I agree, God elects people to be saved based on His will alone. But, people who don't examine Scripture carefully might conclude that God's choice of people was arbitrary and capricious; as if He made His choices by throwing darts at a huge wall that had the names of all people written on it. The names the darts stuck into, those people were saved. All the others, tough break. That is not the way it was.

Because of His omniscience, God knew in advance who would seek relationship with Him through Jesus and those folks are the ones elected to be saved. "Whoever would find God must first believe that He exists and that He rewards those who seek Him diligently." (Hebrews 11:6)


SLE

Amen to that brother. This is very important to keep in mind. ANYONE who chooses Jesus Christ as Savior, GOD will receive salvation through Him as promised by Him.

There are a few books out critiquing all the five points of calvinism as defined by calvinists. The highest profile one being Dave Hunt's "What Love is This: Calvinisms Missrepresentation of God". I think it is a very good book. It basically rejects Calvinism and Arminyism, while acknowledging that there are elements of truth in both systems; but neither of them are completely biblical.

If Calvinism were true and salvation was purely a matter of God's "sovereign" election then a truely good God would save everyone as many verses teach: "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."
The fact that calvinists have to ignore or give a special "initiated" interpretation to such verses proves that it is not an entirely biblical theology.

If you take the issue of sovreignty to it's logical conclusion, as only a few calvinists have been honest enough to do, by making this the number one, primary, controlling attribute of God: you end up with a world where every possible thought, word and deed and contingcy happens because of the predestination of God. This is what Luther believed in The Bondage of the Will. Even the fall and sin were predestined by God, so he could **** the majority, showing his justice and save the elect, showing his mercy.

God has chosen to save all those who by the enabling and enlightening of the Holy Spirit put their faith in Christ.

I believe there is a scriptural middle ground between calvinism and arminyism. There is a true open door to salvation and whosoever will really may be saved; as God calls all men through Christ. The elect are the whosoever wills and the non-elect are the whosoever won'ts.
Election and Predestination have not to do with God's choice of individuals to salvation but of the Church to Sonship and eternal glory, as a close reading of the texts dealing with these matters will, I believe, bear out.

For example Ephesians 1: 4 does not mention a choice of an individual to salvation but the choice of God of the Ephesions and the faithful in Christ Jesus to holiness and blamelessness and then in verse 5 to sonship. Only by taking the words "chosen us in him before the foundation of the world" out of context a long with many other texts used as pretexts can the Calvinistic line be maintained. The before the foundation of the world has to do with God's infinite foreknowledge which is one of his many balanced attributes and is not synonoumous with election.

Well what if we thought of it this way.
We must all agree that salvation is limited, right? That not everyone goes to heaven, correct?

So, if that is true, then who limits it? God or Man?

Why in the world must we agree with that "fact" that salvation is limited? Only 5 point Calvinists think that, and at least 90 percent of the Christians in the world are not 5 point Calvinists. (10% are Arminians, and 80% are neither Calvinist nor Arminian.) I managed to get through 30 years as a missionary without hearing of either gentleman or their theologies. I only ran across them since I retired.
Since you obviously are on the internet, try reading a few sites on the subject. I realy recommend biblehelp.org's site on Selective Salvation, and Calvary Chapel's site on Calvinism versus Arminianism. Both are very balanced well written sites, and both avoid name calling and hair splitting that ignores context and other rules of Biblical interpretation.
Your Ever Well Wisher,
Michael A. Johnson

30 years as a missionary.....tremendous. Absolutely wonderful, I salute you........in Jesus.

There is no necessity for anyone to agree with Calvin. Calvin was a scholar, many may subscribe to his beliefs because of that. He did open up the foreknowledge of God.

Salvation, eternal life, an unlimited future, in a New Heaven and a New Earth wherein dwelleth righteousness, is all about Jesus.

"He that hath the Son hath life.............he that hath not the Son of God, hath not life"

The message today is "Do you want to know Jesus?" New life, deliverance from all bandage is found in Jesus.

My prayer is that all who moderate, oversee, visit this "talkjesus' web-site will become aware of His Power..

In Jesus Name........only you can help us.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

1Timothy 2:1-4
1*I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; 2*for kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. 3*For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; 4 who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1John 4:7&8
7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

1Corinthians 13:4-7
4 Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud 5 or rude. Love does not demand its own way. Love is not irritable, and it keeps no record of when it has been wronged. 6 It is never glad about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out. 7 Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance.

There is a very distinguishing difference between all knowing and controlling. Yes God knows who will repent but He does not manipulate them to repentance. Everyone has a free choice and opertunity. God knows the heart.

Kinda funny how no one really answered my question.

Its not funny and the question was answered to you 3 times. Read carefully. Read the Scripture jiggyfly quoted as well carefully.

You believe and go to Heaven or you do not. John 3:16 makes that simply clear.