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Do we have freewill ? did we have freewill since the beggining ?

Member
We have freewill God lets us decide to do good or bad and our purpose in life is when we make that decision. it's easy to not know that purpose because we are different. But freewill God gives it but he also gives us the law and the law is not wrong and niether is freewill just soceity itself is wrong and we have forgotten what is the normal back in those days. Society mistakes and thinks G-d is against freewill but gave freewill the right to choose and they have invented freewill is voting, paying taxes, and civics duties.

No people those things are the mistake modern society makes because they think they have evolved in such A way they surpass all of Israel back in those day but truth G-d is fair and gave us all. We have lost what is important love because human society is wrong and it's foundation is false and invented by masons.

G-d created it all the rocks, the atmosphere, everything has been giving and from all that we have built buildings and empires everything we have built has come from him modern world is our work and act but we do not acknowledge them we take the glory and everything for we are sinful. The concept of government we have created but we emulated it from G-d and his kingdom the order G-d has it first, the structure he establish since the dawn of the universe.

We have created rights but we cannot use our rights agaisnt G-d and say he has violated them or civic manner say our freedom and establishment of our democracy hits against G-d and his kingdom. For he has the kingdom and the law. The law of his word and we do not have that for G-d gave us words but we are babylon the law is only his. Nor it belongs to hebrew people, eunuchs, or angels it only belongs to him to judge.

Our own system is flaw because we copy from each empire that has been establish Babylon, Rome, Greece, Britian, and Nazi Germany. Each has given its concept of right and law and all have copied each other and failed. Because again bible has establish that G-d and his system works and we with our notion of democracy and rights have copied on Rome and Babylon and they are wrong.

The most important things that because we have technology which has help us after world war 2 we think we have surpass it all and enter the digitla world and we circumvalent our promblems of family, corruption, and normal things we had before the 1950's and think we are gods. And we want to be eternal and to be like powerful like G-d because it is what we have always been thinking because all of it is copy. When we are original and have the right system like he does everything works but our government and system does not because we are with flaws and our own boundaries aren't the solutions they are A reminder that we will never have A perfect system thus our rights and belief in them cannot be the truth.

The freewill is revealed that there is A difference from freewill with G-d on accepting the right and wrong and succeeding in that way and from freewill from our modern concept which has failed and clashes with G-d's law which is right and truth and unless we do not use our rights against G-d freewill is that what we make only A lie and it existence false.

Freewill from that point of view is that of society and since society has masonry in it and all foundations of masonery is babylon and Dagon it compells people to make G-d like unfair despotism but you cannot apply that to G-d for he is G-d and he is God of Gods those words are just feeble people who make laws copying the old empires and fallacy arrives in it's policy.

There is A way government can follow G-d's politics but that will be another day. But people and society will always collapse confronting and using thier rights and saying there is no freewill when you have to one understand things from G-d's point of view understand what serveth the law, how the law is completed thru love and how faith as A tool helps you make A better realtionship with G-d.

When you find the truth and love in his way that G-d establish thru Jesus Christ you understand A secret way which freewill co-exist with G-d and love is what that bound unites it and makes freewill work but not under modern society but thru G-d mosaic law and know that is true freewill has been given to you but from the stance of modern world and republics establish go into error. I will explain more but have did A lot.
 
Member
We start from the beggining when Adam was giving the power to name the animals G-d gave him freewill to choose Genesis 2:20.
20 The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him.


Here G-d gives Adam gives him ability to think for himself and he decide the animals name.


There is difference from the freewill Hebrew people back in the days of Noah and Moses when the law was directed to G-d’s people they had freewill to decide. Their decision is under the law because they did not know other religions or ways they were narrowminded but still the decision from good and evil existed. Did the errors of their fathers before them I mean the fall of Adam stopped them making decisions in their life. Israel did what they want based still of need of surviving. Killing, eating, proceating needs of humanity but no matter what the error of Adam did not take freewill from them.


Romans 7:19 **“**For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.”


Ezekiel 18:20 “The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself.”


Psalm 110:2 “Your people will volunteer freely in the day of Your power; In holy array, from the womb of the dawn, Your youth are to You as the dew.”


