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Discussion in 'Bible Answers' started by Chad, Aug 12, 2008.
Goodo Kit. Yes we/men are often wrong.
Please by all means if you see me act like a dummy challenge me.
You see there are a couple reasons I came back to the forum. One was I became mislead by the words of men. I would get into all these great theological discussions and by doing so I began putting the wisdom of man ahead of the wisdom of God.
Just like the story of the man picking up sticks. I listened to the modern religion of man, oh how mean is God, if I was God I would not do such a thing, I am so much better than God. Surely God needs to learn compassion.
Understand?? Sure you do, you challenged what I said. I see on the forum many dangerous things, where they may or could lead others to where I was. I was steadily allowing myself to walk away from God. I was listening to the words of men.
I am also here to listen, so all of you can help me with my walk. To cause me to understand if I do not.
Words by men guided by God are good, words of men guided by men are bad.
Great theological discussions can and do lead men away from God. as we become wiser than God.
So you will see much of this message in my words. I fell away, and now return , stronger than I was.
God is our teacher, if we listen he will teach. If we listen to men, and do not test all things, we become led astray.
So I now avoid such things, and just speak from the heart. I seldom quote a scripture, but for sure study them, but avoid separate scriptures as they in themselves can mean different things to all, without the understanding of the entire picture.
So I am just me........
A persons sexual life while single is an area that christians have given advice that often comes from the dark ages. I have been amazed at the stupid ignorant advice given by some who think they are an expert. Dr. James Dobson has written two books for girls and boys and it is solid and Biblical.
When sex between a male and female, married or not, sex is a special Holy Gift given by God. The world and many christians ignore the way God intends sex to be between a man and a woman. Out of marraige sexual involvement is sin. In marriage birth control is generally not examined close enough by most all christian couples. Is it right to kill a egg that has been fertilized? Is causing the the egg to not attach, or die when it is attached to the wall of the womb right? Is abortion ever right? Should we as christians not allow God to determine how many children we have, or is that our right?
Are we so worldly that we adopt the world's way of having both parents work? Must we have the best house, car, and everything money can buy, and so we limit our children so we can
have all we want, except children. What is wrong with a large family? Are we missing God's best so we can "have" the best the worly has to offer? Is the birth control that the world offers what God wants for us? There is a natural birth control that uses the tempature of the womans body that is natural, and cost little or nothing, and causes no harn to either the baby or woman/
So what are not more christians informed about a more natural birth control method?
Think about it, most nonchristians have made our birth control methods, and mostly for unmarried unsaved people.
Have we become so far from God that we no longer consider children one of the reasons God has made sex for marraige. I am old fashion, and much og what I think now has changed as I grew older. I wish my wife and I knew then what we know now.
This statement is erroneous. Sex between the unmarried is no gift from God, but is a stolen thrill. Sexuality between a husband and wife, a couple who loves Jesus Christ, and desires to follow Him and honour God are the lawful recipients of that gift.
I'm sorry but all this talk of sex as a gift and even capitalizing it as Holy Gift is going too far. The only special Holy Gift (Capital G) from God is the Holy Spirit. Sex is not really a gift in the sense of us being given something that we do not originally have, it is part of nature.
I believe that in God's eyes there is no such thing as "sex before marriage". Sex is not for marriage nor marriage for sex. Sex is marriage. When two become one through intercourse, that is marriage. That should help the unmarried consider that sex "before marriage" is actually more serious than portrayed by society. Then the unmarried should consider that any further acts of sex with any other person is actually adultery.
Modern society portrays sex as one of the highest sources of pleasure. This is not true. Take away the "stardom" of sex that is promoted by pornography, the media, and Hollywood.. and call it for what it really is. Then the unmarried should see that behind sex is a fundamental biological urge that everyone has, and that sex is not the same as portrayed in the movies, and that the only true source of lasting joy and pleasure is to experience an intimate relationship with the Father through Jesus Christ.
Well said. I'm not a woman so I don't know the consequences to the body but let us approach this from the perspective of being guided by Biblical principles.
