The Ever Present Lord, Jesus.

[Br. Bear]

Lo, I am with you alway.
Matthew 28:20



The Lord Jesus is in the midst of His church; He walketh among the golden candlesticks; His promise is, “Lo, I am with you alway.”

He is as surely with us now as He was with the disciples at the lake, when they saw coals of fire, and fish laid thereon and bread. Not carnally, but still in real truth, Jesus is with us.

And a blessed truth it is, for where Jesus is, love becomes inflamed.

Of all the things in the world that can set the heart burning, there is nothing like the presence of Jesus! A glimpse of Him so overcomes us, that we are ready to say, “Turn away thine eyes from me, for they have overcome me.”

Even the smell of the aloes, and the myrrh, and the cassia, which drop from His perfumed garments, causes the sick and the faint to grow strong. Let there be but a moment’s leaning of the head upon that gracious bosom, and a reception of His divine love into our poor cold hearts, and we are cold no longer, but glow like seraphs, equal to every labour, and capable of every suffering.

If we know that Jesus is with us, every power will be developed, and every grace will be strengthened, and we shall cast ourselves into the Lord’s service with heart, and soul, and strength; therefore is the presence of Christ to be desired above all things.

His presence will be most realized by those who are most like Him.

If you desire to see Christ, you must grow in conformity to Him. Bring yourself, by the power of the Spirit, into union with Christ’s desires, and motives, and plans of action, and you are likely to be favoured with His company.

Remember His presence may be had.

His promise is as true as ever.


He delights to be with us.

If He doth not come, it is because we hinder Him by our indifference. He will reveal Himself to our earnest prayers, and graciously suffer Himself to be detained by our entreaties, and by our tears, for these are the golden chains which bind Jesus to His people.


mini sermon from C. Spurgeon.


Bless you dearly beloved,


Br. Bear

 

[Enow]

Lo, I am with you alway.

Matthew 28:20



The Lord Jesus is in the midst of His church; He walketh among the golden candlesticks; His promise is, “Lo, I am with you alway.”

Hi Br. Bear,

I know that this is not your article but C. Spurgeon's, but can you explain the part of walking among the golden candlesticks? Is that symbolic to mean the churches?

He is as surely with us now as He was with the disciples at the lake, when they saw coals of fire, and fish laid thereon and bread. Not carnally, but still in real truth, Jesus is with us.

And a blessed truth it is, for where Jesus is, love becomes inflamed.

Of all the things in the world that can set the heart burning, there is nothing like the presence of Jesus! A glimpse of Him so overcomes us, that we are ready to say, “Turn away thine eyes from me, for they have overcome me.”

Is that not like saying that if our hearts are not enflamed then we are not in the presence of Jesus?

Even the smell of the aloes, and the myrrh, and the cassia, which drop from His perfumed garments, causes the sick and the faint to grow strong. Let there be but a moment’s leaning of the head upon that gracious bosom, and a reception of His divine love into our poor cold hearts, and we are cold no longer, but glow like seraphs, equal to every labour, and capable of every suffering.

If we know that Jesus is with us, every power will be developed, and every grace will be strengthened, and we shall cast ourselves into the Lord’s service with heart, and soul, and strength; therefore is the presence of Christ to be desired above all things.

So in desiring the presence of Christ, they have not received Him yet as Saviour? Is this directed towards sinners of believers?

His presence will be most realized by those who are most like Him.

Seems like I should be asking C. Spurgeon what he means, but just in case you know what he is posting here... does this mean that we will realize the presence of Christ in us when we are most like Him? I thought Jesus said that we will know the Holy Spirit by Him abiding in us... as promised for coming to Jesus and believing in Him. We need Him in us so Jesus can enable us to live the christian life. If we have to strive to be more like Him to have the presence of Christ realized in us, we may never obtain that then, right?

If you desire to see Christ, you must grow in conformity to Him. Bring yourself, by the power of the Spirit, into union with Christ’s desires, and motives, and plans of action, and you are likely to be favoured with His company.

Remember His presence may be had.

So..... this is not towards sinners but believers now? His presence has not been received yet because we must grow in conformity to Him? If salvation is a free gift, why is it that the Holy Spirit is not? We cannot be saved and thus His without Him being in us as our seal of adoption.

His promise is as true as ever.

He delights to be with us.

I am getting confused with seeing it as an offer of salvation through Christ Jesus to seeing it as believers not having received the promise yet for coming to Him, thus denying Him by His promise?

