• Welcome to Talk Jesus

    A true bible based, Jesus centered online community. Join over 11,000 members today

    Register Log In

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:0)

Loyal
Purity and Sexual Sin

I have several questions I would like to pose here on the subject of masturbation, and I hope to hear back from both men and women.

1. It is my understanding that the Bible does not specifically mention masturbation. Yet, it does not specifically mention all forms of “degrading of their bodies” or of the worship and serving of “created things rather than the Creator.” It does not mention all forms of “shameful lusts” or of men abandoning “natural relations with women,” or of being “inflamed with lust” for another, which I believe could be for self. As well, it does not mention all forms of “shameful acts” or all the results of a “a depraved mind,” nor does it list “every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity.” The Word says: “They have no understanding, no fidelity, no love, no mercy. Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.” [See Romans 1:18-32] So, would masturbation not fall into Romans 1?

2. If a man practices masturbation, preferring self-arousal to sexual relations with his wife, especially if she is a willing partner, is this not adultery? When God describes adultery in light of his people’s relationship with him, he speaks of those who are running after other lovers rather than finding their satisfaction and fulfillment in God alone. Is it not the same when a man runs after another lover, whether male or female, or whether himself or other objections of lust and affection which steal away his affections and fidelity to his spouse? Even if he is thinking of his wife when he masturbates, it is not love, and it is not for her, but for him alone, and it is lust, and he is just using her like any other female image (pornography) to get off, is he not? And, is he not preferring male arousal to that of a female?
 
Loyal
In the second paragraph it should read "objects of lust and affection" not "objections." I truly do hope to get some responses here from both men and women concerning the subject of masturbation and how you believe that fits with the teachings in scripture on the subject of sexual immorality.
 
Active
Such matters do belong to Romans 1, and are exactly answered by what "changes the natural use into that which is against nature" in every topic. We are to "possess our vessels in sanctification and honor" (1 Thessalonians 4). Any use outside of our what is the natural use for any member of our body is against its natural use: (for example) our mouth's natural use is for eating, and drinking, ans speaking, and smiling, and such like things; but evil men have perverted its use into that which is against its nature, which we know very well; yet most of the world supposes this perversion to be natural or normal, but it is not. And this principle applies to any other member as well.
 
Loyal
Such matters do belong to Romans 1, and are exactly answered by what "changes the natural use into that which is against nature" in every topic. We are to "possess our vessels in sanctification and honor" (1 Thessalonians 4). Any use outside of our what is the natural use for any member of our body is against its natural use: (for example) our mouth's natural use is for eating, and drinking, ans speaking, and smiling, and such like things; but evil men have perverted its use into that which is against its nature, which we know very well; yet most of the world supposes this perversion to be natural or normal, but it is not. And this principle applies to any other member as well.
Thank you! I appreciate you sharing your thoughts on this difficult and often controversial topic. I agree with what you said.
 
Loyal
Any thoughts on why a man (or a woman) might turn to masturbation instead of natural sexual relations with his (or her) spouse? Or why a man might turn to another man? Or a woman to another woman? Or any other perversion of what God intended to be used for good between a husband and wife? Do you agree with me that if a married man or a married woman finds sexual satisfaction outside the natural sexual relations between marital partners that he or she is committing adultery against his or her spouse?

I know this is a sensitive topic, and I hate to even bring it up, but I believe this is a serious problem that needs addressed. I know sexual sin has always existed, so this is nothing new, but I do believe it has reached a high incidence level with so many people having private internet access and the ease of access to seek out these kinds of things with the touch of a fingertip. I cry out to God for our children who are being exposed to so much of this via the internet and due to lack of adult supervision. I cry out to God over marriages broken in pieces because of this kind of stuff.
 
Loyal
My personal opinion, is that sexual issues are better discussed between members of the same sex.
Men should talk to men, and women should talk to women about these things.

The Bible does make it clear that sexual sins are different from others sins, and affect us differently.

1 Cor 6. (NLT)
12: You say, “I am allowed to do anything”—but not everything is good for you. And even though “I am allowed to do anything,” I must not become a slave to anything.
13: You say, “Food was made for the stomach, and the stomach for food.” (This is true, though someday God will do away with both of them.) But you can’t say that our bodies were made for sexual immorality. They were made for the Lord, and the Lord cares about our bodies.
14: And God will raise us from the dead by his power, just as he raised our Lord from the dead.
15: Don’t you realize that your bodies are actually parts of Christ? Should a man take his body, which is part of Christ, and join it to a prostitute? Never!
16: And don’t you realize that if a man joins himself to a prostitute, he becomes one body with her? For the Scriptures say, “The two are united into one.”
17: But the person who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with him.
18: Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
19: Don’t you realize that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, who lives in you and was given to you by God? You do not belong to yourself,
20: for God bought you with a high price. So you must honor God with your body.
 
