@Daniel L. -- you might want to consider the fact that in the beginning God created Adam and Eve but spoke everything else into existence. And when Adam and Eve realized they were naked -- they tried to cover themselves with leaves -- but God provided an animal skin for them.. in order to aquire that animal skin an animal had to be killed..
Is it LAWFUL to kill animals?
- Thread starter Daniel L.
- Start date
brighthouse98
Active
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2017
- Messages
- 349
Daniel I am not under the law,because those who are can never be saved! You put the Law above Jesus??? wow You cannot make enough sacrifice's yourself to make it to heaven. For the Law was and is powerless to save!! ( Rom 8:3-4)) The law was under the flesh AND Jesus ate fish!!! That is meat as well. LOL ( Luke 24:41-43) You sure do not know your bible.
Waggles
Loyal
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2015
- Messages
- 2,541
Good grief !! Is this the doctrinal basis for our 7th day adventist vegetarian churchies ??
And yet God declares through the holy Spirit -
1Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons,
2 through the insincerity of liars whose consciences are seared,
3 who forbid marriage and require abstinence from foods that God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.
4 For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving,
5 for it is made holy by the word of God and prayer.
Do you want me to show you where the same Father created both the animals and man? What is the interpretation of that? Other than they have the same Father? And are therefore brothers.
It doesn't say God killed them, they could have died of natural causes, because this is after death had entered the world. But if you really want to say God killed them, then these animals must have had provoked the Lord in some way, because God hates hands that shed innocent blood. And He can't hate Himself.
No? Was no one saved before Jesus? Abraham, Noah, Moses, King David? From righteous Abel to Zachariah? Really? -They were saved under the Law, and the Law is forever, it will not pass away:
Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
I am against kill steal and destroy both humans and animals, like sheep for example:
John 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
12 But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep.
- I'm here defending the life of animals like sheep, like the Good Pastor did, and taught. You are the one supporting killing and destroying them, just like a thief and a wolf.
brighthouse98
Active
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2017
- Messages
- 349
Daniel Better read ( Heb 11:32-40)!! None received salvation through the law. They had to be made perfect through US!!!! Which includes all the disciples as well!!! ( Matt 11:11) Ever read the NEW Testament?? Its NEW for a reason. And I sure would say I am the least in the Kingdom of God!
Samson2020
Active
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2016
- Messages
- 1,984
Romans 14:1-3 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations. For one believes he MAY EAT ALL THINGS,
another, who is weak, eateth herbs. Let him not that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him that eateth not judge
him that eateth: for God hath received him.
another, who is weak, eateth herbs. Let him not that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him that eateth not judge
him that eateth: for God hath received him.
brighthouse98
Active
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2017
- Messages
- 349
One other point Daniel under the law all the disciples should have received the same punishment as Judas, for all the disciples betrayed Jesus! ( Matt 26:56) Please get out of the cult you are now in! For Jesus did fulfil the law because there was no way we ever could! If I wanted to give you a million dollars in my will, you could not receive it until after I died, hence why Jesus had to die for us to receive.
If I received before Jesus why did Jesus arrive in the first place? Please look at Exodus 19:5-8 Verse 8 we will do! In short the Greek tell us these 3 words were the jews telling Jesus we do not wish your grace like Abraham, we can do this ourself! This angered the Lord greatly!!!!! Now read on what happened after this! Now the Lord comes to Moses in a thick cloud, now the people cannot go to the mountain without dying ( Exodus 19:9-13!!)
THEN!!!! He gives them the Law, The Ten Commandments ( Exodus 20) Now If the law is still in effect the every idol worshipper should not be alive! For 3000 died that day because of it! ( Exodus 32:28) and Exodus 32:35) The Ten Commandments was also part of the OLD Covenant (Exodus 34:28!!!) LOL bet you never saw that scripture . Well Daniel I know it will not be me who calls for your about face, but as the Lord's Disciple it is my duty to speak the truth in love, only Holy Spirit can open your eyes even as he did me.
If I received before Jesus why did Jesus arrive in the first place? Please look at Exodus 19:5-8 Verse 8 we will do! In short the Greek tell us these 3 words were the jews telling Jesus we do not wish your grace like Abraham, we can do this ourself! This angered the Lord greatly!!!!! Now read on what happened after this! Now the Lord comes to Moses in a thick cloud, now the people cannot go to the mountain without dying ( Exodus 19:9-13!!)
THEN!!!! He gives them the Law, The Ten Commandments ( Exodus 20) Now If the law is still in effect the every idol worshipper should not be alive! For 3000 died that day because of it! ( Exodus 32:28) and Exodus 32:35) The Ten Commandments was also part of the OLD Covenant (Exodus 34:28!!!) LOL bet you never saw that scripture . Well Daniel I know it will not be me who calls for your about face, but as the Lord's Disciple it is my duty to speak the truth in love, only Holy Spirit can open your eyes even as he did me.
brighthouse98
Active
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2017
- Messages
- 349
The best example I can give in scripture as to the large difference between the 2 Covenants would be found here. ( 2 Kings 1:10-12) ok this is under the Law. Now Look!!! ( Luke 9:49-56!!!)
