• Welcome to Talk Jesus

    A true bible based, Jesus centered online community. Join over 11,000 members today

    Register Log In

Familiar lines

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:0)

Member
Was Jesus concerned primarily with the stability of families, or was he more concerned with the brotherhood of man?

This is something he said about his roll in the family

Matthew 10:34-36
34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn "'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law- 36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'

It doesn't sound like that he was concerned about his spirit breaking up the family unit.

He also said this about his own mother and brothers

Matthew 12:46-50
46While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to him. 47Someone told him, "Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you." 48He replied to him, "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?" 49Pointing to his disciples, he said, "Here are my mother and my brothers. 50For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother."

He seems to think that those who do Gods will are a true family, so he doesn't seem to care about the importance that people put on family.
 
Loyal
What is a family? What makes a family different from everyone else in the world? Love. (not to be confused with lust and sex)

There are Christians that are closer to me than my own flesh and blood. Christians that I trust more than some of my own flesh and
blood. Christians that have stood by me when my own family didn't.

The world today is all about hook-ups and "what comes natural". Not real love, not real family. Let's all just have sex with
each other and do whatever feels good. If we stay friends tomorrow, fine. If not, too bad for you. Family doesn't mean
anything to the world anymore. Friendships are fake and shallow, and frankly so are most "romantic" relationships.

There's a comedian on the internet who's always talking about "people at wal*mart". Not very edifying, but kind of funny.
One of her newest videos talks about people who have their dogs in a stroller, and their kids on a leash. I thought it was
funny until I saw it in real life.

Let's have men with men... women with women... let's have pets be our children. Let's be gay and raise our kids to value
"sexual preferences" more than love and family. Let's teach them gender doesn't matter, and who you have sex with doesn't
matter. Let's teach them that real relationships and real love doesn't even exist.

All that matters is... YOU.. look out for number one. I have some friends who aren't Christians, but usually we hang in different
circles. I don't do strip clubs and bars anymore. Most of them are single, divorced or in bad marriages... they leave their
kids and spouse at home (or with someone else) while they go hang with the boys and have a few beers.

Then they wonder why life is so messed up. Their marriages are messed up, and their kids are more interested in video games than anything with.. "family".
 
Member
What is a family? What makes a family different from everyone else in the world? Love. (not to be confused with lust and sex)

There are Christians that are closer to me than my own flesh and blood. Christians that I trust more than some of my own flesh and
blood. Christians that have stood by me when my own family didn't.

The world today is all about hook-ups and "what comes natural". Not real love, not real family. Let's all just have sex with
each other and do whatever feels good. If we stay friends tomorrow, fine. If not, too bad for you. Family doesn't mean
anything to the world anymore. Friendships are fake and shallow, and frankly so are most "romantic" relationships.

There's a comedian on the internet who's always talking about "people at wal*mart". Not very edifying, but kind of funny.
One of her newest videos talks about people who have their dogs in a stroller, and their kids on a leash. I thought it was
funny until I saw it in real life.

Let's have men with men... women with women... let's have pets be our children. Let's be gay and raise our kids to value
"sexual preferences" more than love and family. Let's teach them gender doesn't matter, and who you have sex with doesn't
matter. Let's teach them that real relationships and real love doesn't even exist.

All that matters is... YOU.. look out for number one. I have some friends who aren't Christians, but usually we hang in different
circles. I don't do strip clubs and bars anymore. Most of them are single, divorced or in bad marriages... they leave their
kids and spouse at home (or with someone else) while they go hang with the boys and have a few beers.

Then they wonder why life is so messed up. Their marriages are messed up, and their kids are more interested in video games than anything with.. "family".
You should turn your post into a poem, or lyrics for a new Christian rock song.
 
Loyal
You should turn your post into a poem, or lyrics for a new Christian rock song.
I wonder... were you always this cynical about everything? Did something happen to you? Have you ever really cared about anyone?
Has anyone ever really cared for you?

That may sound like a slap in the face, or maybe an insult to whoever raised you. But it isn't meant to be.
It's a sincere question.

I've found that when children live with anger... they learn to be angry.
When children live with negativity, they learn to be negative.
When children live with violence, they learn to be violent.

When they live without love.... they learn to be cynical. (you can put that music also if you like :smile:

But seriously... you have started coming here frequently... why? Are you looking for something?
Do you just feel the need to tell us how "dumb" we are for believing in God and Jesus?
Does this make you feel better?

I'm not condemning you or judging you... I suspect we have a lot in common if you knew my background.
But I am asking you seriously... why are you here?
 
Member
I wonder... were you always this cynical about everything? Did something happen to you? Have you ever really cared about anyone?
Has anyone ever really cared for you?

That may sound like a slap in the face, or maybe an insult to whoever raised you. But it isn't meant to be.
It's a sincere question.

I've found that when children live with anger... they learn to be angry.
When children live with negativity, they learn to be negative.
When children live with violence, they learn to be violent.