Loyal
1 Thess 4 (NLT)
1: Finally, dear brothers and sisters, we urge you in the name of the Lord Jesus to live in a way that pleases God, as we have taught you. You live this way already, and we encourage you to do so even more.
2: For you remember what we taught you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.
3: God’s will is for you to be holy, so stay away from all sexual sin.
4: Then each of you will control his own body and live in holiness and honor—
5: not in lustful passion like the pagans who do not know God and his ways.
6: Never harm or cheat a fellow believer in this matter by violating his wife, for the Lord avenges all such sins, as we have solemnly warned you before.
7: God has called us to live holy lives, not impure lives.
8: Therefore, anyone who refuses to live by these rules is not disobeying human teaching but is rejecting God, who gives his Holy Spirit to you.
 
Loyal
Any thoughts on why a man (or a woman) might turn to masturbation instead of natural sexual relations with his (or her) spouse?


I know a couple that hasn't slept together for 7 years. Both the husband and wife admit to this.
He just "doesn't feel it is necessary, because they are past having children".

I know another couple that that don't even sleep in the same bed. The husband told me they haven't had
intimacy in over a year, because she was molested as a child and "doesn't really like sex".

My first wife sometimes used sex to manipulate. If you don't do this for me, then I won't do that for you.
If I didn't let her buy certain things, go certain places, hang around certain people, then I had to pay the price.
I can't blame my old pornographic habits on my ex-wife, I take responsibility... but sometimes wives don't
make it easy (I'm sure it's the same for some husbands)

My sister was married to an alcoholic man who abused her (mostly emotionally) but one time physically,
I'm sure she didn't really "feel like" being intimate with him during these times, so he demanded it.
When she didn't give in... he hit her. Me and my brother went and ummm... shall we say... persuaded
him to never do this again. He left her a week later, never to be seen again to this day. So in her mind,
all men are users, who can't be trusted...

I'm sure there are many other reasons as well...
But when your spouse is unwilling, or when your spouse is un-trusting, it's difficult.
When your spouse uses sex as a weapon or to manipulate.. it's difficult.
When you've been emotionally (and/or physically) abused by someone, it's difficult.
When your spouse gives more attention to... (sports, other women, your kids, his hobbies, his friends, etc.. )
than he does to you, it's difficult.

Not that we should use these things as an excuse... but it's difficult.

If all men are users and abusers... maybe I should think about having a relationship with a another woman.
If all women are manipulators who use sex as a weapon, maybe I should think about having a relationship with another man.

Also... sometimes men don't feel like being men. The "pressure" of being man is just too much...
so maybe I should become effeminate, or "relate as a woman" and become submissive to another man.

Some women don't feel like being women. The "pressure of being a woman is just too much....
so maybe I should become manly, butch, macho... "relate as a man" and become domineering over another woman.

... the list goes on...
But I'm not sure the reason "why" matters that much. Maybe it helps us understand them and why they are the way
they are. But it's still sin.
 
Loyal
My personal opinion, is that sexual issues are better discussed between members of the same sex.
Men should talk to men, and women should talk to women about these things.

The Bible does make it clear that sexual sins are different from others sins, and affect us differently.

1 Cor 6. (NLT)
12: You say, “I am allowed to do anything”—but not everything is good for you. And even though “I am allowed to do anything,” I must not become a slave to anything.
13: You say, “Food was made for the stomach, and the stomach for food.” (This is true, though someday God will do away with both of them.) But you can’t say that our bodies were made for sexual immorality. They were made for the Lord, and the Lord cares about our bodies.
14: And God will raise us from the dead by his power, just as he raised our Lord from the dead.
15: Don’t you realize that your bodies are actually parts of Christ? Should a man take his body, which is part of Christ, and join it to a prostitute? Never!
16: And don’t you realize that if a man joins himself to a prostitute, he becomes one body with her? For the Scriptures say, “The two are united into one.”
17: But the person who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with him.
18: Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body.
19: Don’t you realize that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, who lives in you and was given to you by God? You do not belong to yourself,
20: for God bought you with a high price. So you must honor God with your body.
I agree! But sometimes women who are the recipients of ill treatment from men who have such addictions need to hear from other men on these issues, not personally and especially not privately, but just to know if there are men who believe that such behavior is not only sin, but it is indeed adultery, because if a man lusts after another, even if it be after himself, that this, too, is adultery. Would you not agree? I couldn't find much on the internet on this subject that discussed it in light of scripture and that dealt with it as a serious sin issue, so I asked my questions here. Not too many people I know would even talk about this, and not many of them would think it was sin or adultery, so just thought I would find out what others believed on this subject. I would love to hear from some women.
 
