The Christian Church

[EphremHagos]

"Does the Christian church today represent "the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth" according to the teaching of Jesus Christ?

 

[Diamondlight]

The Truth is a person, Christ Jesus.

John 14:6
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

Not some abstract representation.

The Church is Christ's body...

Ephesians 5:23
"For the husband is head of the wife, as also Christ is head of the church; and He is the Savior of the body."


...and Christ, as the head of his church is The Truth.


So the answer is yes.

If however, you are asking, are human beings, walking in our fleshy bodies, learning to walk in the Spirit, a perfect representation of Christ (The Truth), the answer would be, not this side of heaven!

We are being transformed by the renewing of our minds to become more Christ-like.

Romans 12:2
"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect."

We do our best with what we know to do and submit all to The Spirit who guides us, teaches us, frees us, heals and comforts us.

 

[EphremHagos]

The Truth is a person, Christ Jesus.

John 14:6
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

Not some abstract representation.

The Church is Christ's body...

Ephesians 5:23
"For the husband is head of the wife, as also Christ is head of the church; and He is the Savior of the body."


...and Christ, as the head of his church is The Truth.


So the answer is yes.

If however, you are asking, are human beings, walking in our fleshy bodies, learning to walk in the Spirit, a perfect representation of Christ (The Truth), the answer would be, not this side of heaven!

We are being transformed by the renewing of our minds to become more Christ-like.

Romans 12:2
"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect."

We do our best with what we know to do and submit all to The Spirit who guides us, teaches us, frees us, heals and comforts us.

I am afraid that three isolated verses (John 14:6; Eph. 5:23; Rom. 12:2), outside of their defining contexts and detached from their strategic values, are not examples of "rightly dividing the word of truth".

That is why the Christian Church, very far from representing "the whole truth", is in principle and practice a misnomer and a proud obstacle against the knowledge of God in Christ's characteristic death on the cross, a.k.a., "the tree of life", viz.: the climax of the history of God's self-revelation coming full circle to Paradise!

(Matt. 16: 13-28; 17: 1-13; 22: 29-32; 26: 26-29, 64; 27: 50-56)

Any corrections of error in substance will be greatly appreciated.

 

[B-A-C]

I am afraid that three isolated verses (John 14:6; Eph. 5:23; Rom. 12:2), outside of their defining contexts and detached from their strategic values, are not examples of "rightly dividing the word of truth".

That is why the Christian Church, very far from representing "the whole truth", is in principle and practice a misnomer and a proud obstacle against the knowledge of God in Christ's characteristic death on the cross, a.k.a., "the tree of life", viz.: the climax of the history of God's self-revelation coming full circle to Paradise!

(Matt. 16: 13-28; 17: 1-13; 22: 29-32; 26: 26-29, 64; 27: 50-56)

Any corrections of error in substance will be greatly appreciated.

I'm starting to see a trend here. It seems you are doing your best to discredit the Bible, the church, Christianity, etc....

We are humans, we aren't perfect. But we have a savior who is.
(If we were perfect, we wouldn't need a savior).

So.. if the Bible and the church aren't "the whole truth" as you put it, what do YOU think is?

 

[Diamondlight]

I am afraid that three isolated verses (John 14:6; Eph. 5:23; Rom. 12:2), outside of their defining contexts and detached from their strategic values, are not examples of "rightly dividing the word of truth".

That's not strictly true.

I can see your point however, it's not true in this instance because you haven't shown me why the context makes the isolated statement untrue. If it were indeed untrue, you would have done so instead of merely grandstanding.

Not every instance of isolated verses automatically means they are out of context. I'm certainly not about to post large quantities of copy and paste merely to bring attention to the same portion of text that i highlighted originally.

The 'out of context' card that you're playing here, only works when the verse quoted has been misunderstood having been divorced from its paragraph, chapter and book.

Christ is the truth, He is the head of His church and we most certainly are transformed by the renewing of our minds; whether i paraphrase it, quote it or have the entire chapter tattooed down the side of my leg. :wink:

 

[EphremHagos]

B-A-C,

Within the trend, the following five significant differences are identifiable in principle and practice. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" />

1.The Bible is not at all discredited but only superseded to yield final authority to God's personal self-revelation for the whole world.
2.The church is a misnomer and an obstacle to knowledge of God.
3.Christianity is another used wineskin or religion which cannot coexist with the truth as revealed in Christ.
4.All human beings are, of course, sinners without a single exception.
5.The whole truth, a.k.a., “the way, the truth and the life” is not in any altruistic claim but rather in the plain and real proof demonstrable once and for all in personal visions of Christ’s self-revelation, as he really is, in his Spirit-active, perfect and diacritical death on the cross, i.e., “the tree of life”, thus making full circle to Paradise with human beings in God’s image.

That is what the Good News is all about!

God bless you.

<o></o>

 

[David777]

Hello EphremHagos

Rather interesting proposition of yours.

Let's consider the title of the thread.
"Does the Christian church today represent
"the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth"
according to the teaching of Jesus Christ?

In reply I will state a number of points.

1) My definition of the truth may be different from yours.
Jesus Christ is the Eternal Truth.

John 14:6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth,
and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.

2) The true church as such does not have a
physical identity, it is the collection of all
believers in Jesus. It has no name, location
and is spiritual. It has no leader other than
Jesus Christ. Is it the truth? Jesus is the truth.

3) The relationship of the scripture to the truth
regarding Jesus Christ is. Scripture contains the
record of the revelation of Jesus Christ to humanity.
This scripture is of vital importance, God is the author.

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching,
for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;

Romans 15:4
For whatever was written in earlier times was written for our instruction,
so that through perseverance and the encouragement of the Scriptures
we might have hope.

Jesus is the ultimate truth, all other definitions
of truth are redundant.

 

[EphremHagos]

That's not strictly true.

I can see your point however, it's not true in this instance because you haven't shown me why the context makes the isolated statement untrue. If it were indeed untrue, you would have done so instead of merely grandstanding.

Not every instance of isolated verses automatically means they are out of context. I'm certainly not about to post large quantities of copy and paste merely to bring attention to the same portion of text that i highlighted originally.

The 'out of context' card that you're playing here, only works when the verse quoted has been misunderstood having been divorced from its paragraph, chapter and book.

Christ is the truth, He is the head of His church and we most certainly are transformed by the renewing of our minds; whether i paraphrase it, quote it or have the entire chapter tattooed down the side of my leg. :wink:

As taught by Jesus Christ himself, there are essential distinctions between claims and real proofs when one divides rightly the word of truth (John 5: 31- 36; 10: 10: 17-38). [Parenthetically, religions (including Christianity) are based on the former and sustainable faith on the latter.]
The burden of evidence, therefore, shifts from the claims to the all-inclusive works of God exclusively manifested in Christ’s death on the cross, a.k.a., the seal of the “new covenant” for baptism with the Holy Spirit producing conviction of sin, knowledge of God, salvation, new life, true worship, etc.

 

[Diamondlight]

As taught by Jesus Christ himself, there are essential distinctions between claims and real proofs when one divides rightly the word of truth (John 5: 31- 36; 10: 10: 17-38). [Parenthetically, religions (including Christianity) are based on the former and sustainable faith on the latter.]
The burden of evidence, therefore, shifts from the claims to the all-inclusive works of God exclusively manifested in Christ’s death on the cross, a.k.a., the seal of the “new covenant” for baptism with the Holy Spirit producing conviction of sin, knowledge of God, salvation, new life, true worship, etc.

Claims they may be but they are claims based on the truth of The Word made flesh, the cross and the resurrection.