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Is Ravi Zacharias in Hell?

Loyal


Very interesting discussion. They are discussing the Ravi Z scandal that came
out after his death.

Full report on the investigation is here.

Reminds me that we are all sinners and need to guard our hearts and beware of giving the devil any foothold in your life.

Our faith is in Jesus, not in our leaders, yet we need to be honest with our struggles and ask for help if we are struggling with sin.
 
Loyal
Interesting. Not sure I agree with all of it.
But I agree with the bottom line here. How we live determines where we spend eternity.
 
Active
Ravi Zacharias and his eternity is nobodys business but Ravi Zacharias and God...Why bother yourself about it? Don't waste your time.
 
Loyal
There isn't a "one single reason", but the overwhelming scriptures in the Bible give one reason. Sin - bad fruit, or no fruit at all, unrepentance.

John 5:28; "Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,
John 5:29; and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

Matt 3:10; "The axe is already laid at the root of the trees; therefore every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

Matt 7:19; "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

Matt 13:41; "The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness,
Matt 13:42; and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Matt 18:8; "If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than to have two hands or two feet and be cast into the eternal fire.


Matt 7:23; "And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

Luke 13:3; "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
Luke 13:5; "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish."

Matt 25:41; "Then He will also say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels;


Rev 20:12; And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds.
Rev 20:13; And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds.

1Cor 6:9; Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
1Cor 6:10; nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

Gal 5:19; Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality,
Gal 5:20; idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions,
Gal 5:21; envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

This is the best I can do on short notice, and although I believe faith in Jesus is required for salvation, none of the verses above say we will be judged by our faith or what we believe in. They all say we will judged by what we do.
What we practice, and how we live.

Rom 6:23; For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1Jn 3:6; No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him.
1Jn 3:7; Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous;
1Jn 3:8; the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9; No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
1Jn 3:10; By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

Rom 1:32; and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

Matt 19:16; And someone came to Him and said, "Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?"
Matt 19:17; And He said to him, "Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments."

1Jn 2:3; By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
1Jn 2:4; The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;
1Jn 2:5; but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him:
1Jn 2:6; the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

1Jn 3:24; The one who keeps His commandments abides in Christ, and Christ abides in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Rom 6:16; Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

Similarly, why do people not go to heaven?

Heb 4:6; Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience,
Heb 4:11; Therefore let us be diligent to enter that rest, so that no one will fall, through following the same example of disobedience.
 
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Loyal
I can't speak for Ravi, I don't know where he is now. The Roman Catholics have a score keeping process based of works.
But obeying the commandments isn't a work, it's just something we are expected to do.

While obeying the commandments isn't considered a good work, not obeying the commandments IS considered a bad work.
They try to balance out the good works and bad works. However I don't view it that way. I think you could sin for 99% of your life and get saved on your death bed.

In the same way, you could be like Solomon, a Godly man for most of your life, and then in the last few years you could turn away.
How you live your life matters, sin matters. But more than how you lived your entire life... is how you are living right before you meet Jesus.

Luke 12:44; "Truly I say to you that he will put him in charge of all his possessions.
Luke 12:45; "But if that slave says in his heart, 'My master will be a long time in coming,' and begins to beat the slaves, both men and women, and to eat and drink and get drunk;
Luke 12:46; the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will cut him in pieces, and assign him a place with the unbelievers.


This servant may have been a great, obedient slave for 30 or 40 years. But then one day he decides Jesus wont be coming back for a while, I can sin for a while.
If Jesus comes back during this time of rebellion... it doesn't end so good. You get treated just like an unbeliever. ( verse 46 )
Now meeting Jesus may not mean the 2nd coming for you. You could die and meet Jesus tonight.

I am reminded of a few football games I have watched over the years. One team is ahead the whole game... then in the last few seconds, the other team kicks a field goal and wins.
Which team will be ahead when you meet Jesus?
 
Loyal
i just don't like these people how they call people the man of God the woman of GOD. for years and lift these people so high. Then after years when they die and their sins come to light, Now they are on their way to hell or now they are not saved. Stop lifting these people up in the beginning. There is none righteous no not one. And keep these leaders under tight control. Apostle Paul and Peter, did not have to deal with high heel shoes nylon stocking shapely skirts, sweet smelling aphrodisiac perfumes, legs showing females, big hip "Delilah"'s.

And some men are hardly never hit on my women, But some men are, hit on a lot and they look good. And some women, know how to talk, and make you for get all about GOD.. And that Devil, toss some of that "Star Dust" in the air, feels like Magic. and put those Spiritual handcuffs on you! You cannot move! That devil has power, That is why the only escape, you must Run! EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO LEAVE THAT CHURCH! You will be surprise of some of these women, that has a certain type of power surrounding them. Will destroy you! A lot you men have not experience this, because you are no threat to the kingdom of God and its message. The devil is not going mess with you on such a level. So you all sit around at the round table , gossiping and slandering men after the have fallen or pronounce dead. and never condemning the acts of these women that are nothing but the Agents of Satan! Shame on all you men and women! For not calling these women, out, they are not innocent!

Shame, you don't mind making them presidents, vice president, CEO, Pastors, Ministers, Teachers of the BIBle! And soon as one has cause a man to fall, and cried tears, and tore up homes and family by such a great deception, You jealous men, the 1st thing you do, is tear the man a part. I know you slanders your are sinners, I been have sexual assault about 3 times in my life, and threaten, by them of lies, and I have been scared to tell anybody, because I know christian evil ways! and how they respond to Godly men!

These women wear G strings tight Skirts, sexual heels, Gap legs sitting , showing the tops of their breasts, flirting with other men in the Church. And christians on a full scale do not call them out into pure embarrassment! This looks good and very attractive to a strong and healthy man full of Testosterone. Eye candy to the man. A strong man cannot hold those feelings back! it is time for all to get real!

