Thoughts on Job

[KingJ]

Now you think about it....If there is salvation for Nephil, why is there no salvation for the fallen angels?

God is good and a good God gives all intelligent creation true free will. Angels had it. They were with God and then some chose to leave, some chose to stay. Humans definitely have it. The cross is only necessary for humans because we were not in God's presence from the beginning. We go from sin to righteous. This is why Jesus and the cross is part and parcel with the creation of humans. No Jesus, no human creation.

 

[KingJ]

Nope!
I know whom I belong to and who I serve. I have no fear but I Love, Cherish, Adore and worship my God.

My God would not ever harm me in any way.

You are correct I do Not support something the Word Of God does not support such as the doctrine of demons called osas.

You are truly confusing me with your belief. How is it that you are anti-OSAS and do not fear God? You do not fear an eternity in hell?

Paul says we should continue working out our salvation in fear and trembling Phil 2:12.

Fearing God is a sign of respect and a sign of loving God. Loving God is hating what is evil Rom 12:9 and obeying His commandments. Hating what is evil creates a fearful expectation in us of eternal hell if we stop hating what is evil or disobey His commandments.

 

[Quantrill]

Of course Jobs fears for his kids was not at all strange or uncommon....What he did wrong was not the feeling of fear, but what he did with it. He gave it credence.....over Gods Word. I have no doubt that it would be harder for people of the Old Covenant to overcome fear, not having the Holy Spirit in them...but it was not impossible to do either.

I will ask again, what 'Word of God' was that?

Quantrill

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

You are truly confusing me with your belief. How is it that you are anti-OSAS and do not fear God? You do not fear an eternity in hell?

Brother KJ,
You are misinterpreting what I am conveying here.
I am not saying a prideful I am not afraid of My Heavenly Father The God and Creator of life.

I am saved and in a covenant relationship with my God through Christ Jesus.

He has instructed me to come Boldly into The Thrown Room anytime I desire.
He has given me His name sake and promised me Life in abundance with Him.

He has promised me that in Him His Promises are Yes and Amen. He has healed me and delivered me.

Fear Him as afraid? No friend I am in Love with Him and I honor Him and bow down and worship Him.
I may tremble in awe in His Presence but He is my Abba Father and He Loves me and I shall not fear Him

Blessings and Love in Christ
Wired

 

[KingJ]

Brother KJ,
You are misinterpreting what I am conveying here.
I am not saying a prideful I am not afraid of My Heavenly Father The God and Creator of life.

I am saved and in a covenant relationship with my God through Christ Jesus.

You don't fear losing that? Since you don't believe in OSAS?

He has promised me that in Him His Promises are Yes and Amen.

The reality of God testing us at anytime He chooses completely debunks this unscriptural line. Job would disagree as would Paul 2 Cor 11:16-33.

He has promised me healing. He has promised me wealth. Job where is your faith? Uhm no.

 

[Bendito]

I will ask again, what 'Word of God' was that?

Quantrill

Are you saying that you don't know? Really? God spoke with Adam...That's Gods Word, God spoke with Enoch...That's Gods word. God spoke with each of the prophets who passed it on to the people....That's Gods Word...God spoke to Job!

And you have to ask. "What Word of God?"

 

[Quantrill]

Are you saying that you don't know? Really? God spoke with Adam...That's Gods Word, God spoke with Enoch...That's Gods word. God spoke with each of the prophets who passed it on to the people....That's Gods Word...God spoke to Job!

And you have to ask. "What Word of God?"

You said Job gave fear credance over God's Word. Where does it say that? Where does God say that?

Listen to what God says. (Job 1:8) "Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? "

And also: (Job 42:7) "And it was so, that after the LORD had spoken these words, unto Job, the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, My wrath is kindled against thee, and against thy two fiends: for ye have not spoken of me the thing that is right, as my servant Job hath."

What a testimony God gives concerning Job. Concerning the things Job said. A perfect and upright man, who rightly fears God. Not unrightly as you claim.

