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I was just hearing the preaching by Kirk Cameron on [edited by Yeshua no LINKS are to be posted without Chad's permission first. READ THE RULES:WARNING #1].It is really great. you should check it out. Go to the site, click on tools and then free audio lessons. That's one awesome preaching and just gives you ideas on how to bring people to God.
Anyway, this thing from his preaching bothered me. I used to be so happy on how God has saved from the burning fires of hell and I wouldn't go there. I mean I still am very happy that that happened and I wont go to hell but I more thrilled that I would be able to see Jesus. The thought of hell doesn't scare me as much as the thought of losing Jesus FOREVER.
I just couldn't see the sincerity of wanting Jesus just for escaping hell. Is that all we want him for? Escaping the wrath of God? What about the person he is and just the fact that he is God, hell or no hell? What if there was no hell? would it be ok for us to just goon with our worldy lives?
But again the preaching made me think twice if I am really broken about offending God. Have I really repented? I remember that I used to repent for the things I did when I was a new christian but I just say, "lord, forgive me." I mean that is not healthy!
Anyway, Please do listen to it and lets discuss about it
Peace
 
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Member
Is "escaping hell" good eanough?

Jesus's always said:
I was just hearing the preaching by Kirk Cameron on [edited by Yeshua no LINKS are to be posted without Chad's permission first. READ THE RULES:WARNING #1].It is really great. you should check it out. Go to the site, click on tools and then free audio lessons. That's one awesome preaching and just gives you ideas on how to bring people to God.
Anyway, this thing from his preaching bothered me. I used to be so happy on how God has saved from the burning fires of hell and I wouldn't go there. I mean I still am very happy that that happened and I wont go to hell but I more thrilled that I would be able to see Jesus. The thought of hell doesn't scare me as much as the thought of losing Jesus FOREVER.
I just couldn't see the sincerity of wanting Jesus just for escaping hell. Is that all we want him for? Escaping the wrath of God? What about the person he is and just the fact that he is God, hell or no hell? What if there was no hell? would it be ok for us to just goon with our worldy lives?
But again the preaching made me think twice if I am really broken about offending God. Have I really repented? I remember that I used to repent for the things I did when I was a new christian but I just say, "lord, forgive me." I mean that is not healthy!
Anyway, Please do listen to it and lets discuss about it
Peace
Romans 6:23 says, "The wages of sin is death (spiritual death- permanent separation from God- as well as mortal death)." That is the price we pay if we go to hell.
As bad as that is, escaping it is not enough to bring us the abundant life Jesus wants for us. When people are only running away from something and keep looking back at what they are running from, they stumble and fall and perhaps give up. But, people who are running toward something, keeping their focus on the prize, and do not look back always tend to keep their feet. They trip and fall less often or not at all. We must keep our eyes set on the prize, as Paul says in Philippians 3:14. Running away from something is stressful. Running toward a goal is hopeful.
SLE
 
Member
"Running away from something is stressful. Running toward a goal is hopeful."....What a wonderfuly spirit filled statement SLE! Thanks!
John
 
Member
amen SpiritLedEd! good post

We must keep our eyes set on the prize, as Paul says in Philippians 3:14. Running away from something is stressful. Running toward a goal is hopeful.
 
Member
Our FATHER... who art in HEAVEN..