If He doth not come, it is because we hinder Him by our indifference. He will reveal Himself to our earnest prayers, and graciously suffer Himself to be detained by our entreaties, and by our tears, for these are the golden chains which bind Jesus to His people.

All those that call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Salvation is a free gift. So C. Spurgeon has to be offering something else instead of Jesus Christ, right? He is preaching another spirit to receive which cannot be received because it must be called upon to recieve again and again to experience this presence of Christ?

But I thought the spirit of the anti-christ is in the world as the real indwelling Holy Spirit abides in us forever as the line of discernment is given out that greater is he that is in you than he that is in the world. Why would the presence of Christ need to be felt outside of us as if that makes Him closer to us than Him abiding in us? Does not the faith declare Him being in us? Are we not called to keep the faith?

mini sermon from C. Spurgeon.

Maybe that is why I am having trouble reading this, Br. Bear. Was this paraphrased? If not, the theme is opposing itself towards the title, is it not?

 

[Br. Bear]

Brother Enow,


I put the title to it...... perhaps you could suggest a more appropriate one?

You are very welcome to.... just PM me and I will change it if you like.

I also labeled it a mini-sermon, as I posted it here in the Sermon section.



Bless you ....><>



Br. Bear


ps.. I am very glad you took time to chew it all over.

and if you like I can go through all the points you made and we might all be blessed as we look unto the author and finisher of our faith , who does not move and shift like the sand of the sea, but is faithful and true and able to be depended upon, worthy of our praise and to be adored and worshipped, in and through our lives, our Rock and Redeemer, Saviour and lover of our souls, Jesus Christ the Lord.

 

[Enow]

Brother Enow,

I put the title to it...... perhaps you could suggest a more appropriate one?

You are very welcome to.... just PM me and I will change it if you like.

I also labeled it a mini-sermon, as I posted it here in the Sermon section.

Bless you ....><>

Br. Bear

ps.. I am very glad you took time to chew it all over.

and if you like I can go through all the points you made and we might all be blessed as we look unto the author and finisher of our faith , who does not move and shift like the sand of the sea, but is faithful and true and able to be depended upon, worthy of our praise and to be adored and worshipped, in and through our lives, our Rock and Redeemer, Saviour and lover of our souls, Jesus Christ the Lord.

Brother Bear,

I am not certain I can give a proper title to the article. Did C. Spurgeon have a title for his article? Perhaps it would be best to use his title, but I doubt I can see the points of it if paraphrased. Is that what it means for it to be a mini sermon of C Spurgeon in that it was paraphrased?

I would like for you to go through all the points I have made or shall I say.. queried. If you understand where C. Spurgeon is coming from in his article, mayhap some clarification from your part is needed if you know what he is trying to convey. If there is a link to the full sermon, mayhap that may be better, but I may still need you to convey his points in the article in egards to my inquiry.

Thanks.

Brother Enow

 

[Br. Bear]

When Jesus came, who did He come to? The lost sheep of the house of Israel...... and notice how often He cried while addressing them. The Scripture tells us He said, "Woe unto you...." yet this was not an angry or indifferent judgement upon those whom He had loved for so long.... but rather, tears from a heart wrenched with the painful thought of seeing His loved ones perish, because of their unbelief. Are we so different or better that we too might avoid such a cry?


Let us draw nigh.


Matthew 23:23-28
Woe unto you,
scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin,
and have omitted the weightier matters of the law,
judgment,
mercy,
and faith:
these ought ye to have done,
and not to leave the other undone.

Ye blind guides,
which strain at a gnat,
and swallow a camel.

Woe unto you,

scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter,
but within they are full of extortion and excess.
Thou blind Pharisee,
cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter,
that the outside of them may be clean also.

Woe unto you,

scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
for ye are like unto whited sepulchres,
which indeed appear beautiful outward,
but are within full of dead men's bones,
and of all uncleanness.

Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men,
but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.


After reading this post, please ask why we are instructed to 'let', to 'put on'.


Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.
And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness.
And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful.
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.
And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by Him.

Colossians 3:12-17


Brother Enow,

I will answer by writing next to your questions....




Hi Br. Bear,



Lo, I am with you alway.

Matthew 28:20



The Lord Jesus is in the midst of His church; He walketh among the golden candlesticks; His promise is, “Lo, I am with you alway.”