From the day pagans evolved into modern world and establish their own way. Even thou they seperated from their pagan worhsip Rome forced them to mix their deities and influence with christianism and robbed the followers of Christ of Jesus and they painted him white. Named the G-d of Israel to Zeus and change their panteon.


Hebrew law or mosaic law reminds people to obey but G-d has taken prophets to save and do the will of G-d in wars, missions, and choosing good and evil. They break the law in disobeying G-d, prophets like Jeremiah who chose G-d disobey tradition and his father and told Israel their errors and love for the temple forgotten the temple inside they are made of. Kick Jeremiah out of their circle rejected from society he continued, we have Elijah who many don’t talk about but he change the words of G-d and sentence Jezabel but G-d only wanted to punish Jezabel but Elijah added her family as punishment. G-d was angry at Elijah but forgave him. Still G-d’s plan was only Jezabel but he made an exception for Elijah and freewill existed and changed yes G-d allows it.


People can change their course in life but what is the promblem from today. Is how the Greek way of thinking of liberalism was popular in the time of Jesus.


James 2:12 “So speak and so act as those who are to be judged by the law of liberty.”


2 Corinthians 3:17 “Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.”


And Greeks influence the time of jesus that people like Luke wrote his book in the bible and later Catholic church not knowing fully Hebrew culture copied things from greeks and influence the bible. Remember they were not G-d’s people but A country that stoled and wrote their intrepretation of G-d and took Jesus as an emblema that is not real.


Greek theology is freedom and rationalist thought, Hebrew people is Law and Relation with the one G-d. Greeks have influence the modernworld and gives them right, the western world copies Greek and Roman culture and their diffinity in their laws have given the modern topic freewill. So freewill clashes with freewill in the old times. That is why everything has to do with predestination, Calvanism go ahead and read see all our versions of choosing good and evil have consequences but still you decide your future.


There are 2 fields :indeterminism and determinism explain modern freewill and both give notion of control. Indeterminism means free acts are not determine in other words what you do with works does not foretold your future and the path you have chosen. Determinism says everything you do has already decided your future and you have no career. Nothing can change your destiny but G-d can.


Matthew 12:37 “For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”


God’s general sovereignty- says god is in charge of everything but doesn’t control everything
God’s specific sovereignty- says that He not only has ordained everything, but He also controls everything.


Proverbs 16:9 “The mind of the man plans his way, but the Lord directs his steps.


Proverbs 3:5-6“Trust in the LORD with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways submit to him, and he will make your paths straight.”
 
Member
We have freewill
I agree.. most people think they do. its a small portion of the population that argues we don't that causes a lot of problems, particularly when they don't take responsibility for their action.

read this.

The researcher, who literally “wrote the book” on neurotheology, draws from his numerous studies to show that both meditating Buddhists and praying Catholic nuns, for instance, have increased activity in the frontal lobes of the brain.
These areas are linked with increased focus and attention, planning skills, the ability to project into the future, and the ability to construct complex arguments.
Also, both prayer and meditation correlate with a decreased activity in the parietal lobes, which are responsible for processing temporal and spatial orientation.
Nuns, however — who pray using words rather than relying on visualization techniques used in meditation — show increased activity in the language-processing brain areas of the subparietal lobes.
But, other religious practices can have the opposite effect on the same brain areas. For instance, one of the most recent studies co-authored by Dr. Newberg shows that intense Islamic prayer — “which has, as its most fundamental concept, the surrendering of one’s self to God” — reduces the activity in the prefrontal cortex and the frontal lobes connected with it, as well as the activity in the parietal lobes.
The prefrontal cortexTrusted Source is traditionally thought to be involved in executive control, or willful behavior, as well as decision-making. So, the researchers hypothesize, it would make sense that a practice that centers on relinquishing control would result in decreased activity in this brain area.


