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The "Kingdom" vs being saved.

Loyal
That title is a little misleading, especially since I don't think there is really a difference. But it's more about how the Bible distinguishes them separately.

For example... all we have to do to be saved is... "believe" it seems.

Acts 16:30; and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Acts 16:31; They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."

John 3:16; "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Luke 8:12; "Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

I'm not it's quite that simple, there are scriptures that say we are supposed to do other things as well, in order to be saved. But for now, we'll start with these.

On the other hand... what does it take to be "in the Kingdom" of God/Heaven? There is only one verse where "kingdom" and "believe" appear together, but it includes the word "repent" as well.

Mark 1:15; and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."

The "kingdom" is mentioned over 100 times in the New testament, it's one of the most talked about subjects. But what does the Bible say we must do, (or not do) in order to be in the kingdom?

Matt 4:17 ; From that time Jesus began to preach and say, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."

..another verse about repenting.

Now unlike being "saved" above.... simply believing in Jesus isn't enough to enter the kingdom.


Matt 7:21; "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.

for one thing we have to do "the will of the Father".

Also just because you are "in" the kingdom, doesn't mean you're guaranteed to go to heaven.

Matt 13:41; "The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness,

Jesus taught over a dozen parables about "the kingdom"... In one chapter alone, He compared it to ....
soil and seeds (Matt 13)
a hidden treasure (Matt 13)
a merchant seeking pearls (Matt 13)
a net full of "good" fish and "bad" fish. (Matt 13)
a field with both "wheat" and "tares" (weeds) in it (Matt 13)
a mustard seed (Matt 13)

It's interesting that "bad fish" will be taken out of the kingdom. Also tares will be taken out of the kingdom. It seems there are bad fish, tares, and stumbling blocks in the kingdom...
but they will be removed at some point.

The kingdom of heaven is like workers in a vineyard (Matt 20)
It's compared to a wedding feast (Matt 22)
Matt 21:31; is similar to Matt 7:21; above... in that it says doing the will of the Father is combined with entering the kingdom.

Some people believe in predestination (a separate topic from this thread) but the Bible says some people "prevent" others from entering the kingdom.

Matt 23:13; "But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you shut off the kingdom of heaven from people; for you do not enter in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in.

... to be continued ...
 
Loyal
Some other parables about the kingdom are in Mark 4.
The sower and the seeds again...
A seed that grows over a period of time.
A mustard seed, that grows into a large tree.

Jesus Himself talks about things people do that keep them from entering the kingdom.

Mark 9:47; "If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell,

It seems it will be harder for the rich and wealthy to enter the kingdom...

Mark 10:23; And Jesus, looking around, *said to His disciples, "How hard it will be for those who are wealthy to enter the kingdom of God!"
Mark 10:24; The disciples were amazed at His words. But Jesus *answered again and *said to them, "Children, how hard it is to enter the kingdom of God!
Mark 10:25; "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Jesus did say He was sent to preach about "the kingdom". He says it's one of the reasons He came.

Luke 4:43; But He said to them, "I must preach the kingdom of God to the other cities also, for I was sent for this purpose."

Now we get to a few more requirements.

John 3:3; Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."
John 3:5; Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

There is a lot of debate over verse 5 above, does it mean water baptism? (That debate is for another thread) but at the very least it requires being "born again" in order to be in the Kingdom.

Paul also mentions the kingdom of God (to the Gentiles)


Rom 14:17; for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.
1Cor 4:20; For the kingdom of God does not consist in words but in power.

There is a lot more that could be said about those two verses.

There are of course verses that say people that behave certain ways will not enter the kingdom.

1Cor 6:9; Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
1Cor 6:10; nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

Sometimes we focus on the "major sins" in the list.. (are there really major and minor sins.. another topic for another day) and we say homosexuals and adulterers won't be in the kingdom...
But what about coveters, drunkards, and revilers?

Gal 5:19; Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality,
Gal 5:20; idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions,
Gal 5:21; envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

This list seemingly has a lot of "minor" sins in it. Arguing, bickering, getting drunk, being angry... I'm glad none of us "Christians" practice doing any of these things.

There is no caveat that says "unless they believe in Jesus", it doesn't matter what they say they believe in. If they are doing these things, they won't be in the kingdom.

.. to be continued ...
 
Member
You bring up a lot of correct things here. I look at today and see many, particularly men of the clothe, who are in fact as the Pharisees of old. There are those who spend their time actually preaching against another church rather than preaching the doctrines of their church, as if to divert the attention. In so doing they are drawing it's members away from Christ.

To believe in the Saviour is a doing word. It requires being obedient to the laws and commandments of God. Many do not want to accept that and it's easy to just believe in Him, but to believe Him is slightly different. Clearly works are also going to play a major part in any saving, Also, we will all get the gift or immortality. But not all will be in the same place during that immortality. However, all will be where they are comfortable being.
 
Member
You are asking very important questions.

Jesus never told His disciples about His death burial and resurrection and when He finally told them, God Hid this from them, Why?

Luke 18:

31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.


34 And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken.

His purpose to confirm the promises made to the fathers, (decedents of Abraham) and to give them hope of the coming Kingdom of which He would be King and to bring Glory to God.

