How God was changed

[Keithw]

From Moses on up until this very day, the Israelite religion, teach, serve and worship a single being God-YHWH(Jehovah). When Jesus attended those places of worship was taught, served and worshipped a single being GOD named YHWH(Jehovah) = his Father. As was every bible writer. What happened???

The new catholic encyclopedia( 1967) volume XIV-Page 299 says--- The formulation one God in three persons was not established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith prior to the end of the 4th century. Among the Apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.

The above is reality folks, God does not change. The religion that came out of Rome changed him at a council. Its impossible for one to do this as Jesus instructed all to do-John 4:22-24, if they serve the god made up at a council. Then they fail 100% to do Jesus Fathers will-Matthew 7:21

 

[Andrew Qvist]

So it's wake up time!

 

[Brother Paul]

From Moses on up until this very day, the Israelite religion, teach, serve and worship a single being God-YHWH(Jehovah). When Jesus attended those places of worship was taught, served and worshipped a single being GOD named YHWH(Jehovah) = his Father. As was every bible writer. What happened???

The new catholic encyclopedia( 1967) volume XIV-Page 299 says--- The formulation one God in three persons was not established, certainly not fully assimilated into Christian life and its profession of faith prior to the end of the 4th century. Among the Apostolic Fathers, there had been nothing even remotely approaching such a mentality or perspective.

The above is reality folks, God does not change. The religion that came out of Rome changed him at a council. Its impossible for one to do this as Jesus instructed all to do-John 4:22-24, if they serve the god made up at a council. Then they fail 100% to do Jesus Fathers will-Matthew 7:21

All that God is, is transcendent to humankind. We can only see, hear, or experience what aspects of God that God allows in accordance with what we are capable of comprehending. The pre-Christian Jewish Rabbis knew of the Word of God. For them this was a Hypostasis of the one and only God. A manifestation of God (whenever God was seen or heard in the Tanakh, the OT, it was the Word). They KNEW the Word as being God Himself yet sent from God (Like in Exodus 3 and many other places). They also KNEW God was Spirit.

Now as for LORD versus Lord, LORD is a replacement for the Holy Name (YHVH) and we see this in the pre-Masoretic and the DSS Hebrew renditions, where they did not replace it. Lord on the other hand is just Adonai and this can b a titale for God or for any person who has a degree of rulership (a king, a judge, a husband, etc.)

Now the early Christians also understood (and were taught) this concept of hypostases. In fact the language of Nicea put God like this "One ousia in three hypostases). Jesus clarifies this when He says no one has seen the father at any time nor heard His voice, the only begotten (ever generated manifestation) Son has declared Him (that is lit. made Him manifest). So John clarifies this further and tells us that He was the Word who was sent from God and IS God. There are so many passages that make this clear; Genesis 28:19, Exodus 3, Isa. 48:16; Zech. 2, and more).

There is only one YHVH. The same YHVH that is called the Father that no man has known personally or can know without the Son/Word, or Spirit, IS the Son/WORD, and IS the Spirit. We did not make this up, YHVH has chosen to reveal it to us. The aspect or personae called the Son IS YHVH and is King over all the angels, and IS creator (Hebrews 1). Jesus was made a little lower than the angels and physically was a human baby born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:2,3). That being said however, YHVH (the one and only God) the only begotten Son became INCARNATE in Jesus. From conception on YHVH was in Him reconciling the world to Himself.

The one YHVH has revealed Himself in three hypostases (Father, Son, and Spirit) but forever remains ONE YHVH. Because He chose to reveal Himself in this way was for our sake not His. We see Him as Father or progenitor of all Creation (beyond what we can know through our senses), He is the Word/Son (that which we can see and hear), and He IS the Spirit (by which we experience Him and His actions). But He remains one indivisible YH VH. The one as three but to be worshipped as the One and the three in Unity. One and only one YHVH who manifests in these numerous ways is not to be divided into three separate gods to each be worshipped, that is an error which some have concluded after the Greek was interpreted into Latin.