But you see.. again... that we aren't to be "obeying in fear" of the Lord as in the Old Covenant, but to LOVE HIM and want to worship Him BECAUSE HE LOVED US FIRST! First of all, people in fear don't think very well. Secondly, who wants a child to love you because he's scared of you?? That's just a crazy notion, and God changed it all in the second covenant. Now the Law is on our Hearts... and because we LOVE GOD, we want to obey Him, LOVE HIM BACK as our Almighty Father who has the GRACE TO FORGIVE US. Things are to be on Earth as they are in Heaven? Is there sin in Heaven? No. We are to "go and sin no more" but we are to do this as our show of Love; and loving us back in His Amazing Grace that is bestowed upon us through Christ Jesus, He FORGIVES US for our sins, those He died for!
Jiggyfly... maybe the concept of God is too limited here. Remember He is watching everything, He is the CREATOR. HE KNOWS WE ARE TRYING... HE KNOWS our HEARTS. And once you know the difference, between good and evil... and what sin is, He expects you to try your hardest. Scripture says this, that once you know, you can't go back to your old ways; you must be a "changed man through Christ" or you wouldn't even be a Christian in the first place, by definition. And... when it comes to trials, tribulations, and temptation - God has promised He will not test you beyond your limits, doesn't this seem like a pretty fair deal? It does to me!
As I am a new parent (step parent) I have learned some absolutely awesome things about how parents and adults interact. Obedience is the highest form of love that I see from my Children too - it tells me they have learned what I have taught them, they listen to me, they LOVE me, they TRUST ME, and when I see them doing things as I have asked, or have INTERNALIZED THE VALUES I TEACH THEM, so even when I don't HAVE TO ASK... because they KNOW what is "right"... it WARMS MY HEART BEYOND ALL SPEECH. They are obedient children, a beautiful sight to behold; they know I've taught them this, in love. I want them to respond to me, and to this instruction with love. Not fear!! NEVER EVER fear! This is what their old home did to them, made them scared to death to make an error, and damaged them, made them confused and afraid to speak. Now... for the last two years, they have a LOVING HOME... IF THEY MAKE AN ERROR, I do NOT get angry. I sit down and explain, again, with patience, lots of love, understanding... why this is wrong. They feel guilty, sometimes they get a little punishment for it. Next time, they'll be obedient - and they will feel good about it, because they know they are pleasing WHO LOVED THEM FIRST, and bothered to teach them. They return that love, through their obedience. Well, isn't all this the same with our Heavenly Father, if He made us in His image and He lovingly calls us "His Children"? Nobody can condemn their children to hell! That's just... not a plausible concept. So for us, God's Children, logically He isn't going to condemn us to hell after we've received Christ; but yes, judgement and punishment comes from disobedience - you experience it RIGHT HERE on Earth. Every time you go against God's will in your Earthly life - you'll suffer, I promise you. That's because God wrote the Human Manual - The Bible. NOTHING IS WISER when it comes to people, how they operate, what motivates them... and more importantly HOW TO LIVE. If you go against it, it won't work out. It NEVER DOES. God created you, and nobody knows you better than He does. A good example is premarital sex. If you do this, you may think you're getting away with something - but you're not. You're throwing away every blessing in your marriage, before you even get there for God to reward your obedience. Not only that, but if the wedding doesn't come off, then there's a bunch of punishments waiting for you having that intimacy before commitment; HORRIBLY hurt feelings, perhaps unwanted pregnancy, and more. God knows what He is doing; He is trying to SAVE YOU in every way from the ravages of this Earthly world, by keeping your eyes on His Law, His Will for you, His promises for you, and Jesus Christ. He doesn't want to punish you EVEN MORE for those mistakes, you're going to get it bad for that ANYWAY... Another good example is divorce. Nothing is MORE miserable. You can't tell me living in lies is fun, or coveting anything is a "good time"... each and every one of these commandments is BUILT TO HELP US as human creatures, by our "manufacturer". I honestly believe we have "escaped hell" and are saved through our Faith that Christ died for our sins; but I just as strongly believe that is is our behavior, our obedience through our love of our Heavenly Father that we receive blessings - not only here on Earth - but this is how we store our REAL treasures - in Heaven.God bless you for seeking the truth here at Talk Jesus, Jiggyfly! :girl_hug:
In Christ, :love:
CaliFlower :rose:
 
Member
"We aren't to be "obeying in fear" of the Lord"
This contradicts the Word of GOD. "Fear God" is written from the front of the Book to the Back.

1Pe 1:17 And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning [here] in fear:

So for us, God's Children, logically He isn't going to condemn us to hell after we've received Christ; but yes, judgement and punishment comes from disobedience - you experience it RIGHT HERE on Earth.
Again, this contradicts the Word of GOD.

Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

We know the Word confirms and repeats the message of damning our own souls thru disobedience over and over again.

Cauliflower, I do not know why you say "God bless you for seeking the truth here at Talk Jesus, Jiggyfly! " except to suggest jiggyfly does not know the truth? You on the other hand, have already made several very erroneous statements in your posts that clearly contradict the Word of GOD, and you have openly rejected any Godly attempt at discussion that might show you that you are in error according to the Word. I am not making this statement in defence of jiggyfly, as his one year record here at Talk Jesus speaks for itself, that he adheres to the Word of GOD, in letter and spirit.

I do suggest however that you prayfully take time to ask yourself why you are here, and what it is you seek to accomplish. Teaching anything that does`nt line up with the Word will not be permitted, once you have been shown it does not line up. Also any more unfounded remarks of a negative connotation made to, or about any member here will not be tolerated.

1Pe 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
 
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Staff Member
What does it mean to have the fear of God?

Question: "What does it mean have the fear of God?"

Answer: For the unbeliever, the fear of God is to fear the judgment of God and eternal death, which is eternal separation from God. For the believer, the fear of God is something much different. The believer's fear is reverence of God. Hebrews 12:28-29 is a good description of this, "Therefore, since we receive a kingdom which cannot be shaken, let us show gratitude, by which we may offer to God an acceptable service with reverence and awe; for our God is a consuming fire." This reverence and awe is exactly what the fear of God means for Christians. This is the motivating factor for us to surrender to the Creator of the Universe for His service.