"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. Abstain from all appearance of evil."

King James Bible
"Neither give place to the devil".

American Standard Version
Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is caused to stumble, and I burn not?

King James Version
Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

We are to proclaim good news, They should have spoke out when he was doing this! How come they did not see this, while it was going on, Blind as bat they were. He is dead now, Now the are discussing not the "gospel of Jesus Christ" but the doctrine of Speculation"! There is nothing good they are talking about.

I wish i could really say what i want to say about these slanders.
 
Loyal
I can't speak for Ravi, I don't know where he is now. The Roman Catholics have a score keeping process based of works.
But obeying the commandments isn't a work, it's just something we are expected to do.

While obeying the commandments isn't considered a good work, not obeying the commandments IS considered a bad work.
They try to balance out the good works and bad works. However I don't view it that way. I think you could sin for 99% of your life and get saved on your death bed.

In the same way, you could be like Solomon, a Godly man for most of your life, and then in the last few years you could turn away.
How you live your life matters, sin matters. But more than how you lived your entire life... is how you are living right before you meet Jesus.

Luke 12:44; "Truly I say to you that he will put him in charge of all his possessions.
Luke 12:45; "But if that slave says in his heart, 'My master will be a long time in coming,' and begins to beat the slaves, both men and women, and to eat and drink and get drunk;
Luke 12:46; the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will cut him in pieces, and assign him a place with the unbelievers.


This servant may have been a great, obedient slave for 30 or 40 years. But then one day he decides Jesus wont be coming back for a while, I can sin for a while.
If Jesus comes back during this time of rebellion... it doesn't end so good. You get treated just like an unbeliever. ( verse 46 )
Now meeting Jesus may not mean the 2nd coming for you. You could die and meet Jesus tonight.

I am reminded of a few football games I have watched over the years. One team is ahead the whole game... then in the last few seconds, the other team kicks a field goal and wins.
Which team will be ahead when you meet Jesus?


Sounds like you're doing a 'good works' salvation.

You're saying that a person can 'bad work' their way Out of being saved? Then you're commenting that it's how a person is living their lives right before meeting Jesus. Isn't that part of a good work's based salvation? And, it's true that we will be answering to God for our actions.

Isn't part of the 'keeping power' of the Holy Spirit that of holding on to us even when we've messed up?

The prodigal son Did return home.
 
Loyal
You're saying that a person can 'bad work' their way Out of being saved?

I'm not saying that, the verses I posted in post #9 are saying that.

Isn't that part of a good work's based salvation?

I believe good works are required to maintain salvation. I've never said otherwise. We can start a thread about that if you like. Dozens of verses say so.
But you are still confusing two different things, that the Bible never confuses. Obedience is NOT a good work.
Have you killed anyone this week? Have you stolen from anyone? Are you having an affair with someone else husband this month?
Have you been making up lies about someone? The answer for most of us is "NO". If it's not, we need to look at our hearts and even our salvation.
So then if obedience is a good work. You've been doing good works all this time. But we don't get "extra credit" for being obedient, it's just what we have to do.
Good works aren't not killing someone. Good works are feeding the hungry, Clothing the poor, visiting the sick, and things like in the end of Matt 25.
Speaking of this passage, what if I don't do good works... then what?

Isn't part of the 'keeping power' of the Holy Spirit that of holding on to us even when we've messed up?

The Bible says we can go too far. We can sin too much and too often.
Yes we are sealed by the Spirit, yes He will never leave us of forsake us, yes no one can pluck us out of His hand.

God was with Moses and the Jews the whole time they were in the desert. He fed them, made sure their clothes didn't wear out, parted the Red sea for them, made water come out of the rock for them.
God was always with them for 40 years. But even though God was with them, they didn't make it into the promised land.
God is with many Christians today, His Spirit is trying to guide them... but they are refusing to be obedient.
In another thread "7 most sobering passages" I 've given two passages so far about people who had the Holy Spirit but still didn't get saved. (there are more)
No one can take us from Jesus, but Jesus Himself says He will cast out some of His servants who are lazy and sinful.
 
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Loyal
One of the problems I have with the video in post #1, is that one of speakers keeps mentioning
the "limiting restraint of the Holy Spirit". What is this? Where is the scripture to support this?
How is it limited? Why is it limited? Where does it say the Holy Spirit is limited?
 
Active
@B-A-C -- so , if a person lives a pretty good life, he'll probably end up in heaven?

That depends ONLY on whether of not the person is Born Again of the Holy Spirit. It's FAITH in the SIN OFFERING of Jesus on the cross that saves, not a person's "works".

NO CHRISTIAN lives a perfect life before God - not YOU, not ME, nobody!!! That's why we have an ADVOCATE in Jesus, and his BLOOD applied to cleanse.

No argument that SOME Christians sin in a more spectacular (and more damaging) fashion -
 
Member
True, but why isn't it?
Good question. One has to remember the scriptures tell us the names in the Lamb's Book of Life were written there by God before God created the world or people.


As to Ravi Zacharias, the panel in the OP in my view should be rebuked for calling out a dead man when they didn't follow scripture per Matthew 18 when RZ was alive.

No one is yet in Hell as we know per the Book of Revelation. However, if God knew RZ by name then it is as the member observed. It is between RZ and God now.

How we judge our departed brother Ravi Zacharias is also between us and God as what we now seem to be committing to, per the men in the OP video, is gossip.

 
Loyal
1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers
will inherit the kingdom of God.
 
Loyal
Is Ravi Zacharias in Hell?
The answer is no. Ravi sleeps awaiting for either the first resurrection [the dead in Christ] or for the second resurrection.
As for us still here ...
Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling,
 
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