Love the sinner, Hate the sin

[Cody]

I've always been taught to love the sinner, but hate the sin. I believe that is right for us because it plainly tells us to do so in God's Word.

1 John 4:8
"He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love." KJV

The question is, does God hate the sinner? And, if not, how do you all interpret this verse below?

Psalm 5:5
"The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity." KJV

Also remember, that even though we are all sinners, God has made a way to Salvation for everyone. His love is great because it is unexplainable how He could love sinners like us.

Romans 5:8
"But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." KJV

2 Peter 3:9
"The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." KJV

Thanks in advance for your responses. God Bless

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Re: Love the Sinner/Hate the Sin.

Cody, you've raised an important topic. I know that within myself, there is something that still, after all these years, causes me to sometimes draw back from non-believers and some believers, especially the ones who wear their sin like a badge of honor.

I've been a born-again believer for 24 years, serious about my relationship with Jesus, and still I often recoil from such people. It is sometimes very difficult to carry the message of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, very difficult indeed! Pride raises its ugly head and love goes out the window.

SLE

 

[Cody]

So God does hate sinners?

 

[ladylovesJesus]

God is love. God hates the sin but loves sinners. While we were dead in our sins He died for us. His love is unconditional.

God bless

LLJ :rainbow: :rose:

 

[Janette]

The hard road

When a believer comes into contact with someone who is not yet a believer, or who is at a different point in the walk with God, the faiths of *two* people are always tested.

 

[Cody]

Leviticus 20:23
"And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them." KJV

Proverbs 6:16-19
16 "These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren." KJV

What about these verses?

 

[Shutterbug]

Good evening Cody;

While Noah, Daniel, and Joseph are some of the best examples we have in Scripture, others such as Moses, King David, Samson and Paul were guilty of murder or conspiracy of murder.

If we love someone, we wish the best for them. If we pray for people, we wish a blessing upon them. Wherever you go, there will always be people who like you, and some who won't. Is it you they're reacting to, or something else?

I received an email today from someone who is a pastor whose sermon for today was about Islam. That word relives the events of Sep 11, 2001 in the mind of Americans If you wish to prevent Islam from spreading, would you pray for people like Khomeini, or the late Sadam Hussein? If not, then perhaps God really does not love the sinner after all. What do you think?

Cheers,
John

 

[Cody]

Good evening Cody;

While Noah, Daniel, and Joseph are some of the best examples we have in Scripture, others such as Moses, King David, Samson and Paul were guilty of murder or conspiracy of murder.

If we love someone, we wish the best for them. If we pray for people, we wish a blessing upon them. Wherever you go, there will always be people who like you, and some who won't. Is it you they're reacting to, or something else?

I received an email today from someone who is a pastor whose sermon for today was about Islam. That word relives the events of Sep 11, 2001 in the mind of Americans If you wish to prevent Islam from spreading, would you pray for people like Khomeini, or the late Sadam Hussein? If not, then perhaps God really does not love the sinner after all. What do you think?

Cheers,
John

I prayed for Sadam. Even though he deserved death, I still prayed for him. For me to just ignore people like that and say "well they deserve Hell", in my opinion, is pure hate. I deserve Hell, just like any murderer. So I prayed that Sadam would get saved before he got killed. I doubt he did, but I know God would of forgiven him, if he came to Jesus with an humble heart.

This is not the issue that I'm trying to find out though. I'm wondering if God hates sinners. I know He died for sinners, but it seems to me that the Bible says God hates the wicked.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

I wondering if God hates sinners.

Cody:

I presume you're referring to the term wicked as Jesus used it in Mt 13:49-50: "This is how it will be at the end of the age (when Christ returns). The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous and throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."The scenario is Judgement Day, the day of Jesus' return. The evil ones referred to are unrepentant sinners upon whom judgement has fallen.

It is still true that God loves sinners, but hates sin. "All of us also lived among them (those who followed the ways of the world) at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were, by (our sinful) nature, objects of (God's) wrath. But, because of His great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions - it is by grace you have been saved." (Eph 2:3-4)

Being in Himself absolutely perfect, God cannot abide imperfection, therefore He cannot abide sin. Sinners who are unrepentant at the Day of Judgement will have used up all of their chances to repent. They will go into eternity bearing the thing God cannot abide - their sin. Their eternal damnation will come from their refusal to repent.

