Does God cause sickness as a test?

[Quenton]

Does God cause sickness as a test? what do you think?

 

[David777]

Hello Quenton.

A test of what?

 

[Brother Mike]

God cause sickness........

No scripture that would indicate God would do that, or send the devil to do that.....

Jesus went about healing all that were sick and oppressed of the devil... and Jesus told us very clear.... Satan is not going around healing anyone, and the kingdoms are not divided....

God chastises who he loves.. that would be the Greek for instruction and not sickness... look it up...and compare other scriptures...

All scripture is for reprove and doctrine... Not sickness.
He gave Apostles, prophets, Pastor's, teachers and evangelist for the perfecting of the saints... Not sickness..

Sickness was a punishment for sin.. Deut 28...... and it was "Until thou be destroyed." Not to teach you anything..

Paul turned someone over to the devil.. Not to teach them anything... but for the destruction of the flesh....

Some think Paul was sick... read it again... it was a messenger of Satan.... that stopped him from exalting the Word of God, and no God is not going to show you things and knock you in the head for it..

and if you think God was tempted by the devil to get Job to try him and see where his heart was..... you have a whole bunch of scriptures that contradict that, and need to compare and read it all again.... but just don't stay in Job.... It was Job's fault...

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

BrotherMike I just HAD to let you know that I got your back 100% on this.I would like take the Job thing.

Satan claimed that God had a hedge of protection around Job that he(Satan) could not penetrate.

Job 1:10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
Job 1:11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face
Job 1:12 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.

Many interpret this verse thinking God allowed Satan to attack Job but that's not the case.God said that all Job had was already in Satan's power.God did not put forth his hand as Satan asked.The meeting ends and Jobs problems begin.

I believe the answer lies in verse 1:5
When a period of feasting had run its course, Job would send and have them purified. Early in the morning he would sacrifice a burnt offering for each of them, thinking, "Perhaps my children have sinned and cursed God in their hearts." This was Job's regular custom.

Job's fear that his hedge may have unknowingly been compromised was a lack of faith that caused fear.That fear turned into a regular custom and Job was relying on works without faith.That may seem like a tiny hole and maybe that's why it wasn't obvious to Satan.But it was a flaw nonetheless.

 

[Brother Mike]

Wow!!!

Thiscrosshurts:

God bless you brother!!!

Job's fear that his hedge may have unknowingly been compromised was a lack of faith that caused fear.That fear turned into a regular custom and Job was relying on works without faith.That may seem like a tiny hole and maybe that's why it wasn't obvious to Satan.But it was a flaw nonetheless.

God had to have revealed that to you!!! It took God 6 months to get it across to me..

Jas 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

Temptedeirazō

Strongs:
to test (objectively), that is, endeavor, scrutinize, entice, discipline: - assay, examine, go about, prove, tempt

Thayer:
to try, make trial of, test: for the purpose of ascertaining his quantity, or what he thinks, or how he will behave himself


God would never test, try, or tempt Job.. God would not have a Murderer Kill Job's Children.... Not my God anyway.....

However.. God did set forth Spiritual Law..... and warned...

58 times to fear not..
48 times to be not afraid..

What did Job say......

Job 3:25 For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me, and that which I was afraid of is come unto me.

God never made a deal with the devil.. God said it was without cause... Job 2:3

and the Word.. Behold he is in your power... means look dummy, the hedge is already down....
Behold is not a permissive statement in Hebrew... just means look...

That blessed me Brother!!!

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

Job 3:25 For the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me, and that which I was afraid of is come unto me.

Thanks for pointing that out.Great fear is obviously not from the love of God that comes through faith.
With two or three witnesses let everything be established and I'm sure there is more that I have overlooked.It took me 5 years to see that
I wonder how long it took Satan to figure it out

only upon himself put not forth thine hand

this shows God actually limiting Satan as further proof that God had nothing to do with Satan's plan as God knew the revelation of the nature of the flaw would eventually lead to the hedge around Job himself.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

However.. God did set forth Spiritual Law..... and warned...

58 times to fear not..
48 times to be not afraid..

Now them are some sweet stats right there.It gives me peace just looking at them.
That is righteous data mining.

I get the impression you have had to answer lots of the "did God kill my Loved one?"or "did God make me sick to test me" type questions I hear all too much.You have developed a good arsenal which I fully intend to plagiarize for kingdom use.