I know that this is not your article but C. Spurgeon's, but can you explain the part of walking among the golden candlesticks? Is that symbolic to mean the churches?

He is as surely with us now as He was with the disciples at the lake, when they saw coals of fire, and fish laid thereon and bread. Not carnally, but still in real truth, Jesus is with us.

And a blessed truth it is, for where Jesus is, love becomes inflamed.

Of all the things in the world that can set the heart burning, there is nothing like the presence of Jesus! A glimpse of Him so overcomes us, that we are ready to say, “Turn away thine eyes from me, for they have overcome me.”

Is that not like saying that if our hearts are not enflamed then we are not in the presence of Jesus? May I boldly say that if our hearts are not enflamed.... well, could we really be that close to our Lord and King, who loves us with consuming love, for does it not say, For the LORD thy God is a consuming fire, even a jealous God. Deuteronomy 4:24 and again, from Hebrews 12:25-29 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.
And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.
Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:
For our God is a consuming fire. ?

Even the smell of the aloes, and the myrrh, and the cassia, which drop from His perfumed garments, causes the sick and the faint to grow strong. Let there be but a moment’s leaning of the head upon that gracious bosom, and a reception of His divine love into our poor cold hearts, and we are cold no longer, but glow like seraphs, equal to every labour, and capable of every suffering.

If we know that Jesus is with us, every power will be developed, and every grace will be strengthened, and we shall cast ourselves into the Lord’s service with heart, and soul, and strength; therefore is the presence of Christ to be desired above all things.

So in desiring the presence of Christ, they have not received Him yet as Saviour? Is this directed towards sinners of believers? The prodigal son still had a loving father, but .... still he had to return to his father... who never stopped loving him (see Luke 15:11-32)

His presence will be most realized by those who are most like Him.

Seems like I should be asking C. Spurgeon what he means, but just in case you know what he is posting here... does this mean that we will realize the presence of Christ in us when we are most like Him? I thought Jesus said that we will know the Holy Spirit by Him abiding in us... as promised for coming to Jesus and believing in Him. Where did you go to meet Him? Remember who ran to who Luke 15:20 and, Who is He Who will never forsake nor leave you? ( see Hebrews 13:5b ) Are we not told to draw near to Him? Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
By a new and living way, which He hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, His flesh;
And having an high priest over the house of God;
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for He is faithful that promised Hebrews 10:19-23
We need Him in us so Jesus can enable us to live the christian life. If we have to strive to be more like Him to have the presence of Christ realized in us, we may never obtain that then, right? Ah, yes... we need not strive as you put it, but we can also be spewed out, neither being hot nor cold, and as we work out our Salvation with fear and trembling, we also await the redemption of the purchased possession, having only so far obtained the inheritence papers, so to speak ... yes, we have been sealed by promise, yet must run the race, we must die daily, we must draw near and be found waiting.... so, by choosing each moment of each day which way we will walk threin, we are in some way striving toward the prize.... That I may know Him, and the power of His resurrection, and the fellowship of His sufferings, being made conformable unto His death;
If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. Philippians 3:10-14


2Peter 3:18
But grow in grace,
and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
To Him be glory both now and for ever.
Amen.


If you desire to see Christ, you must grow in conformity to Him. Bring yourself, by the power of the Spirit, into union with Christ’s desires, and motives, and plans of action, and you are likely to be favoured with His company.

Remember His presence may be had.

So..... this is not towards sinners but believers now? His presence has not been received yet because we must grow in conformity to Him? If salvation is a free gift, why is it that the Holy Spirit is not? We cannot be saved and thus His without Him being in us as our seal of adoption. I am reminded here now of the seperation of the goats from the sheep..... ( see... Matthew 25:31-46 ) We must grow IN grace, not out of it, and if you are familiar with the writings in the New Testament, you may be aware of the many warnings to the congregations about drifting away from His grace, about falling away from His grace, about being seperated, even..... which one might reason that to mean that if one can fall away, or be cut off, then the opposite could also be true, that to draw near... would have a positive benefit to the one who does. For example.... 1Timothy 4:1-2 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Where does it say that the Holy Spirit is not a free gift, Enow? Forgive me if Iam wrong, but which ever way you look at Christ, He paid a high price, and although some look upon Him as a free gift, such freedom is only by His giving of His sinnless. spotless, holy life... a cost too high for me to call in argument with anyone, "free".

