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Ask yourself How do you get 3 Days and 3 Nights from "Good Friday" to Sunday? Also Eggs and bunnies?

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R. Roger Harris,
re: "It should not be a surprise to us that a different culture used a different method of counting days. As soon as we adopt this method of counting, all the supposed biblical problems with counting the days disappear."

Do you have any examples which show that a daytime or a night time was counted as a daytime or a night time when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred?
 
Active
Maybe this will help.

The Catholic designation of "Good Friday" was in error, but couldn't be challenged once decreed. It has caused much unnecessary debate through the centuries.

First, remember every day began at sunset, and lasted till the next sunset. Daylight was divided into 12 equal hours, and the 12 night hours called "watch hours".

The once a year Nisan 14 Passover and the weekly Saturday sabbath were back to back the week Jesus was crucified. Both were holy days, one a High Day.

The chief priests and scribes met to plan Jesus' death, but decided not to do that on a sabbath for fear of the people. A great crowd was assembling for the feast. His death had to come before sunset Thursday.

The Passover lambs were to be killed the evening before Passover, roasted and eaten Friday morning.

Those and other clues put the arrest, trial, scourging and crucifixion before any sabbath. Also, the crucified had to die and be removed by sunset before the holy day, so as not to defile the day.

That puts Jesus crucified at about noon (as we call it) Thursday (as we call it by Roman naming), and giving up the Ghost at our 3PM. Sundown as about 6PM, when Friday began.

Now, you might need to chart it on paper.

"Day of Preparation" was Thursday between 3PM and sunset. Jesus is the Lamb of God sacrificed, but first prepared by the woman with the alabaster box of ointment.
Jesus was dead by sunset Thursday, put in the tomb. I'm not dealing here with those hours (6th to 9th) when darkness came prematurely, the earthquake, the temple veil rent, which I will briefly say I believe was when Jesus took the sins of the world upon Himself. When that was fully applied Jesus finally cried out.

Sunset Thursday ushered in Friday, the Holy Day.
Sunset Friday ushered in the weekly sabbath Saturday.
Sunset Saturday ushered in the first day of the week Sunday.
Jesus' empty tomb was found before sunrise Sunday, well past the previous sabbath on Saturday.
The women encountered Jesus at sunrise Sunday when it was legal for them to be there, in the light.

There we have 3 days and 3 nights. All synoptic gospels concur.
 
Member
Jesus died when He was of 33 years at 3pm on Friday and resurrected at 12am Sunday morning. He was in the grave for 33 hours.
 
Member
The_Leap_Of_Faith,

re: "Jesus died when He was of 33 years at 3pm on Friday and resurrected at 12am Sunday morning. He was in the grave for 33 hours."

How do you account for the lack of a 3rd night?
 
Member
Maybe this will help.

The Catholic designation of "Good Friday" was in error, but couldn't be challenged once decreed. It has caused much unnecessary debate through the centuries.

First, remember every day began at sunset, and lasted till the next sunset. Daylight was divided into 12 equal hours, and the 12 night hours called "watch hours".

The once a year Nisan 14 Passover and the weekly Saturday sabbath were back to back the week Jesus was crucified. Both were holy days, one a High Day.

The chief priests and scribes met to plan Jesus' death, but decided not to do that on a sabbath for fear of the people. A great crowd was assembling for the feast. His death had to come before sunset Thursday.

The Passover lambs were to be killed the evening before Passover, roasted and eaten Friday morning.

Those and other clues put the arrest, trial, scourging and crucifixion before any sabbath. Also, the crucified had to die and be removed by sunset before the holy day, so as not to defile the day.

That puts Jesus crucified at about noon (as we call it) Thursday (as we call it by Roman naming), and giving up the Ghost at our 3PM. Sundown as about 6PM, when Friday began.

Now, you might need to chart it on paper.

"Day of Preparation" was Thursday between 3PM and sunset. Jesus is the Lamb of God sacrificed, but first prepared by the woman with the alabaster box of ointment.
Jesus was dead by sunset Thursday, put in the tomb. I'm not dealing here with those hours (6th to 9th) when darkness came prematurely, the earthquake, the temple veil rent, which I will briefly say I believe was when Jesus took the sins of the world upon Himself. When that was fully applied Jesus finally cried out.

Sunset Thursday ushered in Friday, the Holy Day.
Sunset Friday ushered in the weekly sabbath Saturday.
Sunset Saturday ushered in the first day of the week Sunday.
Jesus' empty tomb was found before sunrise Sunday, well past the previous sabbath on Saturday.
The women encountered Jesus at sunrise Sunday when it was legal for them to be there, in the light.