This was not simply a New Testament concept however as we read the same attitude was required of early saints as spoken of in Deuteronomy 10:12,20-21 "Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, You shall fear the LORD your God; you shall serve Him and cling to Him, and you shall swear by His name. He is your praise and He is your God, who has done these great and awesome things for you which your eyes have seen." Here reverence was demanded because they had actually seen the awesome hand of God. There are several key figures who were spoken of as having the fear of God but one in particular was Abraham.

Article taken from GotQuestions.org
 
Member
califlower I totally Agree with Chad here about what the biblical FEAR of the LORD ME

Chad said:
What does it mean to have the fear of God?
Question: "What does it mean have the fear of God?"
Answer: For the unbeliever, the fear of God is to fear the judgment of God and eternal death, which is eternal separation from God. For the believer, the fear of God is something much different. The believer's fear is reverence of God. Hebrews 12:28-29 is a good description of this, "Therefore, since we receive a kingdom which cannot be shaken, let us show gratitude, by which we may offer to God an acceptable service with reverence and awe; for our God is a consuming fire." This reverence and awe is exactly what the fear of God means for Christians. This is the motivating factor for us to surrender to the Creator of the Universe for His service.
This was not simply a New Testament concept however as we read the same attitude was required of early saints as spoken of in Deuteronomy 10:12,20-21 "Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, You shall fear the LORD your God; you shall serve Him and cling to Him, and you shall swear by His name. He is your praise and He is your God, who has done these great and awesome things for you which your eyes have seen." Here reverence was demanded because they had actually seen the awesome hand of God. There are several key figures who were spoken of as having the fear of God but one in particular was Abraham.
Article taken from GotQuestions.org
califlower
I totally Agree with Chad here about what the Biblical FEAR of the LORD really means, it would do you a lot of good to study up on this real concept of what Biblical FEAR of the LORD really means. It does mean we should reverence God.

:love: You In Christ Jesus, Sister, Your Brother, Yeshua
 
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Member
Also I agree with Coconut.

Coconut said:
This contradicts the Word of GOD. "Fear God" is written from the front of the Book to the Back.
1Pe 1:17 And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning [here] in fear:
Again, this contradicts the Word of GOD.
Gal 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
We know the Word confirms and repeats the message of damning our own souls thru disobedience over and over again.
Cauliflower, I do not know why you say "God bless you for seeking the truth here at Talk Jesus, Jiggyfly! " except to suggest jiggyfly does not know the truth? You on the other hand, have already made several very erroneous statements in your posts that clearly contradict the Word of GOD, and you have openly rejected any Godly attempt at discussion that might show you that you are in error according to the Word. I am not making this statement in defence of jiggyfly, as his one year record here at Talk Jesus speaks for itself, that he adheres to the Word of GOD, in letter and spirit.
I do suggest however that you prayfully take time to ask yourself why you are here, and what it is you seek to accomplish. Teaching anything that does`nt line up with the Word will not be permitted, once you have been shown it does not line up. Also any more unfounded remarks of a negative connotation made to, or about any member here will not be tolerated.
1Pe 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.

Also I agree with Coconut, sister, califlower! Coconut is giving you very good advise. Please I ask you to carefully consider Coconut's words. I'm going to pray that you harden not your heart concerning these matters. We are all still learning in our walks with the Lord and that is one of the best reasons not to point fingers at others but to pull the planks out of our own eyes first as JESUS would say.

I :love: You In Christ as much as I can califlower
 
Member
I agree with most of your posts here.
I don't know how much preaching about the fearfulness of hell will be effective rather than the love of God though the way Kirk puts it is pretty great.
 
Member
Dis-ci-pline (dis'e-plin)1. Training expected to produce a specific character or pattern of behavior,especially training that produces moral or mentail improvement. 2. Controlled behavior resulting from disciplinary training; self control.
If you have received Jesus Christ into your life then you have already agreed to the teaching of true christian philosophy, and you are in fact willing to be taught more in order to improve yourself futher. We all feel the Love of Jesus, as this is His commandment. John;13:34-35 A new commandment I give unto you, That you love one another;as I have loved you, that you also love one another.35 By this shall all men know that you are my disciples,if you have love one to another.(notice the spelling of disciple and discipline)
It is human nature to let go of your fear when you are relaxed enough to love God;however it is still necessary to fear Almighty God in his ability to dash you to pieces or burn you in everlasting fire. When we lose the fear we sometimes lose the will or desire to improve our humbility before our Creator and God. We must never forget that He spoke and all that there is became existant. Even the "Big Bang theory" illistrates this from their description of one proton entering into a total vacuum.Nevertheless,we must keep our priorities in line with what is the truth, looking alway toward the Truth and the Spirit. Granted it is more than wonderful to be saved through Jesus Christ,but we must never fall short of granting Him praise,glory and worship forever and ever. Praise Almighty God creator of Heaven and Earth;blessed be His name "Holy,Holy,Holy Lord God Almighty",Amen.MGBY(May God bless you).
 

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