I Can show you where animal life came into being. Genesis 1 on days 5 and 6. Vs 24-25.
After that vs 26 "then God said, let us make man in our image , according to our likeness : let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air and over the cattle , over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth. So God created man in His own image.
People are created special. We are Not part of the animal world. We were given dominion over the animal world. They are here for our enjoyment / for hunting for sport and or eating.
And as for the animals skins that God provided for Adam and Eve. You want to believe that they died of natural causes. Nothing in scripture states that. God was the only one on earth at that time other than Adam and Eve. Scripture is silent on that. The fact is that animal skins were provided by God.
Samson2020
Active
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2016
- Messages
- 1,984
Seems to me that in the Law God required the sacrifice of animals, thus to kill them was to fulfill the Law. Even though the animal blood did not clear the conscience from sin.
That said it was the blood of a sinless man that eventually accomplished that, so it might be concluded that an animal that cannot sin, as the law is not written for animals,
when killed was not a sufficient sacrifice, thus less than a man.
We won't even mention that God sent quail into the camp in the wilderness for the Hebrews for food.
That said it was the blood of a sinless man that eventually accomplished that, so it might be concluded that an animal that cannot sin, as the law is not written for animals,
when killed was not a sufficient sacrifice, thus less than a man.
We won't even mention that God sent quail into the camp in the wilderness for the Hebrews for food.
James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
Genesis 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.
Ecclesiastes 1:9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
10 Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us.
No, they didn't. They scattered like sheep without a pastor, that is not betrayal. Don't speak evil of dignities.
Psalm 119:1 Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the Lord.
3 They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.
22 Remove from me reproach and contempt; for I have kept thy testimonies.
44 So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever.
55 I have remembered thy name, O Lord, in the night, and have kept thy law.
56 This I had, because I kept thy precepts.
67 Before I was afflicted I went astray: but now have I kept thy word.
100 I understand more than the ancients, because I keep thy precepts.
This is another reason not to kill them, because God is not a murderer. So, if you bear the image of God, you shouldn't be killing your brothers, because God is not a murderer. And He doesn't delight in death, not even the death of the wicked. So, it isn't sport nor fun to kill them. And just because you have dominion over the animals, doesn't mean you can kill them, you also have dominion over your childreen and you can't kill them based on that.
Scripture says God hates hands that shed innocent blood. So if the animals had innocent blood, God didn't kill them, because God cannot hate Himself. It also says He delights not in the blood, nor in the death of the wicked, so the only way God killed the animals is if they were guilty and it was still very displeasing to Him.
Jeremiah 7:22 For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:
Didn't the serpent sinned in the Garden? Wasn't the serpent judged and punished for her transgression, the same way adam an eve were judged and punished for their transgression. -Not even snakes are allowed to lie. The fact that the serpent was punished, proves it was not allowed.
He didn't kill the birds, He allowed them to be catched and killed by the people who lusted after flesh. It was the people who killed the birds. And the reason He allowed them to kill the quail, was for the filling up of the chalice of their condemnation, which they drank shortly after:
Numbers 11:33 And while the flesh was yet between their teeth, ere it was chewed, the wrath of the Lord was kindled against the people, and the Lord smote the people with a very great plague.
34 And he called the name of that place Kibrothhattaavah: because there they buried the people that lusted.
Samson2020
Active
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2016
- Messages
- 1,984
This sums up my position.
The serpent that TALKED in the garden was Satan not an ordinary snake.
Even if it was Satan who tempted the snake, the snake was still a snake, a beast of the field, and the snake was still tempted, and sinned. The snake still sinned.
Waggles
Loyal
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2015
- Messages
- 2,541
Well today being Saturday I and my sons are going over to my daughter and son-in-law's house to have BBQ.
I shall thank God for providing all that we eat for it nourishes us and thank God for the day and our blessings.
What other people do is what other people do - let them eat salad.
I shall thank God for providing all that we eat for it nourishes us and thank God for the day and our blessings.
What other people do is what other people do - let them eat salad.
brighthouse98
Active
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2017
- Messages
- 349
LOL Waggles!!!!
The snake was an animal that acts on instinct. There's a question as to whether Lucifer entered the snake or was the snake. The snake was the one tempting and lying to Eve getting her to question whether or not to believe what God told her.
To say that the snake was tempted and sinned is ludicrous.
Animals -- irrigardless of what kind of animal -- are Not our brothers and sisters. The animal world is totally separate from the world of male and female human beings.