Your brother,

Paul

 

[Keithw]

All that God is, is transcendent to humankind. We can only see, hear, or experience what aspects of God that God allows in accordance with what we are capable of comprehending. The pre-Christian Jewish Rabbis knew of the Word of God. For them this was a Hypostasis of the one and only God. A manifestation of God (whenever God was seen or heard in the Tanakh, the OT, it was the Word). They KNEW the Word as being God Himself yet sent from God (Like in Exodus 3 and many other places). They also KNEW God was Spirit.

Now as for LORD versus Lord, LORD is a replacement for the Holy Name (YHVH) and we see this in the pre-Masoretic and the DSS Hebrew renditions, where they did not replace it. Lord on the other hand is just Adonai and this can b a titale for God or for any person who has a degree of rulership (a king, a judge, a husband, etc.)

Now the early Christians also understood (and were taught) this concept of hypostases. In fact the language of Nicea put God like this "One ousia in three hypostases). Jesus clarifies this when He says no one has seen the father at any time nor heard His voice, the only begotten (ever generated manifestation) Son has declared Him (that is lit. made Him manifest). So John clarifies this further and tells us that He was the Word who was sent from God and IS God. There are so many passages that make this clear; Genesis 28:19, Exodus 3, Isa. 48:16; Zech. 2, and more).

There is only one YHVH. The same YHVH that is called the Father that no man has known personally or can know without the Son/Word, or Spirit, IS the Son/WORD, and IS the Spirit. We did not make this up, YHVH has chosen to reveal it to us. The aspect or personae called the Son IS YHVH and is King over all the angels, and IS creator (Hebrews 1). Jesus was made a little lower than the angels and physically was a human baby born in Bethlehem (Micah 5:2,3). That being said however, YHVH (the one and only God) the only begotten Son became INCARNATE in Jesus. From conception on YHVH was in Him reconciling the world to Himself.

The one YHVH has revealed Himself in three hypostases (Father, Son, and Spirit) but forever remains ONE YHVH. Because He chose to reveal Himself in this way was for our sake not His. We see Him as Father or progenitor of all Creation (beyond what we can know through our senses), He is the Word/Son (that which we can see and hear), and He IS the Spirit (by which we experience Him and His actions). But He remains one indivisible YH VH. The one as three but to be worshipped as the One and the three in Unity. One and only one YHVH who manifests in these numerous ways is not to be divided into three separate gods to each be worshipped, that is an error which some have concluded after the Greek was interpreted into Latin.

Your brother,

Paul

Paul told all exactly who God is-1Cor 8:5-6-- There is one God to all the Father. He shows there that The Father does it all-through Jesus. Same teaching found at Acts 2:22, Same as Jesus teaches all-John 4:22-24-- Only the Father is searching for ones to worship him in spirit and truth.
The religion that came out of Rome translated little errors in to fit false council teachings. This is Fact.

The Father and son are spoken of over and over as separate in many nt important teachings, The Holy spirit is in none of them.
Father-Son have names-Holyspirit-0
Father teaches the son-Holy spirit-0
Father and son both sit on thrones, Holy spirit-0
Father shares certain things with the son-Holy spirit-0
Only the Fathers will gets done. Because The Father = The one who sent Jesus and Jesus teaches that one is the ONLY TRUE GOD-John 17:3

 

[Andrew Qvist]

Joh 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me. am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness. And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

Joh 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Joh 7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.

Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

Rev 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

The intention was that I would write this in another thread but it was deleted, apparently those who control this site want to return to what the world was before the Reformation when as a believing Christian you were not allowed to have your own faith but had to have the same faith as everyone else, otherwise you got in trouble and could, as we all know, be burned at the stake. It doesn't seem like anything has been learned from our past history.

 

[Samson2020]

That being said however, YHVH (the one and only God) the only begotten Son became INCARNATE in Jesus. From conception on YHVH was in Him reconciling the world to Himself.

Thats a flat out lie.

God anointed Jesus at the river Jordan when John baptized Jesus. If God were always in Jesus as the human manifestation of God then there never was a Human named Jesus
that was made exactly like His brethren in every way. Heb 2:17 Thus no Son of God, only God using a different name to hide His identity.