There we have 3 days and 3 nights. All synoptic gospels concur.

This does not follow the pattern of the three feast days of the Passover, Feast of unleavened bread, and the Feast of first fruits. These were the type of the death, burial, and resurrection. In order to keep the pattern of the three feast days, Jesus could not have spent three days and three nights in the tomb. Jesus never said he would be in the tomb for three days and three nights. What he said was that he would be "in the heart of the earth" for three days and three nights. We have misinterpreted that to mean in the tomb for three days and three nights but, that is not what he said. This means the phrase implies something else entirely.

Here is what I mean in connection to the three feast days.
Here is how the timeline of these sacrifices typify the death burial and resurrection of Christ.
1. At Passover on Friday the 14th of Abib, the lamb was slain.
2. On the following day, Saturday the15th of Abib, was the first day of unleavened bread, a holy convocation. A day of rest.
3. On the following day, Sunday the 16th of Abib, was the waving of the first-fruits.

Luke's orderly account shows that Jesus ate the Passover at sunset with his disciples and then was crucified the same day. He was then buried on that same day. The next day, the 15th of Abib was the weekly Sabbath. Jesus spent the entire Sabbath day resting in the tomb, then on the very next day, the 16th of Abib, which was Sunday, Jesus rose from the dead. We know this is correct because of how Leviticus and Numbers organized the events of the feasts. Here is a point that many people miss.

In 1 Corinthians 15:20 Paul tells us, “But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.” What is the significance of Jesus being the first-fruits in relation to his resurrection?

Leviticus 23:5-11 says, “In the first month, on the fourteenth day of the month at twilight is the Lord's Passover. Then on the fifteenth day of the same month there is the Feast of Unleavened Bread to the Lord; for seven days you shall eat unleavened bread. On the first day you shall have a holy convocation; you shall not do any laborious work. But for seven days you shall present an offering by fire to the Lord. On the seventh day is a holy convocation; you shall not do any laborious work. Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, ‘Speak to the sons of Israel and say to them, when you enter the land which I am going to give to you and reap its harvest, then you shall bring in the sheaf of the first-fruits of your harvest to the priest. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord for you to be accepted; on the day after the sabbath the priest shall wave it.”

So, on the 14th day of the first month was the Passover. On the 15th was the Sabbath of unleavened bread. On the 16th was the offering of the first- fruits. Jesus followed this exact pattern. He died on the day of Passover. The next day he rested in the tomb on the Sabbath. The next day after the Sabbath was the first day of the week. During the offering of the morning burnt offering sacrifice at sunrise, the priest was waving the first-fruits of the harvest. At that same time, Jesus was rising from the tomb. He is the first-fruits of those who sleep. We know this because Mark 16:2 tells us that when the women came to the tomb after the sun had already risen and Jesus had already risen from the tomb.

The sequence of these feasts proves beyond any doubt that Jesus died on Friday and rose early Sunday morning. The argument that there had to be three literal days and nights (72 hours) in the grave simply cannot fit the prophetic time line of these three feasts. Jesus died on Friday the 14th of Abib around 3pm. He was resting in the grave on the weekly Sabbath, the 15th of Abib. Sometime early on Sunday, the first day of the week, the 16th of Abib, Jesus rose from the tomb. By the Eastern reckoning of time, this can constitute three days but, there is no way it can constitute three nights, I don't care how one may try to manipulate it. So, how then are we to understand the words of Jesus in Matthew 12:40 when he said, “For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”

Mark 8:31 records Jesus statement in this way. “And He began to teach them that the Son of Man must *suffer many things and *be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes, and *be killed, and *after three days rise again”

In Matthew 17:22-23 Jesus gives definition to his use of “in the heart of the earth” in chapter 12, “And while they were gathering together in Galilee, Jesus said to them, 'The Son of Man is going to be delivered into the hands of men, and they will kill Him, and He will be raised on the third day.' And they were deeply grieved.” In the heart of the earth is the same thing as into the hands of men.” From the time Jesus was betrayed to the time he rose from the tomb was literally three days and three nights.

It is as simple as this. Mark shows us that Jesus was buried in the evening just before the Sabbath. He spent the following day which was the Sabbath in the tomb and on the day after the Sabbath which was the first day of the week - Sunday, the women come to anoint the body but he is already gone; And all of this was put forth in the Passover, the feast of unleavened bread, and the feast of first-fruits.
 
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oldhermit,
re: "Luke's orderly account shows that Jesus ate the Passover at sunset with his disciples and then was crucified the same day."