"This is not just a theoretical question because in the 1990s, Dr. Michael Persinger — the director of the Neuroscience Department at Laurentian University in Ontario, Canada — designed what came to be known as the “God Helmet.”
This is a device that is able to simulate religious experiences by stimulating an individual’s tempoparietal lobes using magnetic fields.
In Dr. Persinger’s experiments, about 20 religious people — which amounts to just 1 percent of the participants — reported feeling the presence of God or seeing him in the room when wearing the device. However, 80 percent of the participants felt a presence of some sort, which they were reluctant to call “God.”
Speaking about the experiments, Dr. Persinger says, “I suspect most people would call the ‘vague, all-around-me’ sensations ‘God’ but they are reluctant to employ the label in a laboratory."

how much do i need to pay to get PloughBoy to use this machine.
 
Loyal
I agree.. most people think they do. its a small portion of the population that argues we don't that causes a lot of problems, particularly when they don't take responsibility for their action.

read this.

The researcher, who literally “wrote the book” on neurotheology, draws from his numerous studies to show that both meditating Buddhists and praying Catholic nuns, for instance, have increased activity in the frontal lobes of the brain.
These areas are linked with increased focus and attention, planning skills, the ability to project into the future, and the ability to construct complex arguments.
Also, both prayer and meditation correlate with a decreased activity in the parietal lobes, which are responsible for processing temporal and spatial orientation.
Nuns, however — who pray using words rather than relying on visualization techniques used in meditation — show increased activity in the language-processing brain areas of the subparietal lobes.
But, other religious practices can have the opposite effect on the same brain areas. For instance, one of the most recent studies co-authored by Dr. Newberg shows that intense Islamic prayer — “which has, as its most fundamental concept, the surrendering of one’s self to God” — reduces the activity in the prefrontal cortex and the frontal lobes connected with it, as well as the activity in the parietal lobes.
The prefrontal cortexTrusted Source is traditionally thought to be involved in executive control, or willful behavior, as well as decision-making. So, the researchers hypothesize, it would make sense that a practice that centers on relinquishing control would result in decreased activity in this brain area.


"This is not just a theoretical question because in the 1990s, Dr. Michael Persinger — the director of the Neuroscience Department at Laurentian University in Ontario, Canada — designed what came to be known as the “God Helmet.”
This is a device that is able to simulate religious experiences by stimulating an individual’s tempoparietal lobes using magnetic fields.
In Dr. Persinger’s experiments, about 20 religious people — which amounts to just 1 percent of the participants — reported feeling the presence of God or seeing him in the room when wearing the device. However, 80 percent of the participants felt a presence of some sort, which they were reluctant to call “God.”
Speaking about the experiments, Dr. Persinger says, “I suspect most people would call the ‘vague, all-around-me’ sensations ‘God’ but they are reluctant to employ the label in a laboratory."

how much do i need to pay to get PloughBoy to use this machine.
LOL, My field is not "Philosophical Thoughts" nor "Religious Studies" but "Theology Proper" but still the saying is true although modern day Critics, worldly thinkers will not agree but it is still true "Theology is the Queen of All Sciences and Philosophy is her handmaiden" When all sciences has gotten there, The correct "Theology: has been there and gone. :pensive: for Theology, correct Theology deals and dwells in the rims of "ETERNITY" " The Incomprehensibility" of The Finite Mind. Philosophical Thoughts cannot travel there and all others sciences have not the wisdom to comprehend its location. But our GOD has A Bridge by a divine transformation Created in "Christ JESUS", 'that the world cannot know, and HE has confounded the Wisdom of The Wise. And they cannot get there.:pensive: "But they have sought many devices" to Do so.:pensive:

NASB 1995
“Behold, I have found only this, that God made men upright, but they have sought out many devices.”

(Ecclesiastes 12)BSB
"And by these, my son, be further warned: There is no end to the making of many books, and much study wearies the body. ...When all has been heard, the conclusion of THE MATTER IS THIS: FEAR GOD and keep His COMMANDMENTS , becauseTHIS IS THE whole duty of man. ..FOR GOD will bring every deed into judgment, along with every HIDDEN THING whether good or evil.…":pensive: [and that is a "Promise"]
 
Active
"reported feeling the presence of God or seeing him in the room when wearing the device. However, 80 percent of the participants felt a presence of some sort, which they were reluctant to call “God.”" YES! Exactly, this is what I "feel" when I am here in my bedroom worshipping and interacting with God. Now there is a so called ritual I perform which I wont go into here, but suffice to say it sure brings me much closer to God and his presence is felt. This is much more than just a religious experience that everyone else experiences every Sunday morning. I experience this 24/7 and have done for a long time. I am getting the impression that very few are truly there yet.
 