I only believe because I see,blessed is he who does not see and yet believes.God had to chase me down and beat me over the head with his goodness to lead me to repentance.I had to be shown proof and an abundance of miracles and I still rebelled until I came to the end of myself.Remembering that helps keep me from Judging others(I speak that in faith so forgive if I slip)

 

[Brother Mike]

God cause sickness...

I get the impression you have had to answer lots of the "did God kill my Loved one?"or "did God make me sick to test me" type questions I hear all too much.

yes, more than once..... People get bitter at God because they are told God took their loved one.. or God saw evil down the road and took them... (Misquote from Isa)

One Pastor told us about a family that died in a crash. They attended our Church and the news was sad.. He finished it up with..

"God causes it to rain on the Just and unjust."

Translated:

God indiscriminately Murders bad and good people when he feels like it....

At the end of the service trying to get people pumped up so to speak before they leave he said... "We serve a good, good God."...

The Lord Spoke to me when he said that.... the Lord said.. "He does not even believe I am good, and many of my people think I am behind the cause of their troubles."


Jesus said... It's God that helps the devil Kill, steal and destroy, and I go around patching it up the best I can... John 10:10

Well, some think Jesus should have said that..

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[AudreyNicole]

Does God cause sickness as a test? what do you think?

I don't think God causes sickness.... He allows it... and yes, any and all afflictions and trials are for the strengthening of our faith, every single last one. Every single one!

God allows "bad things" to happen because they strengthen our faith.

 

[Quenton]

I don't think God causes sickness.... He allows it... and yes, any and all afflictions and trials are for the strengthening of our faith, every single last one. Every single one!

God allows "bad things" to happen because they strengthen our faith.

did Jesus teach this?

 

[AudreyNicole]

did Jesus teach this?

Jesus specifically didn't teach it, but James, His apostle, did.

James 1:2-3 – Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials


James challenges us to look at the hardships of life in a different light. Notice that trials are not a sign of God’s displeasure, but rather an instrument of God that brings perseverance into our lives. If we feel that we have not done well in trials, James challenges us to get our heads above the waters of despair. Even if we don’t see the purpose of the trial, God will use that trial to build into us what we need for life. This is a promise of Scripture that goes beyond what we currently see.
Dave Whitehead, Senior Pastor, GraceNYC.org


Also, Romans 8:28 says that "all things work together for the good of those who love God". This is just another promise that every single thing that happens to a person, good or bad, works for his or her good.

 

[Quenton]

Jesus specifically didn't teach it, but James, His apostle, did.

James 1:2-3 – Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials


James challenges us to look at the hardships of life in a different light. Notice that trials are not a sign of God’s displeasure, but rather an instrument of God that brings perseverance into our lives. If we feel that we have not done well in trials, James challenges us to get our heads above the waters of despair. Even if we don’t see the purpose of the trial, God will use that trial to build into us what we need for life. This is a promise of Scripture that goes beyond what we currently see.
Dave Whitehead, Senior Pastor, GraceNYC.org


Also, Romans 8:28 says that "all things work together for the good of those who love God". This is just another promise that every single thing that happens to a person, good or bad, works for his or her good.

once again did God the healer teach it? ...and no that isn't what james said at all no mention of sickness

 

[dannibear]

I found this while researching your question. hadirfuss posted it back in 2006. Instead of bringing back the old topic I will quote what she posted.

The issue of sickness is always a difficult one to deal with. I think the key is remembering that God's ways are higher than our ways (Isaiah 55:9). When we are suffering with a sickness, disease, or injury, we usually focus solely on our own suffering. In the midst of a trial of sickness, it is very difficult to focus on what good God might bring about as a result. Romans 8:28 reminds us that God can bring about good from any situation. Many people look back on times of sickness as times when they grew closer to God, learned to trust Him more, and/or learned how to truly value life. That was most certainly the case in my own life. This is the perspective God has because He is sovereign and knows the end result.

This does not mean sickness is always from God or that God always inflicts us with sickness to teach us a spiritual lesson. In a world tainted by sin, sicknesses, diseases, and death will always be with us. We are fallen beings, with physical bodies prone to disease and illness. Some sickness is simply a result of the natural course of things in this world. Sickness can also be the result of a demonic attack. The Bible describes several instances when physical suffering was caused by Satan and his demons (Matthew 17:14-18; Luke 13:10-16). So, some sickness is not from God, but from Satan. Even in these instances, God is still in control. God sometimes allows sin and/or Satan to cause physical suffering. Even when sickness is not directly from God, He will still use it according to His perfect will.