When they live without love.... they learn to be cynical. (you can put that music also if you like :smile:

But seriously... you have started coming here frequently... why? Are you looking for something?
Do you just feel the need to tell us how "dumb" we are for believing in God and Jesus?
Does this make you feel better?

I'm not condemning you or judging you... I suspect we have a lot in common if you knew my background.
But I am asking you seriously... why are you here?
Actually I was serious, you should write your post out as a poem. It sound's poetic, and I actually enjoyed reading it.

You see, you took the wrong view, why? Don't worry about it, your current post has some merrit, some truth, but it was written in haste (Maybe) See, I could be assuming that.
 
Member
I wonder... were you always this cynical about everything? Did something happen to you? Have you ever really cared about anyone?
Has anyone ever really cared for you?

That may sound like a slap in the face, or maybe an insult to whoever raised you. But it isn't meant to be.
It's a sincere question.

I've found that when children live with anger... they learn to be angry.
When children live with negativity, they learn to be negative.
When children live with violence, they learn to be violent.

When they live without love.... they learn to be cynical. (you can put that music also if you like :smile:

But seriously... you have started coming here frequently... why? Are you looking for something?
Do you just feel the need to tell us how "dumb" we are for believing in God and Jesus?
Does this make you feel better?

I'm not condemning you or judging you... I suspect we have a lot in common if you knew my background.
But I am asking you seriously... why are you here?
I am here because I have to learn how to deal with the hurt Christians caused me when I was with them in the past.

+ I like challenging my own ideas, no use hanging out with yes men.

+ I do it for my daughter who might read what I wrote when I'm gone from this earth.
 
Loyal
when you take only one or two versus and build your case around it you can make it sound like most anything

here is one for you that would suggest the opposite of what you say just to name a few

1 Timothy 5:8
But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

t
he bible has a lot to say about family
Colossians 3:20
Children, obey your parents in everything, for this pleases the Lord.

Proverbs 22:6
Train up a child in the way he should go; even when he is old he will not depart from it.

Exodus 20:12
“Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land that the Lord your God is giving you.

1 Timothy 3:5
For if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church?

Genesis 2:24
Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.

Psalm 128:3
Your wife will be like a fruitful vine within your house; your children will be like olive shoots around your table.



 
Member
when you take only one or two versus and build your case around it you can make it sound like most anything

here is one for you that would suggest the opposite of what you say just to name a few

1 Timothy 5:8
But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

t
he bible has a lot to say about family
Colossians 3:20
Children, obey your parents in everything, for this pleases the Lord.

Proverbs 22:6
Train up a child in the way he should go; even when he is old he will not depart from it.

Exodus 20:12
“Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land that the Lord your God is giving you.

1 Timothy 3:5
For if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church?

Genesis 2:24
Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.

Psalm 128:3
Your wife will be like a fruitful vine within your house; your children will be like olive shoots around your table.


So where does that leave the Christian, is family more important than everyone else in the world? This I think is the problem, let's read on

Luke 6:32-38
32"If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful. 37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

It's easy to love those who love you, especially those in your family. When family is number one, then everyone else is number 2.
 
Loyal
You see, you took the wrong view, why? Don't worry about it, your current post has some merrit, some truth,
My comment about your cynicism wasn't really about the "put it in a song" comment. It was more about all of your posts as a whole
over the last few days.

I am here because I have to learn how to deal with the hurt Christians caused me when I was with them in the past.

+ I like challenging my own ideas, no use hanging out with yes men.

+ I do it for my daughter who might read what I wrote when I'm gone from this earth.
Thank you for your honestly. It does give me some insight.

I am sincerely sorry for the Christians that have caused you hurt. Really, because I have seen the same thing in my life.
Sometimes Christians can hurt people as much (or more) than non-Christians.

I do hope it wasn't anyone here on TalkJesus.

Also thank you for sharing about your daughter. I have two, and few grand-daughters.
It seems you do care about someone after all :smile: Hence... the comments about family?

But now I have a few questions if you don't mind.

1. Do two wrongs make a "right"? If you hurt someone, because someone else hurt you, does that make it right?
Especially if the people you are disagreeing with here, aren't even the ones who hurt you in the past.

2. What is the legacy you are leaving for your daughter? Get even with those who hurt you? Even if they weren't necessarily
the ones who actually did the hurting.

3. You've been here. You've said some things, shared some opinions. Mostly about "if God exists". Obviously this is
a Christian website. Everyone here believes in God. Some people have been offended and responded back to you
in kind. Maybe this is what you wanted? Maybe it proves you were right? OK...
But how many times do you have to criticize our beliefs before you feel better? If you come back tomorrow?
The day after? Does it really make the hurting stop?
 
Member
My comment about your cynicism wasn't really about the "put it in a song" comment. It was more about all of your posts as a whole
over the last few days.



Thank you for your honestly. It does give me some insight.

I am sincerely sorry for the Christians that have caused you hurt. Really, because I have seen the same thing in my life.
Sometimes Christians can hurt people as much (or more) than non-Christians.

