Dave M said:

Luke 22:31-32
“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat, but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.


Seems to me permission is granted so that Peter faith is strengthen, for man this may seem cruel, but those with eternal eyes this is a blessing to have your faith made greater

so Does God use the devil to make his servants stronger in faith is the question ??

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I don't know if I would say that God uses the devil, but rather, this verse tells us that even though the devil desires to consume us, yet Jesus cares for us and will help us endure and grow stronger. It doesn't specifically say that satan is demanding of God or asking permission (altho you could get that implication) but we do have the verse that God will not allow us to be tempted beyond what we are able... so in that sense, God does control what level of temptation we undergo.

1 Corinthians 10:13

Chad4Him said:

It doesn't specifically say that satan is demanding of God or asking permission

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Luke 22:31-32
“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat, but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.

Dave M said:

Luke 22:31-32
“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat, but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.

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Yes that is very interesting. The Greek says that it is "all of you" that Satan demanded to have. See here.

Berean Study Bible
Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift each of you like wheat.

Chad4Him said:

Yes that is very interesting. The Greek says that it is "all of you" that Satan demanded to have. See here.

Berean Study Bible
Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift each of you like wheat.

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wow great information. I cant but help see similarities in this verse and some of the book of Job.

Chad4Him said:

God will not allow us to be tempted beyond what we are able... so in that sense, God does control what level of temptation we undergo.

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satan is out to sift every single believer. he tries to destroy our faith by proving it does not work. he tries our faith constantly.

Another way to see "God will not allow us to be tempted above our ability to handle"

This is true when we are walking in His Ways. No matter what we face when we do as instructed within His Word then we walk in His strength.
On the other side if we try to handle things our ways then it is our strength that we are left with and that's when things get difficult and over take us.

Paul considered things to be "light afflictions" but if he would have walked in his strength they would have been devastating.

Also remember Jesus or God the Father new satan would come after them.
Jesus explained this ahead of time to encourage him to not let this destroy him.

They were still being taught the ways of God and REMEMBER Jesus had not gone to the cross yet or stripped satan yet.

Blessings

Wired 4 Fishen said:

Another way to see "God will not allow us to be tempted above our ability to handle"

This is true when we are walking in His Ways. No matter what we face when we do as instructed within His Word then we walk in His strength.
On the other side if we try to handle things our ways then it is our strength that we are left with and that's when things get difficult and over take us.

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Thanks for those thoughts. We have the verses in James that temptation comes from our own lust. Of course we may be troubled by our lusts yet there is a key here, I believe.. Is it saying that we are actually tempted after we have been drawn away by our lust? So we need to recognize this in our life and set our eyes and affection on God and His Word.

James 1:13 When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He tempt anyone. 14But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. 15Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death

Colossians 3:1Therefore, since you have been raised with Christ, strive for the things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God. 2Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. 3For you died, and your life is now hidden with Christ in God

Chad4Him said:

James 1:13 When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He tempt anyone. 14But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. 15Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death

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I have never seeen that verse in that light before thank you brother !!

Dave M said:

I have never seeen that verse in that light before thank you brother !!

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I think too often we blame the devil for what "he made us do" when in fact we had unholy desires and did not pray about them and confess them, and ask the Lord to help us to overcome them.

Think of how many days our Lord spent in prayer before He was tempted in the wilderness. This should be an example to us!

Chad4Him said:

I believe.. Is it saying that we are actually tempted after we have been drawn away by our lust?

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Amen Brother and that in itself is a complete different topic that should be dug into as well. Its an eye opener.
Blessings

Wired 4 Fishen said:

Amen Brother and that in itself is a complete different topic that should be dug into as well. Its an eye opener.
Blessings

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Yes would be a great topic, would love to discuss it!

Chad4Him said:

I think too often we blame the devil for what "he made us do" when in fact we had unholy desires and did not pray about them and confess them, and ask the Lord to help us to overcome them.

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Another awesome topic to dig into.
Those lust or desires or wants first start with thoughts. Those thoughts are some of those fiery darts.
Failed to take captive and destroyed by His Word.

Blessings

Dave M said:

Luke 22:31-32
“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat, but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.


Seems to me permission is granted so that Peter faith is strengthen, for man this may seem cruel, but those with eternal eyes this is a blessing to have your faith made greater

so Does God use the devil to make his servants stronger in faith is the question ??

Click to expand...

Of course He does, just like in the book of Job.

satan could not approach Peter until He got God's permission first. And the words Christ said to Peter, are not the words you want to hear. "...but I have prayed for you..." That means He will turn him over to satan. And what is the result, the denial of Christ of whom Peter said he would die for. I doubt Peter ever recovered from that. And that is what God wanted.

