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Not sure how you convinced yourself of that, but we agree to disagree.
Emotions
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Not sure how you convinced yourself of that, but we agree to disagree.
Active
So rejoicing in the Lord is an emotionless action from you. We agree to disagree.
God commanding Adam not to eat of the knowledge of good and evil does not negate having given Adam good emotions when he was created.
Scripture testifies that reverent fear of the Lord as a good thing.
Psalm 19:9The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether.
Psalm 22:23Ye that fear the Lord, praise him; all ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all ye the seed of Israel.
Psalm 25:17What man is he that feareth the Lord? him shall he teach in the way that he shall choose. ....The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant
New Testament;
Acts 9:31Then had the churches rest throughout all Judaea and Galilee and Samaria, and were edified; and walking in the fear of the Lord, and in the comfort of the Holy Ghost, were multiplied.
1 Peter 3:15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
So reverent fear is good; but that does not mean He has given us a spirit of fear which is totally different as one void of hope in Him. So we agree to disagree again.
Again, we agree to disagree. Reverent fear does not negate peace but a necessity to rely on the Lord Jesus Christ to do what is right and good.
Judging all emotions as bad or evil is hardly a scriptural thing to do. Sinners can have love and joy BUT not as fruits of the Spirit. If you can remember how you were before you were saved, you loved and had joy, but His love and His joy is eternal whereas the world's love and joy are fleeting. So in one respect, they do not have the character of Christ's in love and joy, but unbelievers know about love and joy because many had it in their lives at one point or another, but again, it is fleeting. It does not last nor have that value to be eternal as in taking that kind of love and joy with them when they die in their unbelief.
You read too much into that reference to include emotions as being part of the old nature to put off. There are divine emotions and then there are the worldly emotions for which we are to put off love and joy towards the treaures on earth to have ternal love and eternal joy towards the treasures in Heaven. So we agree to disagree again.
But there is joy and there is love that is of God and it is emotional whether you like it or not, because it is not the worldly kind of love and joy BUT it will exist for eternity for why the saints will be rejoicing in Heaven. I cannot see how any saint cannot have that divine emotion of love and joy in Heaven. So we agree to disagree.
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@JesusIs4Me,
First, how are you defining emotions?
First, how are you defining emotions?
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Why are you coming across as saying good is evil, no matter what, for fallen man? The knowledge of good and evil means you will know what is good and you will know what is evil. That sin when Adam and Eve did it, they knew what was good and evil because by going against the will of God to not eat from that tree, as they now know what was good and what was evil as in nothing outside the will of God is good but evil.
To lump good emotions with evil emotions is to lump the knowledge of what is good with the knowledge of what is evil as if there is nothing good at all, but everything is evil. If that be so, then where is the knowledge of what is good?
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Here's a list of Emotions, which I'm assuming you would see as being incorrect, because there should only be one column, and they are all being bad/wrong/sinful. I might move some around, for in certain instances we know according to Scripture that some can be beneficial i.e. "Fear of God". So, trying to pigeonhole emotions can get one into trouble.
You read John 11 and you will also see that our Lord was also "Glad" also besides having wept. So, is this also to be accorded to the fallen man? Should we not be glad when someone comes to the Lord? I rejoice when I hear or see a person who comes to the Lord! Great JOY! However, back to the negativity of Emotions. So if you are according exhibiting Emotions to failings of man, or bad, wrong, or possibly even "Sinful", do I have to follow the line of thought for you? I hope not. However, just in case you might not have considered our Lord and Emotions.
Now whose reasoning the why of Emotions to make them bad or at the very least wrong?
Surely not me, or Jesus, or Scripture. Yes, but if emotions are negative, or wrong, then though Jesus was tempted more then once, and tempted with Emotions and failed to hold them in, in that He showed Anger, He Wept, which is reflective of High Emotions, you could also go to the Garden of Gethsemane where He sweated blood, which is also a sign of High Emotional Stress occurring. If this is the temptation of the flesh that Jesus experienced, then surely He succumbed to it, did He not? At least according to what I'm reading in this thread concerning the negativity of emotions. If he failed, also having the Holy Spirit, how are we to succeed in this endeavor of controlling our emotions????? Hummmmm.....Let's continue on.
You really read too much into what Scripture says in this instance. I see this especially because you use that it is emotions that are attributed to man because of the knowing of good and evil. If I were to follow your line of thought then if knowing good and evil are emotions which are bad, and we have become "as God" because of the knowledge of good and evil then God is emotional and so must also be bad? Genesis 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
I realize that Emotions can produce negative results, but I also know that Emotions can have positive results as well. Now, realizing that every instance of every moment and how they affect the final outcome of a persons life are not open to us to know. Controlling Emotions can be a good thing, but not for the lack of having them, but rather that we can capture every thought and have it be to the Glory of God and in all things trying to emulate Jesus Christ. Even if it's weeping, or being glad, or any other Emotion appropriate to the moment we find ourselves in.
