FALSE TEACHERS?? or REAL CHRISTIANS?

[justsavedvince]

URGENT! (Disclaimer: this is the same text i wrote to gotquestions so that's why it says gotquestions in there)

I met 2 guys today telling me about lots of stuff. Some things were that the NIV and many other tranlations are corrupt and that the KJV is the only one i should be reading if i don't want to be deceieved. He said the NIV calls Jesus and Satan the Morning Star and that is contradictory. He also said his friend is a prophet. and i asked him if in the bible it said if prophets still existed and he said nowhere does it say they don't still exist. They believe in the trinity, that jesus was the son of God, that He is the Savior and everything. They are really nice and well-versed. and i just wanted to bring that to attention and know what else i should look for so i dont get deceived. They gave me a link to show me that the KJV was more valid (not perfect) than the NIV. I'll ask for permission to post the link if someone is interested in reviewing it (if someone smart in this area could please message me to get the link and review it, it would help me). They said it'll point out the errors. so i went to check up on it and i stopped reading when i saw something that said Billy Graham was a "wolf in sheeps clothing." I don't believe that. And their source has that on the page. I come to you in hopes that you can give me some insight on what's going on here and how i can make sure these guys are real Christians.

They say they are writing a book about their current visitations to churches around Atlanta and how every one of them they've visited is misleading the people. They said they've come across a lot of false teachers. And it's true that there are LOTS of false preachers here in atlanta, but to say that they've found 0 churches since september that are good churches? That's a bold statement. What are your thoughts. I told them about gotquestions (which is how i started a conversation with them) and asked them check it out and next week to tell me what they thought of it... I've learned a lot from this site and God led me to it for a reason, so if they come back to me and tell me something's wrong with it, i'm really gunna question them, and then i'm gunna write you back and tell you what they said about it and want your rebuttal. I hope this is okay, I don't want to be deceived and i will praying. Thank you.

 

[justsavedvince]

i wanna add that they both told me to always pray to God and trust the bible. To take what they say and then pray about it. So that showed me that they weren't trying to get me to follow them... i think. Could i still be deceived? I also asked them to visit my church this sunday or whenever and then tell me what they thought of it. They said they'll pray about it, then after our 4 hour conversation they said they'll probably come. One of the guys also said that God told him to tell me that i'm gunna be a pastor one day... this was after i told them i wanna either do pastoral counseling or maybe be a pastor... then he said "God wants you to be a pastor". This was the guy who claimed to be a prophet.

 

[justsavedvince]

They also said that the staff that translated the NIV Bible had some non-believers and a lesbian woman. Where would they be getting this information from and is it true?

 

[ax d-slayer]

Thanx Bro for u r help.....

 

[Tonyb]

He who speaks from himself seeks his own glory...

Hi Vince,

I would view what these people are saying circumspectly and it sounds as if you are. It sounds as if they could well be Christians who are off beam rather than out and out false teachers. It is not usually until you find out what is motivating people that you find out how off beam they are.

Everyone without exception who moves into error has opened them selves up to pride, pride is their primary motivation in what they doing. Preaching and teaching the word comes secondary to promoting their own sense of self importance. Basically they are self centered rather than Christ centered, and always quick to promote their self centered agenda.

The pride problem is often hidden initially. One thing I would ask you to consider is, when you were talking with these men, did what they were saying build you up or make you feel uneasy? Did your faith surge during this talk, did you have a real sense of peace and joy at the end of it? If not I suggest you drop them like a hot potato. If they are truly self centered as I suspect they might be, they will be directed by a religious spirit, a spirit of error so be careful.

Here is a good scripture to bear in mind when weighing peoples motives.

John 7:18 He who speaks from himself seeks his own glory; but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in Him.

Blessings,
Tonyb

 

[Tonyb]

Hope you get it.

Hi,

John 7:16-18
16 Jesus answered them and said, “My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me. 17 If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority. 18 He who speaks from himself seeks his own glory; but He who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in Him. New Kings James Version.

It's all about motivation. A Christian should be someone who does not speak of himself thereby seeking his own glory. But should rather seek the glory of God, the One who has saved him.

Jesus' motivation during his earthly ministry was to do the will of God and glorify his Father in heaven. And this should be the motivation of every born again Christian to glorify our Father in heaven through his Son, Jesus.

See all of John chapter 17.