Quantrill

Quantrill said:

satan could not approach Peter until He got God's permission first

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Please Brother do not keep telling people this.
If this is what you believe then you do not understand how our enemy works.
Blessings

Wired 4 Fishen said:

Please Brother do not keep telling people this.
If this is what you believe then you do not understand how our enemy works.
Blessings

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I do understand how the enemy works. What you and others are refusing to believe is how God works.


Quantrill

Quantrill said:

I do understand how the enemy works. What you and others are refusing to believe is how God works.


Quantrill

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Brother no offense meant but this time you are going to have to listen and understand what is written in God's Word. It does not jive with what you are insusting.

Here are two scriptures of many that do not agree with your thinking.

1. 1Peter5:8
Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.

2. Ephesians 4:27
27 Neither give place to the devil.

satan is not roaming around to see who God will allow him to get at.

Why would God tell us to give no place to the devil if it was up to Him?

Come on Brother, think!!
Blessings

Wired 4 Fishen said:

Brother no offense meant but this time you are going to have to listen and understand what is written in God's Word. It does not jive with what you are insusting.

Here are two scriptures of many that do not agree with your thinking.

1. 1Peter5:8
Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.

2. Ephesians 4:27
27 Neither give place to the devil.

satan is not roaming around to see who God will allow him to get at.

Why would God tell us to give no place to the devil if it was up to Him?

Come on Brother, think!!
Blessings

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Good verses all.

satan does roam looking whom he may devour. We are told not to give place to the devil. All true.

None of this negates the fact that satan can require access to some believer, and he can only get it from God. Else forget what (Luke 22:31-32) says. He can only get access if God permits. Just like with Job. (Job 1:8-12)

Quantrill

Quantrill said:

Good verses all.

satan does roam looking whom he may devour. We are told not to give place to the devil. All true.

None of this negates the fact that satan can require access to some believer, and he can only get it from God. Else forget what (Luke 22:31-32) says. He can only get access if God permits. Just like with Job. (Job 1:8-12)

Quantrill

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You are grasping at straws and telling me nothing but what you believe.
satan is out to sift us all. he needs our permission not Gods.

Blessings

@Chad,

Chad4Him said:

Thanks for those thoughts. We have the verses in James that temptation comes from our own lust. Of course we may be troubled by our lusts yet there is a key here, I believe.. Is it saying that we are actually tempted after we have been drawn away by our lust? So we need to recognize this in our life and set our eyes and affection on God and His Word.

James 1:13 When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He tempt anyone. 14But each one is tempted when by his own evil desires he is lured away and enticed. 15Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death

Colossians 3:1Therefore, since you have been raised with Christ, strive for the things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God. 2Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. 3For you died, and your life is now hidden with Christ in God

Click to expand...

Chad4Him said:

I think too often we blame the devil for what "he made us do" when in fact we had unholy desires and did not pray about them and confess them, and ask the Lord to help us to overcome them.

Think of how many days our Lord spent in prayer before He was tempted in the wilderness. This should be an example to us!

Click to expand...

The reason the devil is blamed because he is the tempter. Everyman is tempted when they are drawn away of their own lust. Jesus was tempted... was He lusting being drawn away of His own lust? Jesus (like every other man) was drawn away to be tempted through how He felt emotionally. All temptation is blamed on the devil because the devil is the tempter of man.

Matthew 4:3
And when the tempter came to Jesus, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
Matthew 4:5
Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,
Matthew 4:6
And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee:and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

How did the devil take Jesus up to the pinnacle of the temple? Jesus didn't take the devil by the hand and say, take me up to the pinnacle. Jesus was led through how He felt emotionally (mentally) in these temptations. Jesus was tempted in all point as we are - through emotions. Believers are responsible for their own bodies in their times of temptations/lust because the devil makes "us feel" lustful in our bodies. It is our responsibility to say "no" to the devil's offering and bring our bodies into subjection by resisting the devil and putting on Christ's word. Paul tells us it's not us that's tempting ourselves, but Satan.

Romans 7:17
Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin/Satan that dwells in me.

1 Corinthians 9:27
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

@Wired 4 Fishen,
Though Jesus prayed for Peter, was it God's will for Peter to "fail" Jesus when he denied Him three times?

Luke 22:31
And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
Luke 22:32
But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.
Luke 22:33
And he said unto him, Lord, I am ready to go with thee, both into prison, and to death.
Luke 22:34
And he said, I tell thee, Peter, the **** shall not crow this day, before that thou shalt thrice deny that thou knowest me.