It is undeniable, though, that God sometimes intentionally allows, or even causes sickness to accomplish His sovereign purposes. While sickness is not directly addressed in the passage, Hebrews 12:5-11 describes God disciplining us to "produce a harvest of righteousness" (verse 11). Sickness can be a means of God's loving discipline. It is difficult for us to comprehend why God would work in this manner. But, believing in the sovereignty of God, there is no other option than suffering being something God allows and/or causes.

The clearest example of this in Scripture is found is Psalm 119. Notice the progression through verses 67, 71, and 75 - "Before I was afflicted I went astray, but now I obey your word...It was good for me to be afflicted so that I might learn your decrees...I know, O LORD, that your laws are righteous, and in faithfulness you have afflicted me." The author of Psalm 119 was looking at suffering from God's perspective. It was good for him to be afflicted. It was faithfulness that caused God to afflict him. The result of the affliction was so that he could learn God's decrees and obey His Word.

Again, sickness and suffering is never an easy thing to deal with. One thing is for sure, sickness should not cause us to lose faith in God. God is good, even when we are suffering. Even the ultimate of suffering--death--is an act of God's goodness. Do you think anyone who is in Heaven as a result of death / suffering regrets what they went through in this life? I think not.

One final note...when people are suffering, it is our responsibility to minister to them, care for them, pray for them, and comfort them. When a person is suffering, it is not always appropriate to emphasize that God will bring good out of the suffering. Yes, that is the truth. However, in the midst of suffering, it is not always the best time to share that truth. Suffering people need our love and encouragement, not necessarily a reminder of sound Biblical theology.

 

[AudreyNicole]

once again did God the healer teach it? ...and no that isn't what james said at all no mention of sickness

Well, since the Bible is the written word of God, yes those words are from His very mouth. He said them, He taught them, and He wrote them in His book. God the healer said them, Jesus His son taught it, and His disciples and apostles wrote it.

Here's what James wrote from God's mouth:
<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-30269">2</sup> Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials (i.e. sickness) of many kinds, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-30270">3</sup> because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-30271">4</sup> Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything.

The word trial means any type of affliction... so physical affliction (sickness), mental affliction, emotional affliction, spiritual affliction, etc. He used one word that hit them all because God uses them all to help us.

So yes, God has said that He allows sickness to come upon us that He may strengthen us.

 

[Brother Mike]

Not that I really wanted to get involved but...

AudreyNicole:

He used one word that hit them all because God uses them all to help us.

So yes, God has said that He allows sickness to come upon us that He may strengthen us.

There is no place anywhere in James that states God uses, or allows these things... Why you would make that up, only you would know.

The Word does state that God uses his Word to correct us... not sickness. No scripture states He uses sickness...

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Chris

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Jas 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

Sickness was never designed to teach anyone anything.......It is evil, it weakens family's, it hurts........... Why you think it would be a good thing really concerns me...

Sickness came from the curse of the law, or the law of sin and death. It has one purpose.. that is to kill you, and take the quality of life away from you.... It's purpose was to Kill you if it can.

Deu 28:22 The LORD shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish.

Deu 28:61 Also every sickness, and every plague, which is not written in the book of this law, them will the LORD bring upon thee, until thou be destroyed.


When Paul turned over that immoral man to Satan... It was for one purpose.....and it was not to strengthen him..

1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.


It was Satan that came to kill us, to steal from us, and to destroy us... It was not God...

When going through something we are to put on the armor of God and stand.... we are to take the our sword (Word of God) and shield......

1Pe 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
1Pe 5:9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions (something undergone, that is, hardship or pain; subjectively an emotion or influence: - affection, affliction, motion, suffering.)
are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.
1Pe 5:10 But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you.

Now if God is the one using the sickness or affliction to better us....then God wasted his time telling us to stand against the Devil... Jesus lied about it being the enemy coming to kill, steal and destroy, God lied when He said sickness was designed to kill us...

And we would be just stupid trying to go to the doctor and fight God trying to get well so we can take care of our family's...