SLE

 

[Word of Life]

1Jn 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1Jn 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
1Jn 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jn 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn 2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1Jn 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience (Adam) many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one (Jesus) shall many be made righteous.

Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Heb 5:8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;

Like SLE says, when Jesus comes back for us, he is going sort out the one's that are in darkness/which are still following sin and the ones that are in the light/the ones following Jesus to become more righteous

And we all know what going to happen to those which preferred darkness to the light.

Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Mat 22:44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?

God hates sin. So as children of God we are to follow in the same foot-steps as His son. We will never be perfect, as there is only one that is perfect and that is God. But He is always there to help us, if we draw close to Him.

In my understanding of the scriptures, ones needs to walk away from sin. You cannot know God and sin at the same time. But He will be there for us, if we turn back to Him with a truly repented heart. If we are in fellowship with God and His son, I fully believe that they will guide us and help us walk away from all darkness. It will be a daily battle.

1Jn 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

I need to hate evil as God hates evil and I need to love what God loves.

 

[Mark of Faith]

Love and repentance

Hi Cody,

I posted the following in my thread on "Grace" in reply to an assertion that God didn't love all people:

I tend to agree with jiggyfly that this statement is not true. Although the Old Testament writers often spoke of God hating the wicked, a fuller picture is seen in the New Testament. Jesus hated the Pharisee's self-righteousness, yet acted lovingly towards them, even choosing Saul (to become Paul) as an apostle.

Note also the famous verse Jn 3:16a..."For God so loved the world.." This verse doesn't say "some of the world", but "the world".

Also I'd like to refer to Jesus' teaching as written in Matthew. We are taught to love God, love our neighbours, love one another (in John), and in Matt 5:44: "Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you." KJV.

I do not believe God asks His children to do that which He would not do Himself. We are called to love all people, and so God must love all people.

I would like to add the following points:

In some instances we can see through the Bible God's people gaining a clearer picture of what God is like, culminating in the perfect revelation of Himself in His Son Jesus Christ. Old Testament writers would often view some as righteous, others as unrighteous, with no travel between the two. Often, especially in the books of Samuel and Kings, the unrighteous were described as "sons of Belial", which means "sons of worthlessness". It was the general viewpoint that these people were a waste of space. This shows Israels's viewpoint more than God's viewpoint.
As time goes on, we see that in the Psalms the righteous would commit sin, and then repent and still be called righteous, whilst the wicked were just wicked.

A much clearer insight into God's mind is given in Ezekiel 18. I will just quote a couple of verses, but it's worth looking up.

"But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all my statutes, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die." verse 21.

And:

"Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?" Says the Lord God, "and not that he should turn from his ways and live?" verse 23.

Ezekiel prophesied during the Babylonian captivity, so was one of the later books of the Old Testament.

And here is the point I am making: God hates wickedness.

But God desires all to come to repentance. Because God is all-knowing, He knows those who are His, and those who will never repent. It's not that God hates the sinners who will never repent, but hates their everlasting wickedness. He will offer love and mercy and grace, but will not force it on anyone. Hence we are called to love and pray for and share the Gospel with all those that we can.

And remember, only God is all-knowing. We are NOT. We are not able to see who will repent and who will not. For this reason we must not judge.

God bless.

Mark.

 

[Pedronewt]

Leviticus 20:23
"And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore I abhorred them." KJV

Proverbs 6:16-19
16 "These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren." KJV

What about these verses?

While God's love is unconditional;
equally true is that Relationship is always conditional.

God has always been about relationship. God loves us, but when we choose to sin we destroy that relationship. The scriptures you listed above all deal with violations of relationship, which left unchecked destroys the person--> family --> friends --> ultimately nations.

Is there such a thing as righteous anger? Is it ok to be angry with wicked deeds and those who commit them? Can we abhor wickedness and not sin? I think we can.

Can we at the same time wish for their repentance and a restoration of relationship? Yes.



Along these lines is a question my daughter (age 7) just asked me a couple of days ago. "If we are not supposed to hate anybody, is it OK to hate Satan?" With a buzz of theology and apologetics racing through my head about why there was not deeper revelation that could bring about repentance and that he is a thief that is bent on lying, killing, and destroying.... I simply said, "yes."



In Christ,
Pedronewt