Perhaps you can clarify by stating that you believe that Jesus is the one true God.
The Trinity...Biblical or NOT ???
- Thread starter Donnie Ducati
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I believe what that bible tells us. There is God the Father, there is God the Son (Jesus Christ), there is the Holy Spirit/Ghost/Comforter/Spirit of Truth and they ALL are one just how Jesus tells us they are one in the 17th chapter of John.
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RJ
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You bring confusion and un-clarity.
They are all the same the one true God!!
These below verse are "only" a few that state that Jesus is God!
How do "YOU" answer them then?
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 100%; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif; MARGIN-LEFT: auto; FONT-SIZE: 100%; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>6</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace Isaiah 9:6
Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. Isaiah 44:6
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 100%; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif; MARGIN-LEFT: auto; FONT-SIZE: 100%; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>23</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us. Matthew 1:22
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 100%; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif; MARGIN-LEFT: auto; FONT-SIZE: 100%; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>8</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>9</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? John 14:8-9
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 100%; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif; MARGIN-LEFT: auto; FONT-SIZE: 100%; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>8</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Revelation 1:8</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
You continue to confuse with this one verse of yours that you think proves your point. But, in these above verse, not once is the term "God The Son" used...why is that?
How do you answer theses Bible scriptures?
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I know that Jesus is God...never said otherwise. Jesus is just the ONLY God man has ever known. Man has never known God the Father...so the words above are true. As far as man is concerned there HAS only been one God; Jesus Christ!
The one that made everything that was made and shared His glory with the Father!
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Did Adam know God the Father?
RJ
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I wish you would stop saying this over and over...it is simply not true.
I gave these already but you failed to answer them to support what ever silly argument that you are trying to push.There are many verses that prove the Trinity! Here is just 2 again!
And another thing, why is it you quote John 17 but not the verse, like the rest of us do....please quote Chapter and verse!!
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 100%; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif; MARGIN-LEFT: auto; FONT-SIZE: 100%; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>8</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.</TD></TR><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>9</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father? John 14:8-9
<TABLE style="WIDTH: 100%; FONT-FAMILY: sans-serif; MARGIN-LEFT: auto; FONT-SIZE: 100%; MARGIN-RIGHT: auto" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=t_verse vAlign=top>8</TD><TD style="WIDTH: 100%" class=t_text vAlign=top>I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Revelation 1:8
You agree Jesus Christ is Jesus Christ and here says that he is also God.
They are all thre different and at the same time one!..It is a mystery...please get over it!
Just like we all make up the body of Christ!...How does that work?
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How could he if Jesus said the following?
St. John 5: 37 – And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
But we know that Adam and Eve heard God in the garden....
Gen.3
[9] And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?
[10] And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.
[11] And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?
[12] And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
[13] And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.
So.....did Jesus lie? Of course not. Adam and Eve heard the one that made everything that was made;
Jesus Christ! The same God that said the following;
Zech 12 vs. 10: And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and supplications: and they shall look upon ME whom they have pierced,
John 17
[8] For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
So the words that Jesus gave the world were not His own, but were the words given to Him from the Father.
[9] I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
[10] And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
So all that are Jesus are also the Father's. How is this possible?
[11] And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
So all those that was given to Jesus are one, the SAME as Jesus and the Father are one. So those that are one, are one, because they ALL have the SAME WORDS that was given to Jesus by the Father. Then Jesus tells us they are one just the SAME as He and the Father are one. So how are Jesus and the Father one? Jesus is one with the Father because He has the Father's WORDS within Him. Let's continue.....
[14] I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[15] I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
[16] They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Again...it's the WORDS that Jesus gave them that makes them one.
[20] Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
[21] That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
And now we see that ANYONE that believes the WORDS that were given are also one, JUST LIKE the Father art in Jesus and Jesus in the Father.
Let's read how Jesus tells us this doctrine again. Let's read how JESUS tells us, not man, how He and the Father lives in us and we in Him.
John 6
[55] For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
[56] He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
[58] This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
Jesus tells us if we eat His flesh and drink His blood that He will dwell in us and we will dwell in Him. Not only will He dwell within us, if we eat His flesh, drink His blood and eat the bread that He gives we will live forever. Well we know this can not be literal, so let's read how Jesus explains it.
[61] When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
[62] What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
[63] It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
So....Jesus was not talking about His flesh, blood and bread...it's His WORDS that are spirit and are life. So if we consume His words He will dwell within us. And where did Jesus get those words that dwell within us? From the Father. So Jesus dwells in the Father because Jesus consumed HIS words. So if Jesus consumed the words of the Father and we consumed those same words given to us by Jesus, according to what He told us in John 17...we are ALL ONE!