The real motivation of course is the love of God. If the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit we will actively seek to glorify God the Father and God the Son.
We won't go around saying, this is wrong and that is wrong, and this Bible is wrong and that Bible is wrong, and I'm right come and listen to me:lightning

Blessings,
Tonyb

 

[Chad]

The fact that they call Billy Graham a wolves in sheep's clothing and that they practically boast about their "prophet" friend is somewhat outlandish. I sense some pride. Even I have been accused of being a wolf in sheep's clothing by fool's who are arrogant, prideful and clueless. Do not listen to such nonsense. Instead, tune your ear to the Holy Spirit. He knows all, above all.

Everyone has opinions and claims of "facts" about certain translations. Its really ludicrous and senseless. It does not glorify GOD. Not in this case from what I sense to be honest.

2 Corinthians 11:11-15

11Why? Because I do not love you? God knows I do! 12And I will keep on doing what I am doing in order to cut the ground from under those who want an opportunity to be considered equal with us in the things they boast about. 13For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve

 

[jmh137]

Judgment lies only in the hands of Our Great God. All authority has been given to the Son.

My problem with these fellows, and the question I would ask myself is, aren't they judging others? I don't want to judge them. But to say that Billy Graham is really a wolf in sheep-skin clothing, is a very judgmental thing to say, and is a very dangerous thing to say.

I believe the Lord showed me something, awhile back, that is similar to this situation. I had been watching a lot of the television preachers and I started to judge them, because I thought that they should have been preaching less about prospering and more about the Cross and the Salvation. I had previously be a supporter of a lot of these preachers. I went through a rough time and I'm still not through it yet. Anyway, somehow the Lord brought to my attention that all these things were His business with them, and He has it under control. My point being, that He said, be very careful who you say is false. The Pharisees did the same thing to Him. When we say that someone is a false teacher, when in reality they are sealed and filled with the Holy Spirit, then are we not speaking against the Precious Holy Spirit? Only the Lord knows who His servants are for sure. I am not discounting what the Lord said about knowing the tree by it's fruit. Yet, only He knows each person's heart.

What was said about Billy Graham really bothers me.

Paul said in his writings that there were those who were preaching Christ for their own gain; yet he said that the most important thing was that Christ was being preached. He knew that it was all in God's hands and He would judge the motives of each of His servants, or so called servants.

To the one who made this thread: I don't know how long you have been a believer; it seems that you are already obtaining discernment and that is a blessing from the Lord. It is a gift from the Holy Spirit. Not everyone has the same gifts. I don't think that I have very much discernment. I've gotten into a lot of trouble trusting those that I should not have trusted. But there have been times when I heard a preacher say something and the Holy Spirit would speak to my heart instantly and tell me that it was not right. However, He did not say that the preacher was a false teacher, only that he was mistaken. The Lord will make known the truth of this matter to you. .......jmh137

 

[BecuzHeLives]

My dear brother,

Please refer to these verse to help you discerning false preacher and prophet. I would believe Kinh James Version to be more insightful. Same as my Vietnamese Bible, they have two version the modern version and the original version. I always learn more when I read the original Bible.

Here are the verses that I have studied:
I Timothe 4, Ecclesiastes 22:28, Mathew 7:15, Mathew 24:11, Mark 13:22, Luke 6:26, II Peter 2:1, I John 4:1, Jeremiah 14...

God Bless You brother,
I don't see any wrong doing in this particular between you and them. Take your time knowing someone before you know they are real are fake. May peace be with you brother.

 

[Stylez4Christ]

Im a lil lost of what your saying. Are you saying that the NIV or the KJV is wrong, because I'm lost here???:embarasse :lightbulb

 

[BecuzHeLives]

not wrong, just that the KJV something use more precise word..So it's more insightful..None of them is wrong.

 

[Tonyb]

The most important thing...

Hi there,

The NIV is probably the most popular Bible amongst English speaking Christians these days. To read an original version of the New Testament it would be in old Greek which isn't spoken these days. The most important thing is to read the Bible on a regular basis and don't get to hung up on the version you read.

I remember once when I was a baby Christian, I was reading John's gospel and the Lord was speaking to me very clearly through it, I was being greatly blessed. Then an off beam brother came round and told me the NIV was wrong. He discouraged me to such a point I lost confidence in the NIV and stopped reading it for a while.I lost what the Lord was trying to establish in my life at that time. Was this off beam brother sent? You bet he was but not by the Lord!!!

Remember the most important thing you can do with a Bible is, ' To Read It.'

 

[BecuzHeLives]

exactly, it's not wrong. It's a matter of choice and how you feel. God Bless.

 

[Chad]

I agree with brother Tony and BecuzHeLives. Just like the style of teaching done at bible study classes by teachers, the translations of the bible have their style of relaying the *same* message 100% inspired by God. I don't dare assume they go off, but only have their methods of providing the exact same from the original Greek / Hebrew bible from day one.

