Join Us Today!

Join our non-denominational community with 10,000+ members and more than 50,000 monthly visitors today. Engage in bible discussions, studies, prayer support and friendly fellowship.

  1. Prayer Requests

    New Community Design

    Thinking about doing a refresh design for Talk Jesus community here, possibly using a different software platform as well to replace the current. It'll still remain a "forum" software nonetheless. Please vote at this poll and share your feedback.

    View Poll

    Dismiss Notice
  2. Featured Thread

    There is a lot of noise, lots of "religions" and beliefs out there to confuse anyone. But, Jesus is real. He loves you, He's ready to forgive you for all your sins and make your heart His dwelling place. Read about God's characteristics and attributes and get to know the real Jesus today.

    How do I accept Jesus as my Savior?
    How To Be Friends With God
    Why believe in Christianity?
    The Attributes of God

    View the Seeking Jesus forum

    Dismiss Notice
  3. Prayer Requests

    Facing Our Loneliness

    Everyone has lonely moments in life, but when loneliness begins to define our lives, it causes serious problems. We compromise our principles to try to fill the emotional emptiness. We choose behavior that harms our health, relationships, and finances. The consequences can be devastating. Learn how God desires to fulfill every longing you have for meaningful connection.

    View This Discussion

    Dismiss Notice

Hell? What is it? Is it real? Is it eternal?

Discussion in 'Ethics & Morality' started by redeemed4life, Dec 15, 2012.

Random Thread
  1. Sometimes there are movies and tv shows that depict hell as a certain reality, Satan ruling hell, hell as being a place of sinful fun, and people escaping it. But, when I read the Bible none of what was said above is actually the truth of what it really is. Hell is the place that was made for Satan and his angels that followed him and people will join them if they refuse to put their faith in Jesus Christ. Satan will not rule hell, but Jesus will. Hell is not a place of sinful fun, but of conscious torment and gnashing of teeth. People will not have a second chance to choose to accept Jesus Christ, for Hebrews 9:27 says, "Just as people are destined to die once, and after to face judgement." The topic of Hell is talked about the most by Jesus Christ himself. and it is a very real place. People who go to Hell will be there for an eternity and it will not cease. They will be conscious and feel pain of the constant burning flames of Hell. When we think of eternity, we sometimes think of a long period of time, but we fail to see that eternity is forever. Are we concerned for our friends and family who have not chosen Jesus Christ and are heading there? Many people say that why would a loving God send people to everlasting torment. God actually doesn't send anyone to Hell. But, the people who don't accept Jesus Christ, choose for themselves where they go. God doesn't want anyone to perish, but for all people to come to Him. The truth is a few will experience eternity with God, and many are headed for destruction. There is a narrow door, one way to everlasting life, and that is by Jesus Christ. All other religions, ideologies, and philosophies are a dead end and will lead to Hell.

    I'm saying all this because I'm not concerned as I should be for those people who are perishing. When I pass someone on the street, and have been given the discernment to see that they are facing God's wrath and do nothing about it, I'm concerned. When we have been given gifts from God, and not use them we are a loud sounding gong in God's ears, because we are not showing love towards them, we are doing nothing. Does anyone else struggle with sharing their faith to non-Christians and functioning in their gifts?

    What are your thoughts?
  2. #2 Eric E Stahl, Dec 15, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2012
    coldest part of Hell

    The following passage describes the coldest part of hell. This is where your soul and spirit go when you die if you have not humbled yourself before God and asked Him to forgive your sins. Later there will be a judgment of your actions during your life to determine your degree of damnation. Some people will be sent to a hotter part of hell than others. Hell is the lava in the center of the earth originally created for the Devil and the angels who chose to follow the Devil in revolt against God. Those humans who join the Devil’s revolt against God will also be cast into the lake of fire in the center of the earth with the Devil at the great white throne judgment. The Bible declares that we are already condemned until we repent of our sins and ask Jesus to come into our hearts.

    Luke 16:19–31 KJV
    19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine
    linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
    20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
    21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
    22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
    23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
    24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
    25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.


    26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
    27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father’s house:
    28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
    29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
    30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
    31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

    Luke describes hell as a place of flaming hot torment. The rich man described in this passage is still alive in hell today, two thousand years later. He will stay there until the great white throne judgment at the end of the one thousand year kingdom age when Jesus rules the earth.
    That holding area is actually the coolest part of hell. After the great white throne judgment, those who have not been forgiven will each be thrown into the lake of fire in the center of the earth where they will suffer forever without hope of redemption. They will be separated from God forever.
    You may not believe there is a hell. If that is the case, ask God to help you through your disbelief, because hell is a real place.
  3. Reedemed for life sorry but that is one of the most made up doctrine of satan to accuse our loving God as a cruel God. Cause to be honest, let me put it like this. Lets say someone did the most evil thing to your loved one or even to you. Think about the most cruelest thing someone can do. Know they get caught and lets say they tell you that you can make the punishment. Lets say, God forbid, you say kill them. That would be crul right. Yes i believe so. But there is no word to describe if u would say start burning him little by littl every 2hrs till he dies.

