How does a persos know that he is not decievin himself?

[SpiritLedEd]

Hmmm i never thought Heaven to have multiple levels, interesting. I will defintly be studying this. Any more books that might hint at this?

What connection do studies like this have with drawing people to Jesus, as Jesus instructed us in Mt 28:19-20, which we should be spending lots of energy on?

SLE

 

[RJ]

What connection do studies like this have with drawing people to Jesus, as Jesus instructed us in Mt 28:19-20, which we should be spending lots of energy on?

SLE

If there are, in fact, multiple levels, it would be impossible to be a negative situation, and what ever level you may end up in, it will still be heaven and far, far superior than what you have now! It is not as important what Heaven will be like as it is in knowing how to tell others how to get there!

 

[INRI]

Keep in mind here, one thing, If it were not for Satan we would never sin. We get tempted or deceived by the enemy and sin or see the thing and push it away. If there were no temptation sin would never be in the picture. Can you deceive yourself? No. Not without the enemy confusing your thinking.
Am I saying I need temptation to sin? Absolutely! Again Without the enemy tempting me I cannot sin

Hi. New here, just started reading this thread this morning and couldn't stop!, because I've had this question (how do we know we're not deceiving ourselves?) pop up between my best friend (baptist seminary student) and I (raised catholic, but I'm not very Catholic anymore. I've been looking for answers from my baptist friend and throughout Protestantism).

I see you suggesting that we cannot sin without the enemy tempting us, but I wonder who first tempted Lucifer before he fell? If what you suggest is actually true, he would also have been incapable of sin without some outside temptor to coerce him, correct?

 

[RJ]

Keep in mind here, one thing, If it were not for Satan we would never sin. We get tempted or deceived by the enemy and sin or see the thing and push it away. If there were no temptation sin would never be in the picture. Can you deceive yourself? No. Not without the enemy confusing your thinking. Am I saying I need temptation to sin? Absolutely! Again Without the enemy tempting me I cannot sin

No one doubts, or at least those that believe, that Satan is in the business of Temptation and the root of all sin. It may well be, but for me, I think that our sinning only because we are tempted by Satan is a stretch. Look at what Paul says about sin:

1. Romans 7:18
For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out.

2. Romans 7:25
Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.

Because of Adam's fall to temptation, the rest of us are born into sin and become dead spiritually because sin is our nature as Paul reminds us above.
We too often, when thinking of sin, always think of the "Dirty Dozen" or "Nasty Five", staying away from those and we are O.K., but sin is much more complex and subtle than that.

When Moses ask God to show him his glory, God said that no man can see his face and live, see Exodus 33:16-23. That means no human with a sinful nature and that includes all of us.

But in 1 Corinthians 13, Paul tells us of our imperfection. We all know that God is perfect and I think that Paul is essentially saying that it is our imperfection that separates us from God and not until we die in the flesh will this be overcome.

1 Corinthians 13:8-13

8Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when the perfect comes, the imperfect will pass away. 11When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known.

Do you love perfectly and is it Satan's temptation that causes you not to?
Do you ever doubt or have a negative thought and is this because of Satan?
Possibly.

No matter what or who causes it, to God, sin is sin and any of it causes the divide between us and God.
God is perfect and we are imperfect. Anything we do outside the perfection of God is sinful and separates us from him. But, our Lord and Savior bridges that gap.

Thanks be to God for Jesus Christ because for those who are in him there is no condemnation!

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Romans 7:25
Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God’s law, but in my sinful nature a slave to the law of sin.

Thanks be to God for Jesus Christ because for those who are in him there is no condemnation!

Paul's words show us the necessity of a full steam ahead, twenty-four-hour a day (to the best of our ability) committment to being a disciple of the Lord Jesus. Without such a connection to Him, we become lukewarm, tepid believers; we look for an easier, softer way into the Kingdom and the enemy is more than happy to oblige us. We don't deceive ourselves, but, we lay ourselves open to being deceived just as Eve did in the Garden (see Ge 3:2-6) as she eyed that delicious looking fruit.

SLE

 

[RJ]

Paul's words show us the necessity of a full steam ahead, twenty-four-hour a day (to the best of our ability) committment to being a disciple of the Lord Jesus. Without such a connection to Him, we become lukewarm, tepid believers; we look for an easier, softer way into the Kingdom and the enemy is more than happy to oblige us. We don't deceive ourselves, but, we lay ourselves open to being deceived just as Eve did in the Garden (see Ge 3:2-6) as she eyed that delicious looking fruit.

SLE

I think that the best way to stay connected is to stay in God's word daily!

 

[RJ]

I think that the best way to stay connected is to stay in God's word daily!

It's not that I don't look at my sin constantly, but God said he doesn't!

 

[Montovine]

For example, mega-church pastors Randy and Paula White think they're saved. But, they got divorced, showing that they are not saved. They know Jesus forbids divorce, but they do not belong to Jesus. He is not their master.[/QUOTE]


Are you saying that so called Christians who divorce are not saved? Or Christians who fall into sin are not saved? I believe Paul was saved yet he admits the thing he doesn't want to do he does, and the things he wants to do he does not? I trust this to mean that even Paul struggled with a sin nature.

 

[RJ]

For example, mega-church pastors Randy and Paula White think they're saved. But, they got divorced, showing that they are not saved. They know Jesus forbids divorce, but they do not belong to Jesus. He is not their master.

Are you saying that so called Christians who divorce are not saved? Or Christians who fall into sin are not saved? I believe Paul was saved yet he admits the thing he doesn't want to do he does, and the things he wants to do he does not? I trust this to mean that even Paul struggled with a sin nature.[/QUOTE]

Amen! Paul was setting an example, that being a Christian does not mean that you do not sin and that his struggle with the battle within was that he did care about his sin and proof of the Holy Spirit with in him. He follows that in Romans 8:1 with: "For there is no condemnation for those who are in Jesus Christ". This statement is also proof that we continue to sin while in this physical state.

Knowing that love replaces the Ten Commandments, Paul writes the love chapter in 1 COR 13. How many of us can do all those examples of love 24/7?

With the Holy Spirit continually convicting you when you mess up, it is not that you do not look at your sin, but the point is that God said he doesn't!

 

[SpiritLedEd]

For example, mega-church pastors Randy and Paula White think they're saved. But, they got divorced, showing that they are not saved. They know Jesus forbids divorce, but they do not belong to Jesus. He is not their master.

There are a number of Scripture verses that tell us not to make such condemning decisions (Mt 7:1, Ro 14:4, Ro 14:13, 1 Cor 4:5, Jas 4:12). Remember, God alone knows all the circumstamnces of each situation and every sinner has until the very last second of conscious life to repent.

SLE

 

[KingdomSeeker]

There are a number of Scripture verses that tell us not to make such condemning decisions (Mt 7:1, Ro 14:4, Ro 14:13, 1 Cor 4:5, Jas 4:12). Remember, God alone knows all the circumstamnces of each situation and every sinner has until the very last second of conscious life to repent.

SLE

Matthew, 7:15, Jesus said: Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

16. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or, figs of thistles?

(17) Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

17. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

18. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. (20) Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

You will know them by their Fruits.

God DID Makes us Fruit inspectors.