Once Jesus was glorified death had no dominion over Him anymore. God had made Him so that He could die to be the Redeemer of mankind. God MADE Jesus to be sin,
God did not die for the sin of the world, His flesh born Son did. God who was the only one that had life within Himself could not and never will be capable of dying.

Re read Acts 2 it's short and specifically addresses this issue

And if this is still your stance to prove a trinitarian doctrine consider:

1 Jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3- And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ
has come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of anti Christ, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now it is already in the world.

2 Jo 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an anti-Christ.

The Spirit of God will confess that Jesus Christ came as a man in the flesh, not as God.

Every single scripture that a trinitarian uses to try to make Jesus His own Father or God His own Son has to be twisted and manipulated to make it fit the narrative.
The problem with trinitarian thought is that if Jesus was God then He never rose to the level of being the Son of God that became a God once He was glorified.
And since there never was a Son of God that became a God there is really no chance that YOU could become one too. It is a blatant lie invented by the Father of lies
to obscure the truth of God.

Jesus was GIVEN the HOLY GHOST without measure at Jordan when He was 30. Then the reconciliation ministry began.

 

[Brother Paul]

Paul told all exactly who God is-1Cor 8:5-6-- There is one God to all the Father. He shows there that The Father does it all-through Jesus. Same teaching found at Acts 2:22, Same as Jesus teaches all-John 4:22-24-- Only the Father is searching for ones to worship him in spirit and truth.
The religion that came out of Rome translated little errors in to fit false council teachings. This is Fact.

The Father and son are spoken of over and over as separate in many nt important teachings, The Holy spirit is in none of them.
Father-Son have names-Holyspirit-0
Father teaches the son-Holy spirit-0
Father and son both sit on thrones, Holy spirit-0
Father shares certain things with the son-Holy spirit-0
Only the Fathers will gets done. Because The Father = The one who sent Jesus and Jesus teaches that one is the ONLY TRUE GOD-John 17:3

A conclusion I agree with. Jesus is not God. Jesus is the fullness of God bodily. The Tabernacle not made with hands. God was in Him reconciling the world unto Himself. In Jesus the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us (dwelt meaning to pitch tent)

 

[Whendancer]

When I reflect on the Trinity ( GOD THE FATHER - GOD THE SON - GOD THE HOLY SPIRIT) it helps to think of the composition of water and how, in its various forms, is useful for different situations. H2O in ice form is good for reduction of heat, swelling, and reducing spoilage of food. H2O as steam is good for powering certain machineries, cooking, and reduction of wrinkles as well as cleaning of various fabrics. H2O in liquid form has endless uses the quenching of thirst to prevent dehydration not being the least. But, you can't quench your thirst with steam. You can't use steam to stop spoilage of food. And, you can't use ice to reduce wrinkles in fabrics. But, all three are H2O. In order for there to be a SON, there had to be a FATHER. That FATHER is had to be SPIRIT to overshadow the virgin and plant life in her womb - the SON. ALL THREE ARE AND CONTAIN LIFE GIVING ELEMENTS THAT ARE BEYOND OUR HUMAN COMPREHENSION. ONE GOD. ONE SPIRIT. ONE SON. ONE.

 

[Keithw]

A conclusion I agree with. Jesus is not God. Jesus is the fullness of God bodily. The Tabernacle not made with hands. God was in Him reconciling the world unto Himself. In Jesus the Word was made flesh and dwelt among us (dwelt meaning to pitch tent)

Good day to you, One thing for sure, The bible is in harmony. There is one truth. Your translations contradict truths i have shared with you. The being God sent, speaks at Proverbs 8 and tells all he was created. Its Gods master worker-the one whom God created all other things through, But he created that being direct-first and last. It teaches there-God grew especially fond of him, He tells all they need to listen to him. It is the being God sent= Michael.

 

[Whendancer]

Michael is an angel..a created being. Angels don't bleed. Jesus was born of flesh and blood. GOD sent John to identify GOD's Lamb to die for our sins. Angels don't die. Truth is Truth.