To your perspective of "There is no where in scripture that teaches God gave man any type of emotions. ", there is also nowhere in Scripture that teaches that He did not.
With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Nick
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@JesusIs4Me,
That is not the definition of emotions. It doesn't matter what your definition of Good and Evil is, they were told not to eat of the tree; therefore, God did not desire for them to have knowledge of good and evil at that time. There is no justifying good and evil. God has and had knowledge of good and evil, but He didn't want man to have knowledge of it.
Good and Evil is of the same fallen nature for man, this is why we must renew our minds from the sinful mindset. When a believer dies to the nature of sin, they die to the nature of good and evil that was received when they inherited Adam's transgression. We as believer are now born again into a different nature, we have a different mindset. We are now understanding Righteousness. Emotions are feeling based, but Righteousness is based in understanding and not agitation as good and evil emotions. Agitation doesn't have to feel bad, but God has not given believers a Spirit of agitation. Emotions are "any" agitation of the mind or excitement of the senses.
You are teaching the character of the unbeliever is the same as the believer emotionally and that's not true.
That is not the definition of emotions. It doesn't matter what your definition of Good and Evil is, they were told not to eat of the tree; therefore, God did not desire for them to have knowledge of good and evil at that time. There is no justifying good and evil. God has and had knowledge of good and evil, but He didn't want man to have knowledge of it.
Good and Evil is of the same fallen nature for man, this is why we must renew our minds from the sinful mindset. When a believer dies to the nature of sin, they die to the nature of good and evil that was received when they inherited Adam's transgression. We as believer are now born again into a different nature, we have a different mindset. We are now understanding Righteousness. Emotions are feeling based, but Righteousness is based in understanding and not agitation as good and evil emotions. Agitation doesn't have to feel bad, but God has not given believers a Spirit of agitation. Emotions are "any" agitation of the mind or excitement of the senses.
You are teaching the character of the unbeliever is the same as the believer emotionally and that's not true.
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@Christ4Ever,
I would prefer you give me scriptural references. I understand the differences between good and evil emotions, but Adam was not suppose to understand them.
I would prefer you give me scriptural references. I understand the differences between good and evil emotions, but Adam was not suppose to understand them.
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Staff Member
You mean besides John 11 to show that Jesus experienced other emotions, and Genesis 3:22 and the significance of it to what you were saying in Post #99?
I'm also aware that Adam was not supposed to understand them, but it doesn't mean that he didn't have them.
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@Christ4Ever,
Christ experiencing emotions just teaches Jesus came in the nature (bodily) of good and evil emotions as fallen man (Rom. 8:3). Every temptation Jesus experienced was emotionally based because temptation is emotional. Jesus could be tempted but He couldn't be deceived; Adam and Eve in the Garden could be deceived, but they couldn't be tempted. I say this because the reason the first man could not be tempted is because Satan could not affect man's soul until Satan had rights to man's mind legally. This happened when Adam sinned, which gave Satan the legal right to affect man's mind inwardly.
If Adam were created with emotions, as we understand them in this life, they would have understood the agitation of the mind that comes with emotions. If this was the case God would be the author of the agitated mind and could not tell a believer not to allow their hearts to be troubled (Joh. 14:27). Man's mind is agitated with good and evil emotions. Peace in Christ's character has no agitation attached to it.
Christ experiencing emotions just teaches Jesus came in the nature (bodily) of good and evil emotions as fallen man (Rom. 8:3). Every temptation Jesus experienced was emotionally based because temptation is emotional. Jesus could be tempted but He couldn't be deceived; Adam and Eve in the Garden could be deceived, but they couldn't be tempted. I say this because the reason the first man could not be tempted is because Satan could not affect man's soul until Satan had rights to man's mind legally. This happened when Adam sinned, which gave Satan the legal right to affect man's mind inwardly.
If Adam were created with emotions, as we understand them in this life, they would have understood the agitation of the mind that comes with emotions. If this was the case God would be the author of the agitated mind and could not tell a believer not to allow their hearts to be troubled (Joh. 14:27). Man's mind is agitated with good and evil emotions. Peace in Christ's character has no agitation attached to it.
Loyal
The OP is about controlling our emotions so our emotions are not controlling us.
So why all this dispute over emotions?
Perhaps some are being too emotional over their opinions?
Blessings
So why all this dispute over emotions?
Perhaps some are being too emotional over their opinions?