So yes, I do have to ask, because your view of Job is contrary to God's view of Job.

Quantrill

 

[Bendito]

You said Job gave fear credance over God's Word. Where does it say that? Where does God say that?

Listen to what God says. (Job 1:8) "Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? "

And also: (Job 42:7) "And it was so, that after the LORD had spoken these words, unto Job, the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, My wrath is kindled against thee, and against thy two fiends: for ye have not spoken of me the thing that is right, as my servant Job hath."

What a testimony God gives concerning Job. Concerning the things Job said. A perfect and upright man, who rightly fears God. Not unrightly as you claim.

So yes, I do have to ask, because your view of Job is contrary to God's view of Job.

Quantrill

You asked. "You said Job gave fear credance over God's Word. Where does it say that? Where does God say that? "
How about....Job said it himself "
Job 3:24-25 (CJB)
24 (25) for the thing I feared has overwhelmed me,
what I dreaded has happened to me.
25 (26) I have no peace, no quiet, no rest;
and anguish keeps coming.”

Then you said. "Listen to what God says. (Job 1:8) "Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? "
Oh Boy! Really?! Are you here to teach, learn, or fight? Look at the scripture you swung at me like a weapon.

Here's the verse where Job says he listened to the spirit of fear.....The word fear= pachad or

1. to fear, tremble, revere, dread, be in awe or dread
   1. (Qal)
      1. to be in dread
      2. to be in awe
   2. (Piel) to be in great dread
   3. (Hiphil) to cause to dread

Job was a man who feareth God. Fear = yare' which means fearing; morally, reverent: or a reverential respect...
You're looking at two different words... Job reverentially respected God and still caved in to terror or dread for his kids....
If you want to argue Word, you must know the Word....And you get to know the Word by digging into it and letting the Holy Spirit teach you.

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

You said Job gave fear credance over God's Word. Where does it say that? Where does God say that?

Listen to what God says. (Job 1:8) "Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? "

Think, is not God All Knowing?
He was not asking as in He did not know already . He was staying a step ahead of satan.

 

[Quantrill]

You asked. "You said Job gave fear credance over God's Word. Where does it say that? Where does God say that? "
How about....Job said it himself "
Job 3:24-25 (CJB)
24 (25) for the thing I feared has overwhelmed me,
what I dreaded has happened to me.
25 (26) I have no peace, no quiet, no rest;
and anguish keeps coming.”

Then you said. "Listen to what God says. (Job 1:8) "Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? "
Oh Boy! Really?! Are you here to teach, learn, or fight? Look at the scripture you swung at me like a weapon.

Here's the verse where Job says he listened to the spirit of fear.....The word fear= pachad or

1. to fear, tremble, revere, dread, be in awe or dread
   1. (Qal)
      1. to be in dread
      2. to be in awe
   2. (Piel) to be in great dread
   3. (Hiphil) to cause to dread

Job was a man who feareth God. Fear = yare' which means fearing; morally, reverent: or a reverential respect...
You're looking at two different words... Job reverentially respected God and still caved in to terror or dread for his kids....
If you want to argue Word, you must know the Word....And you get to know the Word by digging into it and letting the Holy Spirit teach you.

To teach, learn, or fight, either or. Doesn't bother me.

(Job 3:24-25) says nothing about Job giving credence to fear over God's Word. Nothing. Yes, Job had a fear of these things, but that doesn't mean Job is out of the will of God. It certainly did not contradict God's Word. If it did, show me where it did.

We are told in (Job 1:5) Job was acting based on the fear he had. Yet in (Job 1:8) God said of Job that there was none like him, and he was perfect in all his ways. So, you can play all the gymnastic games you want concerning the word 'fear' to try and color your interpretation. But, God saw nothing wrong with Job. Scripture is clear here.