    Now this man made idea of hell says that people would be there for eternity. Makes absolutely no sense. Yes the word hell comes up, nobody takes their time to study what that means. Or even when it write forever and everlasting. I hope that helps.
  4. e·ter·nal
    Lasting or existing forever; without end or beginning.
    (of truths, values, or questions) Valid for all time; essentially unchanging.
    everlasting - perpetual - timeless - undying - perennial

    If one were to be eternally punished in hell then wouldn't they be there now seeing that there is no beginning to eternal?
  5. Eternal like in Jude 7 means etrnally gone. When we die or you loose a car you lose it forever it not coming back. Doesnt mean your car is somewhere else, just means its lost in your sight. Sodom and Gommorah is not burning today somewhere in Iran right now right. Ill put more texts later on everlasting and forever and eternal.

    Its made up by the deceiver so he can acccuse our God of being cruel.
  6. #6 B-A-C, Dec 18, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2012
    Doing a quick search on "hell" returns these verses.

    Matt 5:22 "But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, 'You good-for-nothing,' shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, 'You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.
    Matt 5:29 "If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.
    Matt 5:30 "If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.
    Matt 10:28 "Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
    Matt 18:9 "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.
    Matt 23:15 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you travel around on sea and land to make one proselyte; and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
    Matt 23:33 "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
    Mark 9:43 "If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life crippled, than, having your two hands, to go into hell, into the unquenchable fire,
    Mark 9:45 "If your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life lame, than, having your two feet, to be cast into hell,
    Mark 9:47 "If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell,
    Luke 12:5 "But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!
    James 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, the very world of iniquity; the tongue is set among our members as that which defiles the entire body, and sets on fire the course of our life, and is set on fire by hell.
    2Peter 2:4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment;

    From the verses above, it seems hell is a place for evil/wicked people and God has the power to send people there. Something else I thought was interesting was not only people can be imprisoned there, but angels also (2 Peter 2:4) I suppose this makes sense as satan is an angel himself.

    Matt 11:23 "And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You will descend to Hades; for if the miracles had occurred in Sodom which occurred in you, it would have remained to this day.
    Matt 16:18 "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it.
    Luke 10:15 "And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You will be brought down to Hades!
    Luke 16:23 "In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom.
    Acts 2:31 he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ, that HE WAS NEITHER ABANDONED TO HADES, NOR DID His flesh SUFFER DECAY.
    Rev 1:18 and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades.
    Rev 6:8 I looked, and behold, an ashen horse; and he who sat on it had the name Death; and Hades was following with him. Authority was given to them over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by the wild beasts of the earth.
    Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds.
    Rev 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.

    It seems Luke 16 is the only place that says Hades is a place of torment specifically, but even so, i sounds like a rather unpleasant place. In Rev 20 we see that Hades "gives up its dead" so that they can be judged.

    In Rev 20; we also see that Hades will be cast into the Lake of Fire.

    I am including the context verses below so that anyone doesn't get the idea that because Hades has given up its dead that no one will be thrown into the Lake of Fire.

    Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds.
    Rev 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.
    Rev 20:15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

    I also thought it was interesting that the specific words hell and hades only appear in the NT, however Jesus himself used both words even at other times he used the words sheol or the grave. There is a place called the "lower parts of the earth" also.

    Ezek 26:20 then I will bring you down with those who go down to the pit, to the people of old, and I will make you dwell in the lower parts of the earth, like the ancient waste places, with those who go down to the pit, so that you will not be inhabited; but I will set glory in the land of the living.
    Ezek 32:24 "Elam is there and all her hordes around her grave; all of them slain, fallen by the sword, who went down uncircumcised to the lower parts of the earth, who instilled their terror in the land of the living and bore their disgrace with those who went down to the pit.
    Eph 4:9 (Now this expression, "He ascended," what does it mean except that He also had descended into the lower parts of the earth?

    Good idea...
    Both of these are from Matt 5:22,

    A primary word; "fire" (literally or figuratively, specifically lightning): - fiery, fire.