Blessings
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Maybe some of the mixed messages here are down to definition comprehension
This is the definition of emotion (just from google search)
emotion
noun
Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in Me.
John 14:1
Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on Thee: because he trusteth in Thee.
Isaiah 26:3
Until now you have not asked for anything in My name. Ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be complete.
John 16:24
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:16
This is the definition of emotion (just from google search)
emotion
noun
- a strong feeling deriving from one's circumstances, mood, or relationships with others.
"she was attempting to control her emotions"
Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in Me.
John 14:1
Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on Thee: because he trusteth in Thee.
Isaiah 26:3
Until now you have not asked for anything in My name. Ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be complete.
John 16:24
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Galatians 5:16
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Do reconsider that when God created man, he was good. He had good emotions too. Eating the forbidden fruit was to give him the knowledge of evil that he has done evil and thereby knowing the knowledge of good of what he had with God.
The problem here is that you are teaching the knowledge of good as if it is the same as the knowledge of evil; just as you are teaching that good emotions is the same as evil emotions in fallen mankind. So did the scripture lie when Man received the knowledge of good, and not just the knowledge of evil? If what you say is true, then scripture would not testify that Adam had received the knowledge of good. That would be a lie, but it is not, so therefore we agree to disagree again
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Realizing that I don't know every thing there is to know of the Word of God, whenever I hear something new, I look into it. So when a Brother in Christ associates Emotions and not just the control of them, to the fallen man. I keep seeking and questioning, in the hope that I might see the truth of the matter.
Know that it is only with great joy that I delve into this. Controlled of course, or I'd be bouncing around the house, hopping and hollering! Been known when given Holy Spirit insight to a part of Scripture that I've done that. Of course it makes the wife wonder if I've lost my mind, but I quickly come back under control.
However, I will attempt to keep my emotions in check as I deal with the subject, for those sensitive to feelings others. :wink:
Off to church!!!!!!! I don't know if I can control all my feelings there.......being Praise & Worship have a tendency to bring them out......hummmm..
With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
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Does scripture testify to the holy God in Heaven having emotions?
Psalm 2:4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.
How about the Holy Spirit?
Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
So you cannot limit good emotions to sinful man just because Jesus Christ became incarnated to dwell among us to give His life as a ransom for many. There is good emotions and there is bad emotions. And I point out that hate is not evil entirely when it is applied towards sin and evil to resist. God has not fallen and yet He hates sin and loves the sinner. So your connecting good and evil emotions to man's fallen state and to Jesus Christ's incarnation is not sound reasoning, brother.
Loyal
Its not about being with or without emotions. Its about being in control over them and not being controlled by them.
Emotions are connected to thoughts. What are the fiery darts satan shoots? They are thoughts. What does satan use as well? Why, our emotions.
Blessings
Emotions are connected to thoughts. What are the fiery darts satan shoots? They are thoughts. What does satan use as well? Why, our emotions.
Blessings
Active
@JesusIs4Me,
It doesn't say God created man to know good. It does teach everything God saw that He created was good. It doesn't teach man had good emotions. If you read the 1828 Webster definition of emotions that I've posted many times you'll understand how I define emotions. Good and evil emotions are from the same sinful nature and tree Adam was disobedient by eating. They were not to have the knowledge of good and evil by eating of the tree. If God desired to give man knowledge of good it was not from the tree God told them not to eat of.
Genesis 1:31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
Good emotions are agitative just like evil emotions. Good emotions can be impulsive just like evil emotions. There are two ways of understanding something funny. One way is intellectually, and the other is impulsively. If a person slips and falls accidentally most people laugh on impulse because it "appears" to be funny. It wasn't a laughter thought through, it was through the mind being agitated by emotions (a spirit) on impulse of sight (the senses). If the person got hurt, what was funny is no longer funny because now it requires a man to "think intellectually" about how to help. A man can understand what is truly funny intellectually as oppose to impulsively. All emotions are agitative causing impulsive action.
EMO'TION, noun [Latin emotio; emoveo, to move from.]
1. Literally, a moving of the mind or soul; hence, any agitation of mind or excitement of sensibility.
2. In a philosophical sense, an internal motion or agitation of the mind which passes away without desire; when desire follows, the motion or agitation is called a passion.
3. Passion is the sensible effect, the feeling to which the mind is subjected, when an object of importance suddenly and imperiously demands its attention. The state of absolute passiveness, in consequence of any sudden percussion of mind, is of short duration. The strong impression, or vivid sensation, immediately produces a reaction correspondent to its nature, either to appropriate and enjoy, or avoid and repel the exciting cause. This reaction is very properly distinguished by the term emotion
It doesn't say God created man to know good. It does teach everything God saw that He created was good. It doesn't teach man had good emotions. If you read the 1828 Webster definition of emotions that I've posted many times you'll understand how I define emotions. Good and evil emotions are from the same sinful nature and tree Adam was disobedient by eating. They were not to have the knowledge of good and evil by eating of the tree. If God desired to give man knowledge of good it was not from the tree God told them not to eat of.