Just take the time to think about this... I have no idea who would teach what your trying to tell us here... It don't even make sense.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[smitty]

deut28:59-61 then the Lord will bring upon you and your decendents extraordinary plagues -great and prolonged plagues- and serious and prolonged sickness. moreover He will bring back on you all the diseases of Egypt, of which you arte afraid and they shall cling to you. also every sickness and every plague , which is not written in this book of law will the Lord bring upon you until you are destroyed.
Deut 32:39 now see that I , even I am He . aand there is no God besides Me, I kill and I make alive, I wound and I heal, nor is there anyone who can deliver from my hand.
2 sam 12:15 then nathan departed to his house. and the Lord struck the child that uriah's wife bore to david, and it became ill
acts 12:23 then immediately an angel of the Lord struck him, because he did not give glory to God, and he was eatn by worms and died.
i am not sure that God brings sickness to test us, but to say that all sickness is from satan may not be right either. i personally believe that God can and does use any method that He needs to use in our life to draw us closer to Him. i also believe that whatever plan God uses is the best way to reach us, no matter where we are in our life and relationship with Him.
now as far as Job, i think satan was allowed to attack him, God allowed it, i do not believe that job was ever under control by satan, based on 2 things, that he was one of the most blessed people at the time and what God said about him, Job 1:8, and job 2:3 if he was under the control of satan why would Job shun evil, would not he be a partaker of it, and not walk in his integrity.
i guess my point is this, God can allow sickness in our life, and sometimes i could be a side effect of sin in our life, and sometimes in a fallen imperfect world we get sick and die, and which i thinkl is just a part of living n this planet. 1 other point about Job, 1"22, he never blamed God, which to me says volumes about his charater, most people blameGod for everything bad in their life.

 

[Quenton]

deut28:59-61 then the Lord will bring upon you and your decendents extraordinary plagues -great and prolonged plagues- and serious and prolonged sickness. moreover He will bring back on you all the diseases of Egypt, of which you arte afraid and they shall cling to you. also every sickness and every plague , which is not written in this book of law will the Lord bring upon you until you are destroyed.
Deut 32:39 now see that I , even I am He . aand there is no God besides Me, I kill and I make alive, I wound and I heal, nor is there anyone who can deliver from my hand.
2 sam 12:15 then nathan departed to his house. and the Lord struck the child that uriah's wife bore to david, and it became ill
acts 12:23 then immediately an angel of the Lord struck him, because he did not give glory to God, and he was eatn by worms and died.
i am not sure that God brings sickness to test us, but to say that all sickness is from satan may not be right either. i personally believe that God can and does use any method that He needs to use in our life to draw us closer to Him. i also believe that whatever plan God uses is the best way to reach us, no matter where we are in our life and relationship with Him.
now as far as Job, i think satan was allowed to attack him, God allowed it, i do not believe that job was ever under control by satan, based on 2 things, that he was one of the most blessed people at the time and what God said about him, Job 1:8, and job 2:3 if he was under the control of satan why would Job shun evil, would not he be a partaker of it, and not walk in his integrity.
i guess my point is this, God can allow sickness in our life, and sometimes i could be a side effect of sin in our life, and sometimes in a fallen imperfect world we get sick and die, and which i thinkl is just a part of living n this planet. 1 other point about Job, 1"22, he never blamed God, which to me says volumes about his charater, most people blameGod for everything bad in their life.

try the hebrew...

and Job hasn't nothing to do with this

 

[Quenton]

Well, since the Bible is the written word of God, yes those words are from His very mouth. He said them, He taught them, and He wrote them in His book. God the healer said them, Jesus His son taught it, and His disciples and apostles wrote it.

Here's what James wrote from God's mouth:
<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-30269">2</sup> Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials (i.e. sickness) of many kinds, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-30270">3</sup> because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-30271">4</sup> Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything.

The word trial means any type of affliction... so physical affliction (sickness), mental affliction, emotional affliction, spiritual affliction, etc. He used one word that hit them all because God uses them all to help us.

So yes, God has said that He allows sickness to come upon us that He may strengthen us.

give me one example of Jesus not healing someone because he wanted them to learn from their sickness?

 

[smitty]

quenton, try the hebrew for what, and the the point of job was in reference to other post. and to the point does God cause sickness to test us? i not sure if God allows or causes sickness to test us, but in John 9:1-7 the man was blind from birth that the works of God should be revealed in him. now weather he was blind to teach him anything i do not know, but did not God allow this man to be blind from birth. was it not God"s plan for him tom be blind. if so did God cause or allow it

 

[Quenton]

quenton, try the hebrew for what, and the the point of job was in reference to other post. and to the point does God cause sickness to test us? i not sure if God allows or causes sickness to test us, but in John 9:1-7 the man was blind from birth that the works of God should be revealed in him. now weather he was blind to teach him anything i do not know, but did not God allow this man to be blind from birth. was it not God"s plan for him tom be blind. if so did God cause or allow it

for samuel etc.

did God heal him?