Member
Very interesting reminds how scientist research everything they can but don't take responsibility there is A time when scientists wanted to know the insde of all mind's or see thru people head's back in the 30's , it's horrible to think the evil things people are doing they will do it to all of us -_-.


When people aquire technology that can look at people's mind think and i'm not talking about God helmet but new technology were all playing God and that is something he does not want. We go the wrong way in history just something horrible. Pray all this evil evaporates. But freeiwll is about deciding and knowing your actions can decide your fate.
 
Active
I really do not understand why some believe we have no free will,when in the Word of God Jesus asks people do you believe?( John 11:25-26,John 16:31,John 1:50-51,Matt 9:28) Why would Jesus ask a question to people,he already knew the answer to? Because he wanted them to hear themselves confess a truth!!( Matt 8:8-10!!) If your will makes no difference then why would Jesus ask them anything?? ( Rom 10:17) Choice has always been in God's order!( Joshua 24:15) If you cannot choose, why does Jesus send out disciples to preach the good news for you to decide?? Oh well, just a thought.
 
Loyal
I really do not understand why some believe we have no free will,when in the Word of God Jesus asks people do you believe?( John 11:25-26,John 16:31,John 1:50-51,Matt 9:28) Why would Jesus ask a question to people,he already knew the answer to? Because he wanted them to hear themselves confess a truth!!( Matt 8:8-10!!) If your will makes no difference then why would Jesus ask them anything?? ( Rom 10:17) Choice has always been in God's order!( Joshua 24:15) If you cannot choose, why does Jesus send out disciples to preach the good news for you to decide?? Oh well, just a thought.
Having 0 freewill makes no sense anyways. What would be the point of Jesus doing anything. If all was predestined
 
Active
Very interesting reminds how scientist research everything they can but don't take responsibility there is A time when scientists wanted to know the insde of all mind's or see thru people head's back in the 30's , it's horrible to think the evil things people are doing they will do it to all of us -_-.


When people aquire technology that can look at people's mind think and i'm not talking about God helmet but new technology were all playing God and that is something he does not want. We go the wrong way in history just something horrible. Pray all this evil evaporates. But freeiwll is about deciding and knowing your actions can decide your fate.
As I have posted many times previously, God does choose people from childhood. I am proof of that, my testimony is to long to share here but suffice to say its been quite an ardous journey to this day. Now, did I sin and go astray? Yes I did for many years. This is freewill. But here I am today returned to the way I was when I was a child. Many are called, few are chosen. Some are chosen before they were even concieved in the womb.
 
Loyal
As I have posted many times previously, God does choose people from childhood. I am proof of that, my testimony is to long to share here but suffice to say its been quite an ardous journey to this day. Now, did I sin and go astray? Yes I did for many years. This is freewill. But here I am today returned to the way I was when I was a child. Many are called, few are chosen. Some are chosen before they were even concieved in the womb.
So are you thinking you dont have freewill?

Adam chose the names of all the animals in the Garden.

Abraham chose to sacrifice his son

Joseph chose to tease and forgive his brothers

Judas chose to betrey Jesus

Mary chose to say yes
 
Member
The model Lords prayer has the the phrase: "Lead us not into temptation..." No matter the context, wouldn't that mean that we have a choice?
 
Loyal
The model Lords prayer has the the phrase: "Lead us not into temptation..." No matter the context, wouldn't that mean that we have a choice?
Well why did Jesus have to die and shed HIS BLOOD?
Then again did a man, tell you that this is a "model prayer"? Or did JESUS tell YOU how to pray? did Jesus say: this is a "model" for when you pray?

(Matthew 8)NASV
7“And when you are praying, do not use thoughtless repetition as the Gentiles do, for they think that they will be heard because of their many words. 8So do not be like them; for your Father knows what you need before you ask Him.