Genesis 1:31
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
Good emotions are agitative just like evil emotions. Good emotions can be impulsive just like evil emotions. There are two ways of understanding something funny. One way is intellectually, and the other is impulsively. If a person slips and falls accidentally most people laugh on impulse because it "appears" to be funny. It wasn't a laughter thought through, it was through the mind being agitated by emotions (a spirit) on impulse of sight (the senses). If the person got hurt, what was funny is no longer funny because now it requires a man to "think intellectually" about how to help. A man can understand what is truly funny intellectually as oppose to impulsively. All emotions are agitative causing impulsive action.
EMO'TION, noun [Latin emotio; emoveo, to move from.]
1. Literally, a moving of the mind or soul; hence, any agitation of mind or excitement of sensibility.
2. In a philosophical sense, an internal motion or agitation of the mind which passes away without desire; when desire follows, the motion or agitation is called a passion.
3. Passion is the sensible effect, the feeling to which the mind is subjected, when an object of importance suddenly and imperiously demands its attention. The state of absolute passiveness, in consequence of any sudden percussion of mind, is of short duration. The strong impression, or vivid sensation, immediately produces a reaction correspondent to its nature, either to appropriate and enjoy, or avoid and repel the exciting cause. This reaction is very properly distinguished by the term emotion
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@Wired4Fishen,
God doesn't created anything in a man they must control; it would cause division within a person. A person divided in themselves cannot stand. To control emotions is to be divided. Believers are told to bring their minds into the oneness of Christ where their is no division. The fruit of the Spirit is not divided and does not need to be controlled.
God doesn't created anything in a man they must control; it would cause division within a person. A person divided in themselves cannot stand. To control emotions is to be divided. Believers are told to bring their minds into the oneness of Christ where their is no division. The fruit of the Spirit is not divided and does not need to be controlled.
Active
@Life,
Genesis 3:22
And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
It was not God's will for man to become as He is in the knowledge of good and evil. What man understood before He ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was God's perfect will for man at that time. What we understand as good today is the result of Adam's sin. If an Atheist has the same character (emotions) as a believer, the believer has not leared the born again character of the Fruit of the Spirit and have not learned to put on the character of Christ. Old things are not passed away for that believer and all things have not become new (2Cor. 5:21).
Christians justify fear, anger, grieve as well as lust. These are all characteristics of the devil and not one is mentioned in the character of the Fruit of Spirit which a believer is commanded to put on.
Galatians 5:22
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Galatians 5:23
Meekness, temperance:against such there is no law.
Genesis 3:22
And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
It was not God's will for man to become as He is in the knowledge of good and evil. What man understood before He ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was God's perfect will for man at that time. What we understand as good today is the result of Adam's sin. If an Atheist has the same character (emotions) as a believer, the believer has not leared the born again character of the Fruit of the Spirit and have not learned to put on the character of Christ. Old things are not passed away for that believer and all things have not become new (2Cor. 5:21).
Christians justify fear, anger, grieve as well as lust. These are all characteristics of the devil and not one is mentioned in the character of the Fruit of Spirit which a believer is commanded to put on.
Galatians 5:22
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Galatians 5:23
Meekness, temperance:against such there is no law.
Moderator
Staff Member
Greetings dear learned studious gentlemen
It would appear that this thread is going round and round in circles and much that has been said is being repeated over and over
Adding a personal example:
Recently there has been turmoil in my life....causing tears, intense feeling and sadness.
Whether you dear folks would see that as emotion or not emotion is irrelevant.
What is important is focussing on the Lord to deal with these situations rather than looking to self.
Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on Thee: because he trusteth in Thee.
Isaiah 26:3
Casting all your care upon Him; for He careth for you
1 Peter 5:7
With joy and thankfulness I confirm in my situation that the Lord kept His word.
Closed temporarily for reflection and prayer
It would appear that this thread is going round and round in circles and much that has been said is being repeated over and over
Adding a personal example:
Recently there has been turmoil in my life....causing tears, intense feeling and sadness.
Whether you dear folks would see that as emotion or not emotion is irrelevant.
What is important is focussing on the Lord to deal with these situations rather than looking to self.
Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on Thee: because he trusteth in Thee.
Isaiah 26:3
Casting all your care upon Him; for He careth for you
1 Peter 5:7
With joy and thankfulness I confirm in my situation that the Lord kept His word.
Closed temporarily for reflection and prayer
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