I do hope it wasn't anyone here on TalkJesus.

Also thank you for sharing about your daughter. I have two, and few grand-daughters.
It seems you do care about someone after all :smile: Hence... the comments about family?

But now I have a few questions if you don't mind.

1. Do two wrongs make a "right"? If you hurt someone, because someone else hurt you, does that make it right?
Especially if the people you are disagreeing with here, aren't even the ones who hurt you in the past.

2. What is the legacy you are leaving for your daughter? Get even with those who hurt you? Even if they weren't necessarily
the ones who actually did the hurting.

3. You've been here. You've said some things, shared some opinions. Mostly about "if God exists". Obviously this is
a Christian website. Everyone here believes in God. Some people have been offended and responded back to you
in kind. Maybe this is what you wanted? Maybe it proves you were right? OK...
But how many times do you have to criticize our beliefs before you feel better? If you come back tomorrow?
The day after? Does it really make the hurting stop?
I think you have enough insight on my motives atm. If you can stop seeing me as a non believer, you will not feel so determined to win me over to something that I have already experienced. I've been where you are in faith, but have you been where I am now, where there is no commandments to follow, no group to fit into, no book to tell you what's right and wrong, no place to fear you'll go if you don't do what someone said along time ago.
 
Loyal
Was Jesus concerned primarily with the stability of families, or was he more concerned with the brotherhood of man?

This is something he said about his roll in the family

Matthew 10:34-36
34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn "'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law- 36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'

It doesn't sound like that he was concerned about his spirit breaking up the family unit.

He also said this about his own mother and brothers

Matthew 12:46-50
46While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to him. 47Someone told him, "Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you." 48He replied to him, "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?" 49Pointing to his disciples, he said, "Here are my mother and my brothers. 50For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother."

He seems to think that those who do Gods will are a true family, so he doesn't seem to care about the importance that people put on family.
I don't believe that either of your answers are THE answer.

Jesus was concerned with accomplishing His Father's will according to His Father's plan: God's Plan. The stability of families or the brotherhood of man are at best only little bits of the whole. Can you imagine putting a loaf bread back together by considering only a couple of the 100,000 pieces into which it has been broken?

People were all born in the flesh selfish, but early on as an infant unable to survive without help that selfishness related to survival rather than to make himself feel good. Later as the baby grew he learned his survival techniques could be used to obtain things that were not a matter of life or death. Instead crying only when cold or hungry or uncomfortable with a soiled diaper he cried to get things he wanted even though he did not really need them> The baby has begun to learn to covet in the worse definition of the word.

A good parent will work to teach the child not to be so selfish and most children will grow away from the absolute self-serving selfishness found in infants. If they don't,they will find it difficult or impossible to make any real friends.

A selfish infant that cannot talk or walk may be called cute and loveable even if he cries almost excessively. The toddler doing the same thing will be less likeable and many people will have less tolerance. A selfish teenager will find that few other than very close family like him at all. A selfish adult is commonly avoided by others once his attitude is recognized.

Jesus came to us instead of showing himself selfish always showed himself selfless. What any good parent tries to instill in their children, God wants to instill in his children. What Jesus was in his selfless life as a man is expressed in these verses written by the Apostle Paul:

"Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.
Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others." Phil 2:3-4

While Jesus came for other reasons, he also came to be a perfect example of what God wanted all of us to become. Jesus opened to the Way to become like Him. He made it a possibility:

"Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." I John 3:2

Why is that according to John, "it doth not yet appear what we shall be"? That is because we, all of us, were born selfish and blind to God's Way. Our own self-centered existence was our number one priority: Me, Myself and I!

If we indeed moved away from selfishness without God much of the darkness still remained. This is because I believe that every man was born to his natural mother with a glimmer of light [John 1:9]. That glimmer makes it possible for a person to move toward God rather than away from Him.

The Apostle Paul writes about where even a believer is before he is a complete overcomer as was Jesus:

"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known." I Cor 13:12

The "then face to face" arrives when we have overcome our own little world of sinful ways and temptations as Jesus did... Moving toward that "face to face" is what Christianity should be about even if many Christians do not understand that. Do you, my friend, cmd72, understand that? Probably not, but you ever begin a serious approach your vision will move from absolute spiritual blindness to "as through a glass darkly" and headed for that "face to face"...
 
Active
I am here because I have to learn how to deal with the hurt Christians caused me when I was with them in the past.

+ I like challenging my own ideas, no use hanging out with yes men.

+ I do it for my daughter who might read what I wrote when I'm gone from this earth.
Have you ever heard of "false Christians"?
If so, how do you tell them from the real thing?
 
Loyal
when you take only one or two versus and build your case around it you can make it sound like most anything
Like this
Mathew 19:16
Someone came to Jesus with this question: "Teacher, what good deed must I do to have eternal life?"

threw the money into the temple Then he went away and hanged himself.

And Jesus replied, "I assure you, today you will be with me in paradise."
 

Similar threads


Top