His promise is as true as ever.

He delights to be with us.

I am getting confused with seeing it as an offer of salvation through Christ Jesus to seeing it as believers not having received the promise yet for coming to Him, thus denying Him by His promise? For many are called, but few are chosen. Matthew 22:14 (Are you really getting confused, Enow, or are you just saying such things?) Spurgeon preached to souls... as some would classify, saved and unsaved.... can you not see the invitation in his words to both in his preaching? If we disect this sermon into little bits and split hairs over each sentence, it is like consuming a cup of coffee (do you drink that stuff?) by taking the ingredients out, apart from each other, and consuming them individually... and then complaining it doesn't taste too good! Read again, and try to comprehend next time you listen to a sermon , if you ever do, that is (I don't want to be presumptious) if perchance there may be amongst the ones who are 'the saved', some 'unsaved'... and if it is a good sermon, 'the unsaved' will get constantly wooed by Christ to draw near and taste and see if He is good.

If He doth not come, it is because we hinder Him by our indifference. He will reveal Himself to our earnest prayers, and graciously suffer Himself to be detained by our entreaties, and by our tears, for these are the golden chains which bind Jesus to His people.

All those that call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Salvation is a free gift. So C. Spurgeon has to be offering something else instead of Jesus Christ, right? I think maybe you have misundersood what he was trying to convey to his audience, Enow (Spurgeon, that is) Again, try reading it from all angles, and see that to one who has not yet come unto Him, he, Spurgeon, is putting the reason for lack of receiving on the one who is indifferent.. and then reassuring those who would venture to draw near in sincerity, the gift you speak of, even Christ Himself, our Salvation. He is preaching another spirit to receive which cannot be received because it must be called upon to recieve again and again to experience this presence of Christ? As just stated, no.

But I thought the spirit of the anti-christ is in the world as the real indwelling Holy Spirit abides in us forever as the line of discernment is given out that greater is he that is in you than he that is in the world. Why would the presence of Christ need to be felt outside of us as if that makes Him closer to us than Him abiding in us? Have you ever had an attraction (honestly, now) to a Preacher or Pastor or any other Christian, who seemed to have something about them that was desirable in respect to their charisma or faith or the like? If so, why? Are we not already one in Christ, one Body, already? Do you not desire to see Christ face to face one day? Why? Is He not already in you? Do you ever look for and wait for His coming? Why? Is He not already in you? Now, may I ask who you are? I don't mean the body I might have the pleasure to see one day, but the 'you' who you are. Have you ever or never had a longing for more of Him and less of thee? Do you yet have the complete fullness of your redemption... or perhaps like all others who love the Lord with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, you might still desire even more of Him who is coming again? Does not the faith declare Him being in us? Are we not called to keep the faith? Is there any question of this in the 'mini-sermon'? Perhaps other readers might like to answer this question of mine?

Where does faith come from?

How many mentions in the Scripture are there of the need to guard and protect from losing faith or neglecting it? Why? Perhaps we need to be prodded from time to time to keep the faith we have so graciously been given?

mini sermon from C. Spurgeon.

Maybe that is why I am having trouble reading this, Br. Bear. Was this paraphrased? If not, the theme is opposing itself towards the title, is it not? As I mentioned before, I chose the title to this thread, The Ever Present Lord, Jesus, taking it from the verse of Scripture quoted by Spurgeon to begin his sermon ..... Lo, I am with you alway. Matthew 28:20



Bless you ><>



Br. Bear



ps.... would you suggest that we ought not desire to be more like Christ or to know Him more.. or to be so filled with His love that all else becomes nothing in comparison to the One who died for us?

 

[Enow]

ps.... would you suggest that we ought not desire to be more like Christ or to know Him more.. or to be so filled with His love that all else becomes nothing in comparison to the One who died for us?

There is a difference between learning of Jesus through the scriptures in the knowledge of Him with trusting Him to do His workmanship in my life as opposed to denying that we are filled with the Spirit after having righteousness imputed on us by Jesus Christ. Matthew 9:17 & Colossians 2:5-10

This continual filling is not talking about Jesus but talking about the promise of Jesus, the filling of the Spirit for those that seek after righteousness. The faith declares that you either have Him and are resting in Jesus as promised, or you are labouring in unbelief as if the promise of being filled and never hungering or thirsting anymore after coming to Jesus is null and void.