You are arguing as Job's three friends, (if you can call them that), of whom God says they spoke of things not right about Job. And Job spoke of things right about God. (Job 42:7)

So, concerning (42:7), who am I to believe? You or God? Guess which One I choose.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

Think, is not God All Knowing?
He was not asking as in He did not know already . He was staying a step ahead of satan.

What is that supposed to mean? God was staying a step ahead of satan?

Quantrill

 

[Bendito]

To teach, learn, or fight, either or. Doesn't bother me.

(Job 3:24-25) says nothing about Job giving credence to fear over God's Word. Nothing. Yes, Job had a fear of these things, but that doesn't mean Job is out of the will of God. It certainly did not contradict God's Word. If it did, show me where it did.

We are told in (Job 1:5) Job was acting based on the fear he had. Yet in (Job 1:8) God said of Job that there was none like him, and he was perfect in all his ways. So, you can play all the gymnastic games you want concerning the word 'fear' to try and color your interpretation. But, God saw nothing wrong with Job. Scripture is clear here.

You are arguing as Job's three friends, (if you can call them that), of whom God says they spoke of things not right about Job. And Job spoke of things right about God. (Job 42:7)

So, concerning (42:7), who am I to believe? You or God? Guess which One I choose.

Quantrill

I definitely would prefer you to believe God over me. Of course! But to believe God, you still have to know what He says. Job was perfect....For some insane reason, Christians invariably translate that to mean that Job was without sin. The word perfect + tam means

1. complete, perfect
   1. one who lacks nothing in physical strength, beauty, etc
2. sound, wholesome
   1. an ordinary, quiet sort of person
3. complete, morally innocent, having integrity
   1. one who is morally and ethically pure

It does not say Job was sinless....The only one without sin was/is Jesus. Nobody else....Job sinned when he gave fear credence over Gods Word.....Ok. How did He give fear credence? Simple. Job 1:5 As you said...Job acted on his fear. You are using the Word to prove yourself wrong...But that makes it easier to prove what I'm saying is correct.
So Job sinned....He was still a good man who pleased God to the point where God could brag on him.

 

[Bendito]

What is that supposed to mean? God was staying a step ahead of satan?

Quantrill

God has always stayed a step ahead of Satan....There is a book out there called "The Cosmic Chess match" You should get it and read it. You might just learn a few things.

 

[Quantrill]

I definitely would prefer you to believe God over me. Of course! But to believe God, you still have to know what He says. Job was perfect....For some insane reason, Christians invariably translate that to mean that Job was without sin. The word perfect + tam means

1. complete, perfect
   1. one who lacks nothing in physical strength, beauty, etc
2. sound, wholesome
   1. an ordinary, quiet sort of person
3. complete, morally innocent, having integrity
   1. one who is morally and ethically pure

It does not say Job was sinless....The only one without sin was/is Jesus. Nobody else....Job sinned when he gave fear credence over Gods Word.....Ok. How did He give fear credence? Simple. Job 1:5 As you said...Job acted on his fear. You are using the Word to prove yourself wrong...But that makes it easier to prove what I'm saying is correct.
So Job sinned....He was still a good man who pleased God to the point where God could brag on him.

I didn't say Job was sinless and neither did God. I didn't say it was a sin for Job to fear. You did. But Job was perfect before God meaning in all that he knew, he was acting in accordance to the will of God. God found no fault in him.

You, however, just as Job's three friends, are attributing sin to Job when there was no sin there. Why did God say Job has spoken of Me the things that are right? And why was God angry with those that found fault with Job? (Job 42:7)

The whole point of the book of Job is that there was no reason for these troubles to come upon Job due to his walk with God. The only reason these troubles came upon Job is because God willed it due to the spiritual warfare and antagonism between Him and satan. And we are never told that God revealed to Job as to why these things occurred. Job had now learned that troubles, tragedy, and suffering are not always a sign of God's displeasure. It is many times the result of the unseen war going on constantly in the spirit realm. And in these times we are to trust God, not question God.