Now, here is the answer. To get the answer we would ask Jesus because obviously He knows everything.
So what would Jesus say?
Well if you read scripture time and time when people brought a situation to Jesus, from the lady caught in adultrey to the issue of paying taxes to the issue of divorce, Jesus addressed the root of the issue not just the surface or presenting problem.
I beg to challenge all that if Jesus was speaking on this issue He would not answer it as we would expect but as He mostly did He would ask questions to have us take a look at out hearts to really see what it is all about. So let me lead you on that process.
So ask yourself these questions when it comes to this topic.
1. Who is most important in your life? God, your spouse, yourself or your Children?
2. If God told you to not take any contraceptives would you, could you obey Him. How would if make you feel? ( Don't think about right or wrong, but just if you had to obey, similar to how God to Abraham to kill his son and Abraham knew that murder was a sin)
3. If God told you that you could use contraceptives, could you obey Him or would you feel guilt?
( Don't think about right or wrong, but just if you had to obey, similar to how God to Abraham to kill his son and Abraham knew that murder was a sin)
4. What aspect of God's character if any comes to mind when you think about contraceptives?
5. Do contraceptives glorify God and bring people closer to God or are they a tool of the enemy that promotes sexual sin?
6. Do you want to know what God really thinks about this issue or do you want God to affirm what you already believe?
7. If you are seeking truth, if God's position was opposite of what you currently believe about this topic, would you obey or hold fast to what you think is right?
8. The enemy works normally through our desires of the flesh, promoting the works of the flesh ,but; God works through the Holy Spirit to bear Spiritual Fruit. Which direction would one take on this topic if their flesh was leading them and which direction would one take if the Spirit was leading?
9. What are the harms of contraceptives? Are does pleasing to God?
10. What are the benefits of contraceptives? Are they pleasing to God?
Obviously I didn't give an answer but just questions to reflect on. Most people (myself included) at times we are in the flesh and have our minds made up. We don't seek truth, because the truth demands a response and often times that looks like change. Ask yourself when was the last time you changed your view about any issue in life based on looking at scripture. If you can't think of the last time then be cautious because I assure you that no one in this flesh is 100% right about everything they believe. The key is to be humble and earnestly seek truth and God will reveal His Will. But the problem is most don't seek truth, because the truth often requires us to
One key issue that I have changed my mind on based on the Bible is abortion. I won't say which way.
But if you have never in recent memory changed your mind on anything, ethier you already know it all (I doubt it, remember humility is a mark of a Child of God as God opposes the prideful) or you have sadly kept a closed mind on many issues.
It can be scary to change our position on a key issue because our beliefs determine how we see the world, how we treat people, and what our expectation of God and others are. Changing simple positions on issues like gay marriage, or a woman's role, or the eternal or not aspect of hellfire, or what Salvation is, or if God created the world in 7 literal days, such changes ion those topics means that our whole world view would need to change, and many people don't want to change. They don't want to start doing things differently.
It is similar to a racist being told that slavery is wrong in the 1830s but refuses to believe. For them if they believe it is wrong them their conscience will convict them of doing wrong. They would have to start working the fields themselves. They would loose money. Their quality of life would go down. So that person holds on to what they believe because they don't want to live in a world where what they are doing is wrong.
Likewise I'm still not saying yea or nay on the contraceptive issue but rather just pointing to each of us(myself included) that we need to examine how open we really are to hearing God's Truth , and if we heard it, would be change if we needed to.
That is the real question, not if contraceptives are a sin but are we earnestly seeking God's truth or are we married to our positions no matter what(evidenced by the fact that our mind has not yet changed on anything )?
Once we get saved the process of sanctification starts. We start growing in the faith. This growth means that our old ways of thinking change as the Holy Spirit works in us. He works so that many positions ( not all but many) that we had that was similar with the carnal world we find to be contray to the will of God.
1. Does the church have the same position as the carnal world on this topic? If so, is that a problem or is it OK to be the same as the world on this issue? ( As some issues are OK to be the same with the world like eating healthy whereas others are not, like the free sex movement)