Our witness is more than just words, but actions as well. How can the world believe the faith in Jesus Christ if we are not filled, but behave as leaky vessels?

How can anyone rest in Jesus when there is another door being offered and that is to seek a continual filling of the Spiit as if Jesus has not done what He has promised? John 6:35

Those enflamed by this presence can best apply this as wild grapes of another vine for not believing what God has done and finished in Jesus Christ. What more could be done after coming to Jesus to be filled? Where is that rest? Where is that faith?

Isaiah 5 is the word of God and it is strikingly prophetic to the falling away of the faith we see happening today.

As it is, TalkJesus would have been better off in just talking about Jesus, but when the Way has been broadened by offering another invitation as a door to the Holy Spirit for this filling, then one has exitted the Door given for us to enter into that New Covenant and are climbing up another way to obtain righteousness. That is like works that deny Him as being able and voiding faith to be naked of our wedding garment when our eyes are not only on the Bridegroom.

In any event, the falling away of the faith has occurred on such a large scale in the Gentile churches that the faith is hard to find because they do not narrow the Way back to that singular gate: Jesus Christ, the Bridegroom.

He shall be reappearing soon and just as He taught excommunication, so will the Lord reproves every child received by leaving those not eady.. behind from the Marriage Supper of the Lamb.... unless they repent by His grace of their spiritual fornication before He comes.

 

[Br. Bear]

Dear brother Enow,


perhaps you have been a little hasty in your judgement.

Let me explain, if you will....


The Body is made of members, all of whom must endure until the end. Each one faces a mulitude of events daily, and for quite a few, there are things like pressures from work, from relationship problems, sicknesses, financial issues, family troubles, crops to sow and reap, stormy seas and wild winds of adversity... and that is to mention a few.

Please remember this.*



Now, we can talk about faith. We can even talk about 'the faith' that you mentioned. Just recently I was reminded of some Scripture...

1Corinthains 13:1-13 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.
But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

(For those who are unaware, the use of the word 'charity' is often rendered love), and quite rightly so. So, the last line (for example) would read.....

And now abideth faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Please note... which is the greatest?

Now, if we look at John 3:16 , we see this.....

For God so loved the world, that he gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Notice that the WORD does not say "For God so had faith....."

Now, it does not take a Bible Scholar to read the Scriptures to see the many mentions of love and likewise it doesn't take much working out to see that the love which is charity, is very much the love we are loved with.... did you see the next part?

that he gave His only begotten Son


It would also appear that throughout the Scripture we see men and women struggling with all sorts of problems, identical to the problems we seem to encounter these days.


So let us look now at how all these three work together... Faith , Hope , Charity (Love)

The greatest..... LOVE.

Just quickly.... perhaps let us look at 1John 4:15-6



Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.




and, may I ? ....


1John 4:17-19 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as He is, so are we in this world.
There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

We love Him, because He first loved us.


So, we talk about faith.... in what, or in Who ?

Based on what, or Who?

And the same with Hope. Hope in what... or, Who? Based on what.. or, Who?


Now, will you notice that the above few Scriptures, (written to who ? .... believers) seem to be encouraging and pointing the readers to God, Who is Love. Not to faith, nor to hope. In fact the references to faith and hope are based on the love of God in Christ Jesus the Lord, having given Himself that we may have... faith and hope... as we wait the redemption of the purchased possession..... you and me, brother, and all He chooses.
Why, I ask, were folks who had it all happening so fresh in their midst, miracles and all, why was it needful to write to them again and again? And are we so much better? I know I am not... and I could probably round up a few (million) others who love the Lord and will tell you they are no better than the early Church members.

So, getting back to the 'mini-sermon' that you seem to have trouble with, a preacher was doing some encouraging in what? Love.

So, how wrong is it to focus our attention on the Lord, instead of the multitude of troubles we encounter each day?* (Remember the first thing I wrote? Scroll up a little...)
Are we avoiding faith by turning our attention constantly upon our Lord and Redeemer, Jesus Christ? Surely we are choosing what is best?

If you go anywhere in the world, you will find poeple who have faith.... but, in what ... or who? Thanks to Television, most folks who use computers can see that there are some fairly strong faith movements out there, and some persecute the followers of Jesus, the Lord and God, Who so LOVED the world that He gave Himself for us, while we yet sinners. So that kind of rules out faith as THE thing. I think you could probably find a few people without much trouble who had hope... in things like the lottery or the horse races.. in fact hope is spread far and wide ... the broad way is probably full of hope... the prisons are...... "hope I don't get caught!". So that sort of rules out Hope as the principal thing, as well.