9“Pray, then, in this way: :eyes:
‘Our Father, who is in heaven,
[d]Hallowed be Your name.
10[e]Your kingdom come.
Your will be done,
[f]On earth as it is in heaven.
11‘Give us this day [g]our daily bread.
12‘And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13‘And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from [h]evil.Matthew 6 New American Standard Bible14For if you forgive otherpeople for their [j]offenses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive other people, then your Father will not forgive your [k]offenses.

If Jesus has become your LORD, you are suppose to do as HE says. That is a command. and not a option. right. But if HE is not your LORD [Master]. you can pray anyway you want!:eyes:

But if you are one of HIS slaves, and Then HE is your MASTER LORD, and when He tells you to do something you do it! If JESUS has bought you, you have become a "Bond slave" until your coronation day! :eyes: Until then.

Now again who Told you it is a model prayer? If Jesus is your LORD, just do it! And when HE gets ready to explain it, HE will!

OK, did you understand that?

PS... He goes after Runaway SLAVES, And HIS Father has a "Whip" and you was a "gift' given to Jesus by His FATHER, and you will come back and after a few times, you ain't going to run away no more:eyes: and That is a "Promise":sob: Go ahead you will see. my uncle use to say: "A hard head will make a soft behind":rolleyes: :sob: Before it is all over, you will choose.
 
Active
So are you thinking you dont have freewill?

Adam chose the names of all the animals in the Garden.

Abraham chose to sacrifice his son

Joseph chose to tease and forgive his brothers

Judas chose to betrey Jesus

Mary chose to say yes
For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified. What, then, shall we say in response to this? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own Son, but gave him up for us all - how will he not also, along with him, graciously give us all things? Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen [eklektos]? It is God who justifies (Romans 8:29-33).
 
Loyal
What Israel sought so earnestly it did not obtain, but the elect did (Romans 11:7).
I tend to be a logical person.

When we look at predestination, it doesnt make any sense ( to me ) why would Jesus go to all the trouble of suffering, dying and resurrection if all was already set, these guys are saved and those guys are not.

Even worse, why would God bother making perfection only to throw it away in hell.

The only explination i can fathom, God creates perfection , and then gives us free will
 
Active
I tend to be a logical person.

When we look at predestination, it doesnt make any sense ( to me ) why would Jesus go to all the trouble of suffering, dying and resurrection if all was already set, these guys are saved and those guys are not.

Even worse, why would God bother making perfection only to throw it away in hell.

The only explination i can fathom, God creates perfection , and then gives us free will
because on the day of judgement, those people cannot say to the Lord that they were never given the option to repent from there sin etc. They have been given that option since time began. And we dont know who is merely lost in the world and needs to be cajoled into believing, and who will never believe no matter what evidence is presented to them. This is why its imperative we carry on sharing the gospel anyway.
 
Loyal
I tend to be a logical person.

When we look at predestination, it doesnt make any sense ( to me ) why would Jesus go to all the trouble of suffering, dying and resurrection if all was already set, these guys are saved and those guys are not.

Even worse, why would God bother making perfection only to throw it away in hell.

The only explination i can fathom, God creates perfection , and then gives us free will
It is all about The Finishing work of GOD :pensive: And His Purpose has not been fully Revealed. And A finite mind could never receive or is it "capable " to conceive The "Glory of Our"Manifestation" in which we received in "Christ JESUS". But one thing we do know through The WORD of GOD we will be "The GIFT" That" GOD the FATHER" will Present to HIS ONLY Begotten SON in WHOM HE LOVES! Even a "GIFT" that The SON of GOD, could even imagine, HIS FATHER is CREATING Something in "CHRIST JESUS"! It is for the LOVE HE HAS for HIS SON! That will for EVER be "MANIFESTED" & "SHINE" Through out ETERNITY!

What Kind of GIFT can you give a GOD! and "Mesmerize" Him Through Out "Eternity"? For JESUS has said: "MY FATHER is GREATER than I" For The BIBLE says That "The Sons of GOD" is "THE MANIFESTATION of THE GLORY of GOD through out ALL ETERNITY! The BIBLE says: The world do not know us and they do not know GOD! MANy, MANY, MANY True CHRISTIANS have not even The FOGGY Idea , of what is going on and a little hint of our destination, which is REVEALED IN The PERSON of JESUS CHRIST. And the only thing they can see, is that they are christians. sad, sad. And if they "Would Fall In LOVE, with all of their soul, heart and minds and strength. but many think it is crime to do so.:pensive: Help me JESUS!