 

[Brother Paul]

Good day to you, One thing for sure, The bible is in harmony. There is one truth. Your translations contradict truths i have shared with you. The being God sent, speaks at Proverbs 8 and tells all he was created. Its Gods master worker-the one whom God created all other things through, But he created that being direct-first and last. It teaches there-God grew especially fond of him, He tells all they need to listen to him. It is the being God sent= Michael.

Ah! An Adventist or a Witness, which are you?

 

[Keithw]

Ah! An Adventist or a Witness, which are you?

A JW-- sharing facts that all need to think about. Did you read Prov 8?

 

[Brother Paul]

A JW-- sharing facts that all need to think about. Did you read Prov 8?

Yes I did (many many times over the years and just now for YOU). So now I have an assignment for YOU. Realizing that Jehovah God is speaking in Isaiah 48 how do you see verse 16? YHVH (Jehovah God) is being sent by YHVH (Jehovah God) with His Spirit to dwell among us,....

Plus (and this is very important. In the NWT I read in Deuteronomy 10:17 that Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords (the Lord above all other lords...one not two or more....Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords, correct?). Now I agree 100%. I take the word of God for what it says as meaning what it says. So I hope you also believe this!

Then I see that King David in Psalm 136:3 also call Jehovah God "the Lord of lords".

So when I get to Revelations 17:14 (in the NWT) and read that the reason why the Lamb overcomes the enemies of God is "because He IS the Lord of lords" it tells me that Jehovah God became incarnate IN Jesus (the Lamb). There is only one God (YHVH) and that one is THE Lord of lords and the NWT says the Lamb IS the Lord of lords. So does this mean you do not believe your own Translation? But I thought you believed it was the truth? If it is then it is saying that the Lamb IS the Lord of lords.

 

[Brother Paul]

Okay so I do not get something? 2 JW friends of mine insist they do all they do in the name of Jehovah God. Does this sound right? All their teaching and all their works are done in His name. But the NWT tells us that whatsoever we do in word or deed to do it in the name of Jesus? What? They refuse to obey their NWT?

 

[Keithw]

Yes I did (many many times over the years and just now for YOU). So now I have an assignment for YOU. Realizing that Jehovah God is speaking in Isaiah 48 how do you see verse 16? YHVH (Jehovah God) is being sent by YHVH (Jehovah God) with His Spirit to dwell among us,....

Plus (and this is very important. In the NWT I read in Deuteronomy 10:17 that Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords (the Lord above all other lords...one not two or more....Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords, correct?). Now I agree 100%. I take the word of God for what it says as meaning what it says. So I hope you also believe this!

Then I see that King David in Psalm 136:3 also call Jehovah God "the Lord of lords".

So when I get to Revelations 17:14 (in the NWT) and read that the reason why the Lamb overcomes the enemies of God is "because He IS the Lord of lords" it tells me that Jehovah God became incarnate IN Jesus (the Lamb). There is only one God (YHVH) and that one is THE Lord of lords and the NWT says the Lamb IS the Lord of lords. So does this mean you do not believe your own Translation? But I thought you believed it was the truth? If it is then it is saying that the Lamb IS the Lord of lords.

No matter what Jesus is not YHWH--When he returned to heaven he sat at Gods right hand. He did not sit at his own right hand. God is YHWH. God is mentioned separate of Jesus over and over in the NT. Like at Rev1:1--A revelation of Jesus Christ which God gave to him. God did not say-here me have a revelation. The Father alone is YHWH.

 

[Brother Paul]

No matter what Jesus is not YHWH--When he returned to heaven he sat at Gods right hand. He did not sit at his own right hand. God is YHWH. God is mentioned separate of Jesus over and over in the NT. Like at Rev1:1--A revelation of Jesus Christ which God gave to him. God did not say-here me have a revelation. The Father alone is YHWH.

Yes I said that. YHVH, the creator, as the Son/the Word became incarnate IN JESUS. He IS the King of all the angels (NWT Hebrews 1) but Jesus (the human baby born in Bethlehem of Judea) was MADE a little lower than the angels (NWT Hebrews 2). YHVH, the Word or Son, was sent by YHVH in heaven (called the Father), and tabernacled in that human body. After the resurrection they became one (as the Lamb) and yes YHVH was in Christ. That's why He is both Son of Man and Son of God (the hypostatic union). God and man as one in Him.