Now this is Jesus explanation of how He and the Father are one. This was not something that took over 300 years to figure out. This is what the disciples read and this is how Jesus explained to them just how He, the Father and ALL that brought the same message are all one. Now.....speaking about the message........what about the Holy Spirit/Ghost/Comforter? Let's read what God tells us about him and the message He brings.......
John 16
[13] Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
[14] He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
[15] All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
So the Holy Spirit, will NOT speak anything other than what was given to Him. So He comes with the same message as Jesus. And Jesus came with that SAME message that was given to Him from His Father. So just like He said in John 17, anyone that comes with the same message are ONE! Let's read one more verse;
1 John 5
[7] For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
Well now.....NOW we can see HOW they are one! They are ONE because they are all on one accord; they ALL bring the same message. Let's confirm....
Rev.1
[1] The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
So God the Father, gave His message to Jesus Christ. And Jesus Christ gave that SAME message to His angel, an Holy Angel/Spirit/Ghost. That angel gave that same message to John. And John wrote was was given to him so that we too could be one with God!
How simple is that! Where is the 'mystery' here?
Wonder what Jesus meant when He said "Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and yet you still don't know who I am? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father! So why are you asking me to show him to you?"
Note Jesus said "seen" was the message a video?
John 14 refers to the Holy Spirit as a He, Him, or whom 7 times. Jesus is saying that the Holy Spirit is a separate being. There is a lot of info on this to much for here and now.
1. The Father is the invisible God.
2. Jesus is the visible manifestation of the Father
3. The Holy Ghost is another individual sent from Heaven. Rev. speaks of at least 7 different Spirits of God.
Jesus says the Father will send the Spirit in His name. That is the Spirit that is dwelling in us has Jesus’s name as well. Sorta like Jesus Christ, Christ is the last name of Jesus. So the Holy Spirit is Christ in us.
1.God the Father is spirit Invisable
2.God the Son is the soul man God
3.God the Holy Spirit is a seperate spirit sent down from heaven to abide in the believer in the name of Jesus the Christ in us.
1. The Father is the invisible God.
2. Jesus is the visible manifestation of the Father
3. The Holy Ghost is another individual sent from Heaven. Rev. speaks of at least 7 different Spirits of God.
Jesus says the Father will send the Spirit in His name. That is the Spirit that is dwelling in us has Jesus’s name as well. Sorta like Jesus Christ, Christ is the last name of Jesus. So the Holy Spirit is Christ in us.
1.God the Father is spirit Invisable
2.God the Son is the soul man God
3.God the Holy Spirit is a seperate spirit sent down from heaven to abide in the believer in the name of Jesus the Christ in us.
RJ
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SpiritLedEd
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RJ's question is a valid "yes" or "no" question and I challenge you to answer it as either "yes" or "no".Also, per forum rules, provide Scripture citations - book, chapter, and verse - to support your beliefs.
Spirit Led Ed (SLE)
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From now on Eccl12v13 back up every post you make with Scripture quotes. Be careful not to manipulate scripture based on your own understanding.
The trinity is real. Its all over Scripture, OT and NT. Plenty of verses explaining that which have numerously been quoted in this thread alone.
http://www.talkjesus.com/bible-study-hall/8438-who-holy-spirit.html
The trinity is real. Its all over Scripture, OT and NT. Plenty of verses explaining that which have numerously been quoted in this thread alone.
http://www.talkjesus.com/bible-study-hall/8438-who-holy-spirit.html
There are many scriptures that say the Son, the Father and the Holy Spirit are one. But not one of those scriptures explains HOW it is they are one.
There is ONLY one place in ALL of the bible that tells us HOW they are one. This explanation can be found spoken by Jesus Christ Himself in the 17th chapter of the book of John.
Not only does Jesus tells us HOW He and the Father are one, but He also explains HOW ALL that bring the same message are one!
Can anyone direct me to another part of the bible that explains HOW they are ONE, and not THAT they are one?
Again.....we know THAT they are one....but HOW?
If there is another scripture that explains HOW they are one, and not THAT they are one, I will gladly retract ALL that I have said and posted!
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Thiscrosshurts
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I am curious why you would retract your posts if there was another scripture that explains HOW they are one.Your position seems accurate to me so wouldn't you want another scripture to back up that position?
As for the seeing and hearing the Father
Oh,this is getting good.
