christians will go to Hell

[RJ]

Heb 6:4; For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5; and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
Heb 6:6; and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

This is talking about pseudo- Christians who just say they have , but, in fact, have not been born again Christians in the first place.

 

[B-A-C]

This is talking about pseudo- Christians who just say they have , but, in fact, have not been born again Christians in the first place.

It doesn't say "think they have" or "say they have", it says "been made partakers".

 

[Stickz]

RJ would have to completely discard his belief in OSAS to agree with you, BAC, no matter what you say or how you say it, and you know that that isn't going to happen.

 

[Christ4Ever]

Yes.

I would also suggest that believing Christ is also a work (it is an action - is it not?). But that is a different conversation I think.

" If we say we have fellowship with him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth."

(1 John 1:6 ESV)

Hey, I agree that believing and repenting are works ... completely in our own control. Meaning, we are given the opportunity to do so, but it is up to us to go through with it.

Yeah. From our human perspective, faith is an action - a work. So is repentance. And the bible teaches that both of these works are required for salvation.

However, from God's perspective I would venture to guess that neither faith nor repentance is a human work. Being that we humans are utterly incapable of actually accomplishing them on our own; they are a work of God from start to finish.

Exactly right brother. For faith comes by grace Ephesians 2:8-9 [8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

The below verse in Galatians should be eye opening to the believer, who would set aside works as being of little to no account. If the Lord lives within us and we live for Christ, should we then not exemplify the behavior that set Him apart by being Obedient to Him as He was to the Father? I've added a link to a devotional from Charles Spurgeon that provided me a greater clarity on Obedience.

Galatians 2:20 [20] I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Obedience | Talk Jesus

Please continue reading......

• There is no such thing as a true, Born Again Christian, without repentance!
• There will be many "so called" Christians go to hell.

Brother RJ. I would rephrase the second point to read "There will be many who believe themselves to be Christians going to hell.

I think you are talking about people who claim to be Christian, because it makes them feel good to call themselves so. It's not what we believe we are, but what is written in The Book of Life that matters and we all must work diligently to make that grade.

I've already made my feelings on this well known and people who talk the tlk and not walk the walk will never get farther than their minds and hopes will take them, no matter the issue involved.

Yet it is not the works that provide us the saving grace, or it would not be grace Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

If you haven't read the devotional I linked above about Obedience, please do so. We do "works" which is seen as a chore for many rather than an act of love. This is the new covenant. Not because we have to, but because we want to. Not for gain, but for love of our Father. What child would not want to do what the Father He loves would ask him to do? Would we be a loving child, a Child of the Most High if he were to be disobedient? We know what happens to the disobedient child. He is punished, corrected, but does the child lose their inheritance, that is a promise given by God?

Yet, it is easy to see where those who are more "Hellenistic" in their approach seem to block out, that if we love the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, why shouldn't we then not aspire to do the things which are pleasing? Do we intentionally seek to grieve them, by not doing what they have asked, and remind us to do out of love for us? and remind us, and remind us, till either we listen and change or do not?

For those who do not it must be opened ended in making any determination/judgment on them. Can we in surety say that we know that tomorrow will not bring change to those; as you said "people who talk the talk and not walk the walk"? Is anyone so far gone, that in ones last dying breath one could not repent if so a saving grace is shown? B-A-C has shown where it is identifying some that will fall into this category. Yet, I will not give up hope, that those traveling this path, will not one day, respond to the Holy Spirits prompting! For until I can see into the very depths of someone's heart, I will not say for sure, they are lost. Rather, as I believe Spurgeon once said; "let them jump over my prone body to reach hell", if that is what they desire.

Most of the time, what we find are people who have been deceived by a doctrine that I would call self gratification or even self satisfaction, which can be even worse, because it's more common name is "pride". The hope is that their belief is truly by God's Grace for if it is not. No matter if they eventually walk the walk, they will sadly not have received God's unmerited favor; Saving Grace.

For those who have received His unmerited favor, heard, believed, and desire to do His will. Can we ever say that we have done enough for our Lord who gave His all? No, so our continued obedience to what He has asked of us we continue to do; not because to do otherwise might dam us to hell, or that there is a certain amount needed to achieve salvation. NO! We do all this and more if able, because He loved us first!

This was not all just for you "kvnChrist" and/or all the other brothers who have posted on this thread, but once I started to type it just kept on going and going........so apologies from me to all of you.

This is a discussion that has periodically reoccurred, and from so very many of the postings, of which I could include myself as one. I have seen much distress, and less love communicated to those we would call Brothers & Sisters in Christ and if not them surely to those others we communicate to. So that the same love our Lord showed us when we too seemed to be unsalvageable, is given to them by us, that we might truly be called Children of the Most High!

YBIC

C4E

1 John 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

 

[RJ]

Brother RJ. I would rephrase the second point to read "There will be many who believe themselves to be Christians going to hell.

With all respect, whether they believe it or not they are still not born again and still going to hell, I don't care how you massage it!

 

[Christ4Ever]

With all respect, whether they believe it or not they are still not born again and still going to hell, I don't care how you massage it!

• There is no such thing as a true, Born Again Christian, without repentance!
• There will be many "so called" Christians go to hell.

To use your vernacular, I was not "massaging" anything I just suggested a rephrase that is all.

The difference between "so called" and "believe themselves to be" is no small thing. JW's, Mormons are a couple that "believe themselves to be Christians", but are not ones I would call "so called" Christians. I don't identify them as Christians at all yet they would fall within the category of your second bullet statement.

That was the sole purpose of the suggestion brother. Peace.
YBIC
C4E

1 John 1:7

 

[RJ]

To use your vernacular, I was not "massaging" anything I just suggested a rephrase that is all.

The difference between "so called" and "believe themselves to be" is no small thing. JW's, Mormons are a couple that "believe themselves to be Christians", but are not ones I would call "so called" Christians. I don't identify them as Christians at all yet they would fall within the category of your second bullet statement.

That was the sole purpose of the suggestion brother. Peace.
YBIC
C4E

1 John 1:7

That's fine. My main point to you, whether you rephrase or not brother, the truth remains, Christians don't go to hell!

 

[Christ4Ever]

That's fine. My main point to you, whether you rephrase or not brother, the truth remains, Christians don't go to hell!

So we agree LOL