Far as a lot christians is concern about GOD the Father is they can name his "Attributes" and state a few titles. And that is deepest as they get. And many still claim they know HIM personally. :pensive: Many call JESUS , LORD, and They do not know what the word means. And you can tell, that they are not "Slaves unto Christ" and they are their own masters. and claim their "freewill" and refuse to acknowledge, they have been bought with a price, out of the "bondages of sin" in which they were a "slave" to sin.:pensive: Bound And Alienated from GOD.

So many, treat, the works of Christ as if it is another great America story or a Great Motion Picture or a great worldly type story about a god, that you rub three times and he grants your wish, just only believe, small letters is appropriated in this sense.:pensive: But OUR GOD is "GOD". ...For there are many gods but only One "GOD".:pensive: "The TETRAGRAMMATON"

Woooo, somebody HELP Me! to Tell it! The STORY! about this GOD! That is written in The PAGES of THE BOOK and REVEALED Through "THE WORD of GOD" Wooooooo.....Sweet JESUS!
 
Loyal
because on the day of judgement, those people cannot say to the Lord that they were never given the option to repent from there sin etc. They have been given that option since time began. And we dont know who is merely lost in the world and needs to be cajoled into believing, and who will never believe no matter what evidence is presented to them. This is why its imperative we carry on sharing the gospel anyway.
Absolutely
 
Loyal
It is all about The Finishing work of GOD :pensive: And His Purpose has not been fully Revealed. And A finite mind could never receive or is it "capable " to conceive The "Glory of Our"Manifestation" in which we received in "Christ JESUS". But one thing we do know through The WORD of GOD we will be "The GIFT" That" GOD the FATHER" will Present to HIS ONLY Begotten SON in WHOM HE LOVES! Even a "GIFT" that The SON of GOD, could even imagine, HIS FATHER is CREATING Something in "CHRIST JESUS"! It is for the LOVE HE HAS for HIS SON! That will for EVER be "MANIFESTED" & "SHINE" Through out ETERNITY!

What Kind of GIFT can you give a GOD! and "Mesmerize" Him Through Out "Eternity"? For JESUS has said: "MY FATHER is GREATER than I" For The BIBLE says That "The Sons of GOD" is "THE MANIFESTATION of THE GLORY of GOD through out ALL ETERNITY! The BIBLE says: The world do not know us and they do not know GOD! MANy, MANY, MANY True CHRISTIANS have not even The FOGGY Idea , of what is going on and a little hint of our destination, which is REVEALED IN The PERSON of JESUS CHRIST. And the only thing they can see, is that they are christians. sad, sad. And if they "Would Fall In LOVE, with all of their soul, heart and minds and strength. but many think it is crime to do so.:pensive: Help me JESUS!

Far as a lot christians is concern about GOD the Father is they can name his "Attributes" and state a few titles. And that is deepest as they get. And many still claim they know HIM personally. :pensive: Many call JESUS , LORD, and They do not know what the word means. And you can tell, that they are not "Slaves unto Christ" and they are their own masters. and claim their "freewill" and refuse to acknowledge, they have been bought with a price, out of the "bondages of sin" in which they were a "slave" to sin.:pensive: Bound And Alienated from GOD.

So many, treat, the works of Christ as if it is another great America story or a Great Motion Picture or a great worldly type story about a god, that you rub three times and he grants your wish, just only believe, small letters is appropriated in this sense.:pensive: But OUR GOD is "GOD". ...For there are many gods but only One "GOD".:pensive: "The TETRAGRAMMATON"

Woooo, somebody HELP Me! to Tell it! The STORY! about this GOD! That is written in The PAGES of THE BOOK and REVEALED Through "THE WORD of GOD" Wooooooo.....Sweet JESUS!
I really love you brother, beautiful just beautiful your words here
 
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