So, dear Brother, let us love one another in His love and build each other up, and put aside the things that divide the Body, clinging onto love, looking unto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our Faith, in hope, even Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto Himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. Titus 2:13-14



But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;
How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.
These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.
But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
Jude 1:17-21




Bless you ....><>





Br. Bear



Titus 2:15
These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.

 

[Enow]

So, how wrong is it to focus our attention on the Lord, instead of the multitude of troubles we encounter each day?* (Remember the first thing I wrote? Scroll up a little...)
Are we avoiding faith by turning our attention constantly upon our Lord and Redeemer, Jesus Christ? Surely we are choosing what is best?

But by pointing to the Spirit to be continually filled is to present another door and another invitation by which we are to be filled by. That is not exactly coming to Jesus, now is it? That is voiding faith that we have been filled as promised for coming to Jesus. It is either as you say above in the quote for which I agree with, or we are saying more is needed and we cannot rest in Jesus whenever we worship Him.

Ephesians 4:12For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

1 Corinthians 2:2

 

[Coconut]

I`m going to interject here if you guys dont mind...

I fail to see the "issue" with Spurgeons sermon...completely puzzled to be honest, and that when I normally have pretty good reading comprehension ...('normally' being subjective to opinion of course

I`ve read this thread twice over...wondering when i`m going to get...or one of you are going to get...to the point of whatever the issue is lol :friends:

Spurgeon has to be offering something else instead of Jesus Christ, right? He is preaching another spirit to receive which cannot be received because it must be called upon to receive again and again to experience this presence of Christ?

If this is the whole point of your protest Enow, you seem to have missed the point of what Spurgeon
was saying. "Lo, I am with you alway" does not negate our need to [further] seek Christ...else why did Paul talk of his need to "gain Christ" and to "know Him" ? [Php 3]


Deuteronomy 4:29 But if from there you seek the LORD your God, you will find him if you look for him with all your heart and with all your soul.

2 Chronicles 15:15 . . . They sought God eagerly, and he was found by them. . . .

Jeremiah 29:13 You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart.


This applies not just to salvation, but to our on-going relationship with God.

 

[Enow]

If this is the whole point of your protest Enow, you seem to have missed the point of what Spurgeon was saying. "Lo, I am with you alway" does not negate our need to [further] seek Christ...else why did Paul talk of his need to "gain Christ" and to "know Him" ? [Php 3]

Thank you for replying Coconut. This is how we know Christ.

Colossians 2:5For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ. 6As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: 7Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

Now take note of what is after Christ Jesus, the Son, and what is after the spirits in this world.

8Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Would God have the worship place seek after the Holy Spirit in the same rudiment as the world seeks after other spirits? No. Hence, not after Christ Jesus means taking their eyes off of the Son... which the indwelling Holy Spirit would never lead us to do... not even to Himself... for a refilling or anything that can relate to a rudiment found in the world. We are filled as promised which is why we shall not hunger nor thirst anymore as promised also: John 6:35

9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

There can be no more continual filling of the Spirit for we are filled as resting in Jesus Christ to do His workmanship in us. Our eyes are to be on the Son not on the Spirit to come to fill us or whatever. That would be denying we are filled as promised. It is an upward call of Christ... not an upward call of the Spirit. One must not blur the lines of the Trinity and start designating the Spirit as the "go to" God of the Trinity where the Son should be. This is allowing other spirits to come and steal that spotlight from Christ in spirit worship... so that is why the Holy Spirit will not seek to glorify Himself but the Son, and thereby the Father. The only way we can know the Holy Spirit is by Him abiding in us... not outside of us. So how can we ask for more of the "Spirit" without widening the Way given in approaching God the Father in worship thus allowing false spirits to come? This is why John 14:6 is written and why the promise for those that hunger after righteousness has been filled by coming to Jesus.

The difference here is that as much as everyone says they are preaching getting to know Christ, it is the Spirit that is being addressed and yet the Spirit will not speak of Himself, but of Christ so... it is not by knowing the presence that comes and goes in the worship place... those are the thieves because the real Holy Spirit dwells within.. by faith and not by sight. We learn of Jesus by the scriptures: John 5:39-40

So let us Talk Jesus and not Talk Spirit.