Now this is what YHVH says would happen and in the NWT when YHVH (Jehovah God) is speaking in Isaiah 48 in verse 16 He tells YOU that He is being sent with YHVHs Spirit. But you do not believe what it says!?! And in the NWT it says Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords but as the Lamb He defeats Satan's armies because as the Lamb He IS the Lord of lords. In Greek, the personal pronoun "he" is referring to the Lamb. So do you believe what the NWT says or not? THE LAMB defeats Satan because He IS the Lord of lords. Your bible says it is true...what do you say?

 

[Samson2020]

Yes I said that. YHVH, the creator, as the Son/the Word became incarnate IN JESUS. He IS the King of all the angels (NWT Hebrews 1) but Jesus (the human baby born in Bethlehem of Judea) was MADE a little lower than the angels (NWT Hebrews 2). YHVH, the Word or Son, was sent by YHVH in heaven (called the Father), and tabernacled in that human body. After the resurrection they became one (as the Lamb) and yes YHVH was in Christ. That's why He is both Son of Man and Son of God (the hypostatic union). God and man as one in Him.

Now this is what YHVH says would happen and in the NWT when YHVH (Jehovah God) is speaking in Isaiah 48 in verse 16 He tells YOU that He is being sent with YHVHs Spirit. But you do not believe what it says!?! And in the NWT it says Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords but as the Lamb He defeats Satan's armies because as the Lamb He IS the Lord of lords. In Greek, the personal pronoun "he" is referring to the Lamb. So do you believe what the NWT says or not? THE LAMB defeats Satan because He IS the Lord of lords. Your bible says it is true...what do you say?

Total gibberish!

 

[Brother Paul]

Total gibberish!

So just will not address what the NWT actually says, huh? That defines you, The Lamb IS the Lord of lords according to your Bible translation, so is it true or not?

 

[Samson2020]

The Lamb IS the Lord of lords according to your Bible translation, so is it true or not?

That part is true. However it is the Lamb that takes the book from the hand of God and is the only one able to open the seals thereof, as He was the one who was slain.
God does not open the book the Lamb does. God was not slain. Jesus was.
Your trinitarian wrestling of scripture will never sit well with Holy Ghost filled, and taught, children of God as they know better. They know that they are the BROTHERS of Jesus
and the SONS of GOD. They are the kings of the King, and lords of the Lord. And the only true God is the LORD of the Lord, and the Father of ALL sons including Jesus.

There will always be division on this point and it has been my experience that those who support trinitarian doctrine will defend it to the death, usually the death of the
anti-trinitarian, as so many during the Catholic age found out. Truth is always trying to be exterminated to prevent man from understanding and acquiring what God has for
them. Satan does a good job muddying the waters and that indeed is his job.

 

[Brother Paul]

That part is true. However it is the Lamb that takes the book from the hand of God and is the only one able to open the seals thereof, as He was the one who was slain.
God does not open the book the Lamb does. God was not slain. Jesus was.
Your trinitarian wrestling of scripture will never sit well with Holy Ghost filled, and taught, children of God as they know better. They know that they are the BROTHERS of Jesus
and the SONS of GOD. They are the kings of the King, and lords of the Lord. And the only true God is the LORD of the Lord, and the Father of ALL sons including Jesus.

There will always be division on this point and it has been my experience that those who support trinitarian doctrine will defend it to the death, usually the death of the
anti-trinitarian, as so many during the Catholic age found out. Truth is always trying to be exterminated to prevent man from understanding and acquiring what God has for
them. Satan does a good job muddying the waters and that indeed is his job.

So IF Jehovah God IS the Lord of lords (which I totally believe) but the Lamb IS the Lord of lords (Which I totally believe) and there cannot be two Lord's of lords, then the Lamb is Jehovah God robed in flesh. Read Revelations 17:14 for yourself out loud over and over....