Originally Posted by peeps

We pray that this teaching will encourage many women, who might otherwise relegate themselves to the "back burner" to instead step forward into the full calling of God upon their lives. Likewise, we pray that men who have been taught against letting women minister will see the truth of the fullness of God's plan. No matter who we are in the Lord, we will be held responsible for how we treated others and how we either hindered or helped the cause of Christ on Earth. Those in leadership especially need to heed this warning with reverent fear. Just because we have believed something our whole life, or because our denomination or culture teaches us so, doesn't mean it is correct. If you have a problem with seeing women in the pulpit, or in any position of leadership, we pray that you will prayerfully seek the Lord with an open heart on this issue.

I like this one. . .thanks for posting this interesting thread all in all, Chad
May God continue to bless you and keep you safe and well fed in His Holy Spirit

This is a tipical case where some read ONLY what they believe instead of believing what they read. Please do not avoid or ignore God's instruction in 1Timothy 3.
1Timothy 3:1-12
Leaders in the Church
1*It is a true saying that if someone wants to be an elder,* he desires an honorable responsibility. 2*For an elder must be a man whose life cannot be spoken against. He must be faithful to his wife.* He must exhibit self-control, live wisely, and have a good reputation. He must enjoy having guests in his home and must be able to teach. 3*He must not be a heavy drinker or be violent. He must be gentle, peace loving, and not one who loves money. 4*He must manage his own family well, with children who respect and obey him. 5*For if a man cannot manage his own household, how can he take care of God’s church?
6*An elder must not be a new Christian, because he might be proud of being chosen so soon, and the Devil will use that pride to make him fall.* 7 Also, people outside the church must speak well of him so that he will not fall into the Devil’s trap and be disgraced.
8*In the same way, deacons must be people who are respected and have integrity. They must not be heavy drinkers and must not be greedy for money. 9*They must be committed to the revealed truths of the Christian faith and must live with a clear conscience. 10*Before they are appointed as deacons, they should be given other responsibilities in the church as a test of their character and ability. If they do well, then they may serve as deacons.
11*In the same way, their wives* must be respected and must not speak evil of others. They must exercise self-control and be faithful in everything they do.
12*A deacon must be faithful to his wife, and he must manage his children and household well. 13*Those who do well as deacons will be rewarded with respect from others and will have increased confidence in their faith in Christ Jesus.

Originally Posted by peeps

We pray that this teaching will encourage many women, who might otherwise relegate themselves to the "back burner" to instead step forward into the full calling of God upon their lives. Likewise, we pray that men who have been taught against letting women minister will see the truth of the fullness of God's plan. No matter who we are in the Lord, we will be held responsible for how we treated others and how we either hindered or helped the cause of Christ on Earth. Those in leadership especially need to heed this warning with reverent fear. Just because we have believed something our whole life, or because our denomination or culture teaches us so, doesn't mean it is correct. If you have a problem with seeing women in the pulpit, or in any position of leadership, we pray that you will prayerfully seek the Lord with an open heart on this issue.

I like this one. . .thanks for posting this interesting thread all in all, Chad
May God continue to bless you and keep you safe and well fed in His Holy Spirit

I would also like to add, that being called of God does not make you a leader in the Body of Christ, we are all called. Character and spiritual maturity are important also to becoming a leader in the Body.

er...im not sure where i stand on this,you all make good points.I cant seem to recall a woman giving a sermon in the bible with a christian male present?If i am wrong on this i will happily stand corrected.

Originally Posted by sparky

er...im not sure where i stand on this,you all make good points.I cant seem to recall a woman giving a sermon in the bible with a christian male present?If i am wrong on this i will happily stand corrected.

Sparky, I'm not sure either. I think you are wise to admit it. I think it is unwise to make a call without refering to all the truth concerning anything. That is why we need to be led by the Spirit of Truth.

Originally Posted by Soldier of God

We can read scripture all day and each get something different and never agree. This is clear as water immediatly. I have read scripture and read these exchanges, one thing and one thing only stands out to me. If Jesus was ministered to by women, what kind of man can I be in Him, if a woman isnt worthy to minister His Gospel to me. Is my learning through in this life? Can my learning only come from a man? A woman led me to the Lord directly guided by the Lords hand. God bless all


Luke 8:1-3, "And it came to pass afterward, that he went throughout every city and village, preaching and showing the glad tidings of the kingdom of God: and the twelve were with him And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils, And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance."

1 timothy chapter 3

I will not in any way make my sisters feel bound up in our Lord Jesus Christ . The only reference to the scripture I will make is that when Jesus rose from the dead , the first messenger he chose was Mary ! Now , I love all my brothers and sisters in the Lord here and have sat at the feet of many women , and learned great truths about the Lord ! Now the facts about todays church . If it were not for women , the echo inside the sanctuary would sound like yelling over the gran canyon ! Brothers In Arms Ministries , is about men stepping up , and into the order God called them to ! Kathryn Kullman [ a great woman of God ] always said that the only reason she accepted the leadership role she had in ministry , is because the Lord showed her that the man that was called first would not do it ! The same thing for today . I will not go against the scripture on this matter . But I will say that until the men arise from their slumber , then God will use women to take their place ! God used a donkey to speak his wishes , and the man listened to that donkey ! So in a very hard reality way , I want to respond to this . Men - either stand up - or shut up ! And please do not respond to the remark about Kathryn Kullman . That is just my opinion of her as a minister of God . If God used a donkey who has no standing in the church , Then I know he will use his beautiful daughters for his work . For they a much more valuable to him then any rebellious man ! Brother Mike

Men - either stand up - or shut up !