Some translations go word by word, others go by phrases for example. I think NIV is great. I have an niv study bible. I also have New King James study bible as well, also amazing. I have a regular ESV (English Standard Version which is very easy to understand as its rather simple modern day English).

I just want to reiterate that i don't think these "folks" you bumped into were from God. I *may* be wrong but it does not sound right.

 

[justsavedvince]

Im a lil lost of what your saying. Are you saying that the NIV or the KJV is wrong, because I'm lost here???:embarasse :lightbulb

the guys i met said the NIV is wrong and the KJV is the ONLY right bible translated in English

 

[justsavedvince]

Thank you everyone for answering to this post. And by all means, keep posting if you have something to say regarding it. They are coming to my church tomorrow, i invited them... to see what they had to say. I'm also gunna see what they have to say about gotquestions.. I'm also gunna ask them their motive for writing the book. And i agree with a lot of you who've said be skeptical bc they just keep pointing out what is wrong, and look to disagree rather than love. I pray God will give me the discernment to know if they are safe to converse with.

 

[justsavedvince]

but what about their claim that the NIV was translated by non believers and a lesbian woman who wasn't christian? Is this true? and if it is, might that have an affect on the translation? I wouldn't wanna trust a nonbelievers translation.

 

[Tonyb]

If the NIV was wrong God would have made an issue of it.

Hi Vince,

The NIV was translated by a large panel of scholars, whether one of them was a lesbian or not I don't know. I find it difficult to believe that Bible believing Christians would have a working relationship with this lady in the ministry of translating the world. Then again maybe some of the translators have embraced liberal theology, I don't personally know. I suppose you could always write to the board of translators and ask them where they stand theologically.

One thing is for sure if the NIV translation was in serious error the Holy Spirit would have made a issue of it.

When you get a small group of people saying something is wrong watch out, they usually doing it in their own authority, not God's. But they are often blind enough – by their own conceit – to say are little group are the only ones who are right, and everyone else is wrong.

If reading the NIV bothers you, you could always switch to the New King James for the time being. But those who venerate the King James Version of the Bible and say it's the only Bible Christians should read forget a lot of the world does not speak English as 1st language or even as a second language. They have the Bible translated into their own native language without reference to the A.V.

It kind of makes those who say the AV is the only Bible Christians should read look a bit silly.

Blessings,
Tonyb

 

[jmh137]

As a child, the King James Version was all I really knew. But, as a child and teenager I didn't want to read God's Word. I remember one Christmas that my Mom got me a Living Bible. Sadly, I don't even know where it is today.

Then, when at 30 years of age, the Lord made Himself known to me, I wanted to read every word of the Bible. But, I didn't care for the King James Version. My husband, who was not a believer at that time, bought me a NIV for Valentine's Day, the first year I started to read the Word. It was that version that revealed the Lord to me.

That was 17 years ago. A few years ago, the Lord, helped me to see the beauty of the King James Version. I rarely ever read the NIV anymore. I started to become a small time collector of the different translations of the Word. I like the Amplified Version a lot.

Through the years, I've heard all the same things. You know how the King James Version is the only one we should read. I've even ran across a few individuals that thought a person would go to Hell, if they read any other version. What? Anyway, I don't know much, but I do know that for that time period that I was soaking up the Bible for the first time, that the Lord used the NIV version in my life, greatly. The Holy Spirit spoke to me as I read it.

I once heard a preacher say, "I don't care what version you read. Just get some version of God's Word and start reading it!" That sounds like good advice to me.

About the fellows you've encountered, I am very concerned about them and what they are saying. As I've stated before, it was their statement about Billy Graham that bothered me the most. Billy Graham has been used of the Lord in such an awesome way. Think about all the once lost souls who God ordained to hear one of his sermons. I remember as a child, sitting in front of the television, watching him. I remember even then, that the Holy Spirit convicted me of my sin, by using this man's words.

I have said that I don't want to judge these individuals, but beware my friend. If you haven't been a believer for very long; I don't see how they are helping you. I am glad that you are here at Talk Jesus. I think someone here can help you in your discernment. I know that your feet are standing on the Solid Rock Of All The Ages!!! He will show you. You may fall a time or two, but that Rock is so big and great that you will find a crevice to hold on to.

His Name is Wonderful. His Name is Wonderful!!! He is the Mighty King, Master of everything! His Name is Wonderful, Jesus my LORD!!!

Tony B. you really uplift me with your posts, thank you for being His servant. .......jmh137

 

[ax d-slayer]

Thank U Brother Chad i totally agree.......... Be Blessed in the Holy Spirit cause he knows it all...Amen