You have completely missed the entire message of Job.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

God has always stayed a step ahead of Satan....There is a book out there called "The Cosmic Chess match" You should get it and read it. You might just learn a few things.

I don't hold to any 'Cosmic Chess Match'. God is not in any race with or playing games with satan. He is accomplishing His will and using satan to do it. satan had to report to God as well as the other angels. (Job 1:6) (Job 2:1) satan was not trying to get one up on God. satan acts with his hatred towards God and God's people. God was using satan and Job and Job's three friends to teach a truth not known before. A truth you totally missed.

Quantrill

 

[Dave M]

Job had now learned that troubles, tragedy, and suffering are not always a sign of God's displeasure

very insightful and makes sense, I often wonder about that. I mean look at all the 3rd world countries people are born into poverty they suffer in ways people of America would never imagine. What we see as displeasure was actually a blessing because now Job is even stronger in his faith. What is more important then being stronger in our faith.



James 1:2-4
Count it all joy, my brothers, when you meet trials of various kinds, for you know that the testing of your faith produces steadfastness. And let steadfastness have its full effect, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.

John 16:33
I have said these things to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world.”

James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.

 

[Bendito]

very insightful and makes sense, I often wonder about that. I mean look at all the 3rd world countries people are born into poverty they suffer in ways people of America would never imagine. What we see as displeasure was actually a blessing because now Job is even stronger in his faith. What is more important then being stronger in our faith.



James 1:2-4
Count it all joy, my brothers, when you meet trials of various kinds, for you know that the testing of your faith produces steadfastness. And let steadfastness have its full effect, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.

John 16:33
I have said these things to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world.”

James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.

Nobody said suffering is a sign of God's displeasure...Jesus came so that we might have life, and life abundantly. Suffering does not fit in there... Satan is the author of sickness and death....God is the giver of life. I thought all Christians knew this.

 

[Bendito]

I didn't say Job was sinless and neither did God. I didn't say it was a sin for Job to fear. You did. But Job was perfect before God meaning in all that he knew, he was acting in accordance to the will of God. God found no fault in him.

You, however, just as Job's three friends, are attributing sin to Job when there was no sin there. Why did God say Job has spoken of Me the things that are right? And why was God angry with those that found fault with Job? (Job 42:7)

The whole point of the book of Job is that there was no reason for these troubles to come upon Job due to his walk with God. The only reason these troubles came upon Job is because God willed it due to the spiritual warfare and antagonism between Him and satan. And we are never told that God revealed to Job as to why these things occurred. Job had now learned that troubles, tragedy, and suffering are not always a sign of God's displeasure. It is many times the result of the unseen war going on constantly in the spirit realm. And in these times we are to trust God, not question God.

You have completely missed the entire message of Job.

Quantrill

Well walking in fear is contrary to the way Gods people are to walk...He says "The just shall walk by faith? Not fear....That makes it sin to walk in fear because it's contrary to God's Word. Here; Sin is anything that is contrary to Gods Word. If you disagree with that, show me in the Word.

 

[Bendito]

I don't hold to any 'Cosmic Chess Match'. God is not in any race with or playing games with satan. He is accomplishing His will and using satan to do it. satan had to report to God as well as the other angels. (Job 1:6) (Job 2:1) satan was not trying to get one up on God. satan acts with his hatred towards God and God's people. God was using satan and Job and Job's three friends to teach a truth not known before. A truth you totally missed.

Quantrill

God does NOT employ a sadistic, murdering liar for any reason...That would be totally contrary to His own nature.....My Goodness! What a way to think of God!

 

[Dave M]

Jesus came so that we might have life, and life abundantly. Suffering does not fit in there

Brother @Bendito I want to make sure you know I love you and respect you as a brother in Christ and are common love for Jesus is what unites us praise the Lord.

how would you explain all the suffering going on in third world countries?? there are people that suffer and die every day, we do not know the reason for that, are you suggesting they all bring on the suffering them selves?

the abundantly life referred to in the bible is one of spirit not materialism is my understanding.