God Keeps all His promises.

The Jews were commanded by God not to mix with the gentiles. Jesus was also bound by this rule. So Jesus commanded His disciples not to go to the gentiles; Why ?

Matthew 10:5-6 (KJV)
5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:

6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

the Jews never lost their zeal for the Laws of Moses.......remember They were headed for the Kingdom of God rule By Christ The King.

Acts 21:
20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:

What was written about the cross; "King of the Jews"

Zechariah 14 describes the Day the Lord returns.

Verse 9 : 9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.

Acts 3:
12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people,
Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus;

25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

Ephesians 2
11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12 That at that time ye were without Christ,
being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Acts 11:19
Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch,
preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.


1 Corinthians 1

17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

22 For the
Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

The Jews believed in signs and wonders as in the days of Moses The Red Sea was opened

These are signs and wonders:

Acts 2:

2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.

3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:

20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:

21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth,
a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Christians are saved by believing in the death burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ

Romans 15:8 (KJV)
8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:



Christians are saved by believing in the death burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. We are washed by the Blood of the Lamb of God. We are added to the Body of Christ. He is the Head.
 
Loyal
Acts 16:30; and after he brought them out, he said, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Acts 16:31; They said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."

John 3:16; "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

Luke 8:12; "Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

Scripture can mislead if not understood in context, we agree, yet can still mislead even unintentionally.

Acts 16:31 (NKJV)
So they said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household."

Romans 10:11 (NKJV)
For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame."

Romans 10:13 (NKJV)
For "whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved."

Acts 2:21 (NKJV)
And it shall come to pass That whoever calls on the name of the LORD Shall be saved.'

All these scriptures tell us if we 'believe on', 'call on', 'believe on' the Lord Jesus we will be saved, but is it correct? Not in themselves, let me try put it another way.

We are preaching these scriptures to a congregation, the congregation are listening to what is being preached from The Word. Now some may be long standing visitors to the place of worship, BUT some may be new to the fellowship, some even new to the faith. So they hear The Word preached from the verses above and think, if I believe in the Name of Jesus I am saved, I believe there was a Jesus and He had the Name Jesus, so I am saved. Or, a persons hears the preacher quote scripture that says 'call' on the Name of the Lord and you will be saved, anyone can think they called on but didn't call from the heart, so there are many areas misunderstanding can come in, so why is scripture not clear regarding us being saved because it is such an important subject, if we are not saved we are lost, if we wrongly think we are saved we are lost.

This is what I see, the same situation applies for both examples. 1 - Father and child relationship, 2 - Employer and employee relationship.

Admitted the father son relationship could be more loving and caring but the principle I share is very similar. It is down to teaching.

The father may say, no son, do not touch that it is very hot you will get burnt. another time, having made the first statement he may say, no son it is hot, and after that he may say, stop it's hot.

The employer may say to the new employee, this is what we make, we make it like this, this is for your safety always have it in place, then do this and that and you get the final product here. Another time he may say, I want you to make this, don't forget the safety and procedure, and later still, I want you to make 100 of this item.

The principle is that the full instructions are given at the beginning with guidance and warnings, later when a person knows what is involved, what order and how to do it safely to achieve the finished item the message gets smaller. This can also happen between different people, person-1 may say, do this to make that and give a fuller explanation, person-2 is more to the point and gives a brief instruction, both situations expect the final result.

So when we read in scripture these statements in part, we are expected to have read the scriptures in full and fully understand, in both instructions and in context.

On this topic of scripture, I know of no other scripture that gives a fuller message, everything important we should know is included in just 21 verses. When we know these verses the rest of the additional verses make sense, but if we quote the other scriptures which are in part, we must be careful, the listeners or readers are fully aware of the total instructions. Unlike in a place of worship where we can see the flock and know if there are any new souls in the congregation, a forum has no idea who may be reading what we are sharing. Preaching I feel is such a massive responsibility, not just making sure as much as is humanly possible we preach the Word in Truth, but also we don't unintentionally mislead the flock.

John 3:1-21 (NKJV)
1 There was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews.
2 This man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, "Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him."
3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
4 Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?"
5 Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
8 The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
9 Nicodemus answered and said to Him, "How can these things be?"
10 Jesus answered and said to him, "Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things?
11 Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness.
12 If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?
13 No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.
14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up,
15 that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
18 He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.
21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God."

These 21 verses tell us more than any other set of verses what we need to know and do to be saved, once we know the requirements here, to call, to believe on, to believe in makes much more sense. The more scripture we read, and understand helps us avoid these pitfalls, and helps us not to mislead anothers search heart. All scripture is God Blessed, All scripture gives us the Full picture. So to conclude I add...

Romans 10:6-13 (NKJV)
6 But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, "Do not say in your heart, 'Who will ascend into heaven?' " (that is, to bring Christ down from above)
7 or, " 'Who will descend into the abyss?' " (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).
8 But what does it say? "The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart" (that is, the word of faith which we preach):
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame."
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
13 For "whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved."

Providing we are born again John 3:3, 5, 7

And if we are not John 3:18-21

Shalom
 
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