    Of Hebrew origin ([H1516] and [H2011]); valley of (the son of) Hinnom; gehenna (or Ge-Hinnom), a valley of Jerusalem, used (figuratively) as a name for the place (or state) of everlasting punishment: - hell.

    שׁאל שׁאול
    she'ôl she'ôl
    sheh-ole', sheh-ole'
    From H7592; hades or the world of the dead (as if a subterranian retreat), including its accessories and inmates: - grave, hell, pit.

    Many times these words are used interchangably. I have heard it explained something like this.

    I may tell my kids...
    Go to your room, or maybe go sit in the back seat of the car.
    Perhaps I have said these words to them before several times.
    But one day I say.. go sit in the car. I don't say "the back seat" but yet they know where to sit. I may say, "Go in the house and get your homework done and don't come out until it's done." I didn't say go to your bedroom, yet they knew where I was talking about.

    Some of these places are physical places, the name of a city of valley, for example.
    Places like Heaven and hell are hard to quantify whether they are entirely physical, spiritual or both.

    The thought is, some of these places are similar or may be near each other (for example shoel may include Abraham's bosom and Hades) like two different rooms in a house.

    For example Abraham's bosom in Luke 16:23
    Apparently a primary word; the bosom; by analogy a bay: - bosom, creek.

    It is inferred that a bay is part of a larger body of water.

    The Lake of fire is mentioned 5 times in the Bible, all of them in Revelation.

    Rev 19:20; Rev 20:10; Rev 20:14; Rev 20:15; Rev 21:8
    It is generally accepted the Lake of Fire is NOT hades or hell. In fact we see that hell itslef will be cast into the Lake of Fire in Rev 20:14.

    I have heard it explained that hell is a temporary place, much like jail.
    the Lake of Fire is a permanent place, much like a prison.

    Hell itself appears to be a place of flames, fire torment and agony.
    Luk 16:24 "And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.'
    Also see Matt 5:22 and Matt 18:9 (fiery hell)

    Many believe the reference to "unquenchable fire" in verses like Matt 3:12 and Luke 3:17 to also be references to hell.
    In verses like 1Cor 7:9 the word "burn" may have a double meaning. We may 'burn' with desire, but we might also 'burn in hell' because of it. (Mark 9:43)

    There are yet other verses that talk about a "place" or weeping and torment, of gnashing of teeth and a fiery furnace. Some say these verses aren't talking about hell, but if not, I have to ask what place is this?

    Matt 13:42 and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
    Matt 13:50 and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
    Matt 22:13 "Then the king said to the servants, 'Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'
    Matt 24:51 and will cut him in pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
    Matt 25:30 "Throw out the worthless slave into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
    Luke 13:28 "In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but yourselves being thrown out.

    as a side note: some ask, how can a place of fiery flames also be a place of darkness?
    Those who know me well know I was a fireman for 10 years, fires in enclosed spaces are often so full of black sooty smoke you can't see your hand in front of your face. Much less any fire that may be in the house.
    Another answer is, God is God, he can do whatever he wants. He may just make "invisible or flameless" fire.

    It may not be a physical place, but I would think it would be a spiritual place at least. Luke 16 and Lazarus may have been a parable, but parables are often based on true stories and things that happen in "real life" that people can relate to. You never see a parable based on mythical being, or science fiction, or some fantasy world that people can not relate to.

    Be that as it may, even discounting the parable of Lazarus, I would hate to get too caught up in one verse about hell. Many a false doctrine is built upon "a single scripture". I have posted literally dozens of other verses about hell. We should probably take those into consideration as well.

    Some believe the parable of Lazarus to be based on actual events that happened while Jesus' friend Lazarus was dead (John 11:39)

    You know what Satan would like more than portraying God as evil, portraying God as all love and no justice and persuading people there is no hell and therefore nothing to be saved from.
  7. #7 B-A-C, Dec 18, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2012
    As for God being all love and nothing else. This too is a lie of Satan.

    Matt 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

    Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

    Rom 2:5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

    Eph 5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.

    Rev 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

    There are many more scriptures along these lines. The story of Sodom & Gomorrah, of the Egyptians following the Israelite s across the Red Sea, of Elijah and the prophets of Baal, Joshua and the battle of Jericho many others caused by "the God of love".

    God is love yes, but he Holy and just also.
  8. By rules of the Jews in Jesus' time the telling of a parable had to be declared a parable, as it is today. Telling it otherwise is considered a lie. Rabbinical writings sometimes utilize (include, couch, embrace) popular parables, but great care is used to perfectly differentiate a true story from a parable that might or might not be based on a true account. Sometimes a true account becomes a parable simply by exaggerating one fact of a true case in order to teach a higher principle. Jesus knew how to tell the truth, never representing truth through use of a lie however tiny, though didn't always provide the keys to understanding why a particular parable had a New Covenant application.