A lot of controversy could be avoided if more people
understood God`s intended definition of the 'ministry'
A womans place is not in a position of leadership.
A mans is`nt either if he does`nt know what it means
to minister to the people of God.

Originally Posted by Soldier of God

You are hungry jiggyfly so I bring you bread. This view may be clear to you. Do you believe scripture, or the scripture you choose?


Old Testament history includes accounts of strong female leadership. Miriam was a prophet, one of the triumvirate of leaders God sent to Israel during the Exodus period (Exodus 15:20). Deborah, as prophet and judge, led the army of the Lord into successful combat (Judges 4 to 5). Huldah, also a prophet, authenticated the scroll of the Law found in the temple and helped spark the great religious reform in the days of Josiah (2 Kings 22; 2 Chronicles 34).

The New Testament also records ministering women in the Church Age. Tabitha (Dorcas) is called a disciple and had a ministry of helps (Acts 9:36). Philip had four virgin daughters who prophesied (Act s 21:8,9). Euodia and Syntyche were Paul's coworkers who shared in his struggle to spread the gospel (Philippians 4:2,3). Priscilla was another of Paul's exemplary "fellow workers in Christ Jesus" (Romans 16:3,4, NIV). In Romans 16, Paul greets a multitude of ministering persons, a large number of them women.

This entire passage has been held by some to confirm that all leaders and authorities in the Early Church were intended to be, and indeed were, males. It is true that the passage deals primarily with male leadership, most likely because of majority practice and expectations. When there were women leaders, like Phoebe, they would be expected to meet the same standards of character and behavior.

Translations of verse 11 present evidence of the translator's choice based on personal expectations. The word gunaikas can be translated as either "wives" or "women", depending on the translator's assumptions concerning the context. One rendering leaves the impression that these are qualifications for deacons' wives; the other suggests this exhortation is addressed to female spiritual leaders.

Although the first-century cultural milieu produced a primarily male church leadership, this passage along with other biblical evidence of female spiritual leadership (e.g., Acts 21:9; Romans 16:1-15 ; Philippians 4:2,3) demonstrates that female leadership was not prohibited, either for Paul's day or for today. Passages which imply that most leaders were male should not be made to say that women cannot be leaders.

Galatians 3:28

Those who oppose allowing women to hold positions of spiritual leadership must place contextual limitations on Galatians 3:28. "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

You have taken Galations 3:28 out of context , I suggest you read the whole book or at least the chapter. Paul is referring to Salvation and that the Gospel does not discriminate. You are misusing this verseand the way you are using it validates same sex marriages for believers.
Not one of those scriptures that you listed indicates that any of them were ELDERS, and as far as picking and choosing scripture well why hasnt anyone who supports women leadership in the body of CHRIST addressed
1TIMOTHY CHAPTER 3 ? I have listed time and again on the threads to do with this subject and no one has even attempted to explain, including yourself. are you avoiding it. I love truth, but I don't like leaven in it! There is a big difference between old testiment Jewish government and new testiment Body of Christ. If you want to follow the shaddow of Christ thats up to you, but I choose to Follow Christ himself.
Colossians 2:16-19
16*So don’t let anyone condemn you for what you eat or drink, or for not celebrating certain holy days or new-moon ceremonies or Sabbaths. 17*For these rules were only shadows of the real thing, Christ himself. 18*Don’t let anyone condemn you by insisting on self-denial. And don’t let anyone say you must worship angels, even though they say they have had visions about this. These people claim to be so humble, but their sinful minds have made them proud. 19*But they are not connected to Christ, the head of the body.
Now if you will read this and 1timothy 3 and you still want to discuss this then discuss it with the Lord, because I don't think you can recieve anything from me .

Originally Posted by Coconut

Men - either stand up - or shut up !

A lot of controversy could be avoided if more people
understood God`s intended definition of the 'ministry'
A womans place is not in a position of leadership.
A mans is`nt either if he does`nt know what it means
to minister to the people of God.

Thank you Coconut. lol

Soldier, you named several old and new testament women serving God in different roles, but you didn`t name one appointed by God to a role of leadership.

I am editing this to define what I meant by "leadership", that being
"any capacity which puts women in authority over men", and to clarify I was not intending to question a woman serving in the many areas in which God chooses to use them, supported by the history of the ages.

I have`nt studied this subject in depth many of you may have, but
what does this scripture mean? Not trying to take it out of context, but is it only talking about her place in prayer?
1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman [is] the man; and the head of Christ [is] God.

Going back to the OT, and the vision of Isaiah where God speaks of "taking away" His blessing we read:
Isa 3:12 [As for] my people, children [are] their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause [thee] to err, and destroy the way of thy paths.

I don`t see a passage anywhere indicates that any women were appointed to be leaders of men, as defined. If there is please show me.