What's on the other side of eternity?
Why does God send people to hell?
- Thread starter Chad
- Start date
I struggle with MT 26:24 The Son of man goeth as it is written of him: but woe unto that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! it had been good for that man if he had not been born.
The scriptures had to be fulfilled. I know God is right and I'm too low to understand but I wish hell were different and Judas wouldn't have to suffer eternally.
Nor my mother-in-law who I never heard say anything mean about anyone but didn't believe in a supreme being.
Bill
Loyal
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2018
- Messages
- 5,227
That I can believe my friend
I agree my friend
KingJ
Active
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2015
- Messages
- 5,412
1. Imagine having on your conscience, the fact that you betrayed Jesus, for all eternity. And 2. how every person you meet for the rest of eternity will know and refer to you as the person who betrayed Him.
I think that is more the context Jesus was alluding to. No sins of the wicked are covered. They are all known. Imagine being known for that sin when we will all get to see the glory and love of Jesus firsthand.
You are not low. Christians can judge all matters 1 Cor 2:15.
One-day, you will sit down with God and have a cup of tea with scones and discuss the punishment of the wicked. God will ask you for your thoughts on what He has decided to do. He will be an open book with absolutely nothing to hide. Everything He does, we will agree with Him on as we will judge it as good, righteous, merciful and loving. We have seen this with Abraham on Sodom and Moses with the golden calf.
God is the best judge. He is the one you want to judge you. He does not repay evil with evil.
Psalm 145:17 God is righteous in all His ways.
KingJ
Active
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2015
- Messages
- 5,412
I just want to harp on this and sorry if I am repeating myself.
God does not want any to perish. 2 Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some men count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
God does not want to see Judas suffer either. But what are His options? What can He do with Judas? What would you do with Judas?
Let's say we saw his heart would never desire true repentance of sin. So what would we do?
1. Punish him for his sin. Justice requires this. Justice is never repaying evil with evil. But it is a punishment according to the sin. So, a mild, agonising fire for ten years. Fine, we all agree?
2. We have to isolate him as no unrepentant sinner can be allowed into heaven to mix and socialize with repentant sinners. So we keep him in a prison with 'other criminals'. Aka LoF.
3. We can't put cute animals in prison for him to look after as he and others will torture them. So no cute pets in hell. Pets are actually a very interesting point to consider. The Geneva convention wanted Germans in concentration camps to be able to have their pets with them. It was considered extra torturous to keep them from them.
4. No sins are covered and forgotten as we are who we are. Imagine in hell, God remove the memory of person X being a murderer. They throw a party in hell and invite person X, he turns out to be a terror at the party. God would be to blame. All will know Judas as the guy who betrayed Jesus for all eternity.
5. The best we can do is to give Judas and other prisoners 'yard time'. Access to things to do. Nice things to eat. Etc.
I always think of the life demons currently live. Cast out of heaven because they loved what is evil more than they hated it. Much like humans sold out to evil, hard hearts that will never be able to truly repent of their sins. But yet, they can do so many things. God opens the door to many activities for them.
A. They can possess evil humans.
B. They can make UFO's.
C. They can make bodies like grey aliens and mermaids and walk around at night.
D. They can fly in their UFO's to distant planets.
E. They can engage with humans who want to engage with them.
F. Jesus honored their request to be cast into pigs.
G. God asked the devil what he was up to and he replied 'roaming here and there'. Job 1:7.
Think on these. I am 100% certain that all those in hell for eternity will still have activities to do and things to keep themselves busy with.
But all this considered, much like the horror of being a pedophile in a prison housing many thieves who got caught stealing for a better life for their children, Judas will be in a prison where all know the beauty and splendor of Jesus.
How much can God, you and I help him? Of course we will. It just is what it is. It will really really suck to be him.
Thanks for the detailed reply and for that reference. I was thinking of IS 55:9 so I do trust His justice is perfect. The part I struggle with most is "it had been good for that man if he had not been born". Jesus picked Judas in the twelve knowing he would accomplish that dirty task. The part that is not good isn't God creating Judas but Judas exercising his free will in an evil way.
If hell was not everlasting the wicked human heart (JER 17:9) would too easily choose wickedness in this world so hell is the way it needs to be.
My wife has visions and saw a sombre place where her unbelieving grandmother is. People there still had a home and food but there was absolutely no joy and calling on Jesus took her out of there. She was also given a brief experience of a light place and the feeling is indescribably glorious. Scripture is our rock and personal experience should be tested against it and rejected if contradictory.
KingJ
Active
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2015
- Messages
- 5,412
I don't believe Jesus picked Judas knowing he would betray him. He knew at a point in time sure, but not at the time he was picked.
Free will and God's omniscience is one of the hardest topics to discuss and grasp. We need to be so careful of 'reading into' scripture what is not there. We have to take scripture as it is. If scripture for example says ''God wills all be saved 1 Tim 2:4'', that means that from birth God does not know who will be saved.
Jesus picked 12 disciples He believed would be best for spreading the gospel. Full stop. That at a later point one did what he did is a separate topic.
Anyone who thinks they can correctly grasp and define God off of a word 'omniscient', needs to explain to me how He was created. We cannot grasp God. We have to blindly stick 100% to what scripture actually says and scripture teaches us that God is both omniscient and good at the same time. IE His omniscience is limited by His goodness. If it can be proven that knowing something in advance is evil, He does not know it. This would be the case with not only Judas, but all who end up in hell. It would be extremely evil of God to create someone to be evil when He has also created an eternal hell for them.
Shame, I hope her grandmother was saved and is in heaven.
Amen brother. That's why threads like this about God and hell are so long.
Interesting proposed solution to the paradox. Bottom line there are things I don't understand about God but I fully trust Him.
th1bill
Active
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2012
- Messages
- 591
Romans 8:29
For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren;
Source: 15 Bible verses about God's Foreknowledge
God knew before He created, There are at least 13 other verses confirming this.
KingJ
Active
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2015
- Messages
- 5,412
Hi Bill. Correct me if I am wrong. I believe are not a 5pt Calvinist but you do lean heavily toward predestination as they do?
Would you agree that: (If not please explain why).
A. If God is righteous in all His ways Psalm 145:17, He can do no evil.
B. When you have created an eternal hell of punishment for the wicked, creating someone wicked (foreknowledge that they would be wicked) from birth is extremely evil.
And, if you are in fact a 5pt Calvinist, please also explain to me where God comes from. 5pt Calvinists are so certain of their belief in God's omniscience albeit that it heavily incriminates Him as pure evil, that surely they should also be able to grasp how He came into existence. Since they espouse to know God so well.
