doing. good question brother.hope I have helped!