    Now, Jesus taught directly concerning the reality of a physical place called Hell in English. The Greek used was haides, an unseen place for departed souls, the equivalent of the Hebrew sheowl. Jesus adequately described the nature of that place by whichever name one prefers. I suspect there is a sign at the mouth of Hell listing all names of the p[lace in every language, like the sign over Jesus on the cross. There will be no doubt in the mind of anyone entering the place. He also pointed out some unexpected causes of people going there, like the rich man in Luke 16:23, whose only fault was to dine well while neglecting the beggar at his doorstep. Of course, we learn from the whole of scriptures that fine dining by itself isn't what makes Hell one's eternal address. It's the dwelling place of the wicked, those that rebel against God, who by default choose Hell by remaining a Child of Satan. Satan's whole family is authorized to go nowhere else, and in the end all to be thrown into the lake burning with fire, including those not having died while in the flesh, but lived to appear in the Judgment. The dead will be resurrected just like the Children of God, except without having a glorified body displaying complete innocence. Sinner's old fleshly ID will be brought back in all its awfulness, no longer subject to decay, not subject to 'nothingness'.

    The "old fashioned" fire and brimstone preaching was and remains effective to wake up lost sinners. Jesus did that, teaching about Hell, but also preaching how to avoid it. Jesus laid it out well this way in Matthew 9:[5] For whether is easier, to say, Thy sins be forgiven thee; or to say, Arise, and walk?
    [6] But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house.

    Is one easier to believe and act on than the other? Is it perhaps easier to believe you might end up burning in that lake if you keep living the same as always? Or would it be easier to first believe in salvation by Jesus? Salvation from what? Sin? What is the potential side effect of keeping the sins? Why might someone first believe one or the other to the exclusion of one? But when combining both scenarios a hearer is presented with the problem and the solution, making it possible to comprehend both in a balanced manner. So it is that people can come to the point of fearing an eternity of suffering because of unbelief (which always leads to sin), believing in Jesus as their only hope.
  9. Just a thought.....

    in all the parables there is never mentioned a specific person...

    ex...a certain man had 2 sons, a sower went out to sow, a woman lost a coin, and so on

    however, Jesus mentions Lazarus by name... "a certain beggar named Lazarus..." (I believe because he was a real person)
  10. Consider that much later, after Jesus spoke on earth, Jewish rabbis began teaching with parables, all used to try explaining Hebrew Bible accounts and extracting lessons from them. Often those more recent parables don't really fit the actual biblical accounts, but serve another purpose besides biblical accuracy. Actual names were used in them. Yet, the apostles recognized Jesus, before the time of the rabbinical writings was teaching in parables, and that unlike more modern parables were hard to understand. People could understand the underlying story, such as a sower spreading seeds, but needed help relating that to a spiritual lesson. The best most non-Christians can do with such tales is to make some humanistic lesson out of them.

    Looking at the way Jesus taught, each parable, without assigning a particular identity people would be required to relate to, can easily rest in each hearer as applicable to someone they know that might fit the story. Putting a name to the story can easily cause people to get lost in the details. But obviously the Lazarus character was a matter of local news, to which all hearers could instantly relate without upsetting the lesson. Other parables Jesus used could also have related to actual persons the hearers could more easily associate the stories with, being happenings not so ancient as they are for us to relate to.

    What Jesus taught about Hell and eternal damnation can't logically be put off to some other meaning unless that meaning is later revealed. No other meanings are indicated in the scriptures. Otherwise, what is taught can't be called truth. The lesson could then be used to teach conflicting moral codes. Since we know the mind of Christ is single, not wavering, the recorded lessons must be taken not metaphorically, but as true object lessons that have singular meanings as stated in the scriptures.
  11. i came across a man on facebook who came out of the occult 10 years ago and he has been to the outer darkeness.
    He described it as cold and terrifying.
    He has not been to the abyss and wouldn't go, so as such he wasn't trusted. God called him out of that mess and since then he is still recovering but God has him working for him now.

    personally i believe that hell is not eternal, but if you can imagine orbiting a black hole, and your soul enters the black hole one microstate at a time (think quantum computers).. well, you can imagine.. its going to feel like eternity isn't it.
  12. #12 Eric E Stahl, Dec 27, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2012
    Matthew 23:14 there are degrees of damnation. Some people will be sent to a hotter part of the lake of fire in the center of the earth for eternity with no hope of escape.

Share This Page

Users Who Have Read This Thread (Total: 0)