Loyal
1 Cor 7 (NLT)

2: But because there is so much sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman should have her own husband.
3: The husband should fulfill his wife’s sexual needs, and the wife should fulfill her husband’s needs.
4: The wife gives authority over her body to her husband, and the husband gives authority over his body to his wife.
5: Do not deprive each other of sexual relations, unless you both agree to refrain from sexual intimacy for a limited time so you can give yourselves more completely to prayer. Afterward, you should come together again so that Satan won’t be able to tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

If I'm taking care of my own needs... I'm denying my wife authority over my body.
If my wife is taking care of her own needs.... she is denying my authority over her body.
Sex is supposed to be between a man and a woman... if you're taking care of yourself... It's
almost like your committing homosexuality with yourself. (You are the same sex as yourself)

My thought is that "MOST" of the time (I would guess over 99%) is that when people are abusing
themselves... they are also abusing their minds. If you're not married... you are probably fantasizing
about someone... a girl-friend, a movie-star, pop-singer, bikini-model... whatever.
Women fantasize also... in a slightly different way.. they respond more to words they hear and read...
men are more visual and respond to what they see. But women can think about movie-stars also,
there are plenty of "sexy men" in romance novels.

I suspect more often that not... if you're having sex with yourself... even if you ARE married...
you are probably fantasizing about someone other than your spouse. Jesus said even if you just
THINK about having sex with someone else.. you still just as guilty as committing adultery. ( Matt 5:28; )

I guess my question would be.... if you truly are fantasizing about your spouse... why not just go do
something about it. It's never a sin to have consensual sex with your spouse!! ( Heb 13:4; )

and lets be honest here... if we were all fantasizing about our spouses... the porn industry would be out of business.
 
Loyal
But I'm not sure the reason "why" matters that much. Maybe it helps us understand them and why they are the way
they are. But it's still sin.
Sometimes the "why" helps people get to the bottom of why they are tempted the way they are. Yes, it is still sin. Absolutely! But, sometimes people act out past hurt, as you have alluded to, or they are angry with God, and maybe don't even know they are angry with God. Or they may be angry with men or with women because of a past hurt, and it affects their present relationships, so it helps to get to the "why" for the purpose of healing and restoration. If a person is tempted to a particular sin, and prays, and asks for relief, but he or she still struggles, if he or she can get to the root of it all, and can get to what is behind the behavior, like hidden resentment, bitterness, unforgiveness, etc., and if they can repent of those and let go of the hurt that is deep down inside them, then healing can begin, and they can find deliverance from the sinful addictions which have held them in bondage.
 
Loyal
1 Cor 7 (NLT)

2: But because there is so much sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman should have her own husband.
3: The husband should fulfill his wife’s sexual needs, and the wife should fulfill her husband’s needs.
4: The wife gives authority over her body to her husband, and the husband gives authority over his body to his wife.
5: Do not deprive each other of sexual relations, unless you both agree to refrain from sexual intimacy for a limited time so you can give yourselves more completely to prayer. Afterward, you should come together again so that Satan won’t be able to tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

If I'm taking care of my own needs... I'm denying my wife authority over my body.
If my wife is taking care of her own needs.... she is denying my authority over her body.
Sex is supposed to be between a man and a woman... if you're taking care of yourself... It's
almost like your committing homosexuality with yourself. (You are the same sex as yourself)
I agree! Thank you for sharing.
 
Member
In the second paragraph it should read "objects of lust and affection" not "objections." I truly do hope to get some responses here from both men and women concerning the subject of masturbation and how you believe that fits with the teachings in scripture on the subject of sexual immorality.
Hi, Sue,
Relating the Bible to sexual practices in our society is no easy task. For example, there are many OT laws we chose not to follow and with good reason, such as the rules about diet, clothing, etc. Also, the Bible often presents major contradictions in sexual morality. In many part of the Bible, polygamy is OK, sanctified, encouraged; others, no. Samuel says that if David wants another wife, God can easily give him one. And, as I am sure you know, Solomon is credited with having many wives and concubines. Interestingly enough, that is why Martin Luther and seven other reformers signed a document permitting Prince Philip to have more than one wife. When asked about it, Luther said he could not forbid a man from having more than one wife, as Scripture did not do so. In 1650, the German parliament passed a bill saying a man could have no more than 10 wives. In addition, there are biblical laws we have dropped because they are oppressive, such as the sanctification of slavery we find in Exod. 21.
As far as masturbation goes, I think it is a normal, healthy response. God is the author of nature, and nature has equipped us to have degrees of sexual arousal that far exceed our capacity to reproduce. So, it would appear sexuality exists for purposes other than mere reproduction. I also think it ridiculous to assume that only one person in the whole world can ever appear attractive to you as a partner, sexually or otherwise. So it is only natural married couples may find someone outside of their marriage to be quite attractive and arousing.
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
Copper25 Prayer Request 6
Chad Bible Discussions 9
Shadrach Sermons & Podcasts 1

Similar threads


Top