Mark 14:12 - "Now on the first day of Unleavened Bread, when they killed the Passover lamb His disciples said to Him, 'Where do You want us to go and prepare, that you may eat the Passover?'"

So how could the Messiah have eaten the Passover at sunset when all the preparations for it had yet to made?
 
Loyal
I have attended over twenty different churches due to moving around to different states and cities in my life.

I don't think I've ever attended one that believes Jesus was crucified on "good Friday".
 
Member
Perhaps I should have said that differently. The lamb was to be slain at sunset but the eating of the lamb was done throughout the evening until sunrise. Anything left of the animal by morning was to be burned with fire. Sometime between sunset and 10 or 11 in the evening, Jesus ate the Passover with his disciples. We know from Matthew's account that Jesus spent perhaps three hours praying in the garden before he was arrested at around 2:00 in the morning.
 
Member
I have attended over twenty different churches due to moving around to different states and cities in my life.

I don't think I've ever attended one that believes Jesus was crucified on "good Friday".
I really no not have any regard for how the RCC represents the event of the crucifixion. I only care about how the timeline surrounding the events are laid out in scripture. The Friday crucifixion is the only possibility.
 
Loyal
Matt 27:45; Now from the sixth hour darkness fell upon all the land until the ninth hour.
Matt 27:46; About the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, "ELI, ELI, LAMA SABACHTHANI?" that is, "MY GOD, MY GOD, WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN ME?"
Matt 27:47; And some of those who were standing there, when they heard it, began saying, "This man is calling for Elijah."
Matt 27:48; Immediately one of them ran, and taking a sponge, he filled it with sour wine and put it on a reed, and gave Him a drink.
Matt 27:49; But the rest of them said, "Let us see whether Elijah will come to save Him."
Matt 27:50; And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit.

Jesus died close to 3pm. (the ninth hour)
He was put in the tomb in the evening.

Matt 27:57; When it was evening, there came a rich man from Arimathea, named Joseph, who himself had also become a disciple of Jesus.
Matt 27:58; This man went to Pilate and asked for the body of Jesus. Then Pilate ordered it to be given to him.
Matt 27:59; And Joseph took the body and wrapped it in a clean linen cloth,

Jesus rose on the first Day of the week (Sunday) early in the morning. Before dawn.

Matt 28:1; Now after the Sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary came to look at the grave.
Mark 16:2; Very early on the first day of the week, they *came to the tomb when the sun had risen.
Mark 16:9; [Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.
Luke 24:1; But on the first day of the week, at early dawn, they came to the tomb bringing the spices which they had prepared.
John 20:1; Now on the first day of the week Mary Magdalene *came early to the tomb, while it *was still dark, and *saw the stone already taken away from the tomb.

John says it was still dark. Likely before 6am in the morning.

If we work backwards here.... 24 hours sooner would have been 6am Saturday.
48 hours sooner would have been 6am Friday. However Jesus didn't die until the 9th hour 3pm. And wasn't put into the grave until evening. But even if He would have died
in the morning, it still would be less than 48 hours. (two days)

From Friday evening (say 6pm) until Sunday morning (say 6am) is only 36 hours. 3 days would be closer to 72 hours.
 
Member
The three days and three nights in the heart of the earth does not signify the time Jesus spent in the tomb. This is merely how we have interpreted the statement and this interpretation does not fit the timeline provided by scripture. This means the statement means something else. Jesus never said he would be in the tomb for three days and three nights. What he said was that he would be "in the heart of the earth" for three days and three nights. The question he have to ask then is what did Jesus mean by this statement?

Mark 8:31 records Jesus statement in this way. “And He began to teach them that the Son of Man must *suffer many things and *be rejected by the elders and the chief priests and the scribes, and *be killed, and *after three days rise again.”

In Matthew 17:22-23 Jesus gives definition to his use of “in the heart of the earth” in chapter 12, “And while they were gathering together in Galilee, Jesus said to them, 'The Son of Man is going to be delivered into the hands of men, and they will kill Him, and He will be raised on the third day.' And they were deeply grieved.”

"In the heart of the earth" is the same thing as into the hands of men.” From the time Jesus was betrayed to the time he rose from the tomb was literally three days and three nights. This is the timeline scripture reveals. Remember, it does not have to be 72 hours to satisfy the three days and three nights as even a part of a day was reckoned as a day.
 
Member
oldhermit,
re: "In the heart of the earth" is the same thing as “into the hands of men.”

That's a pretty big stretch. What is there in scripture which makes it absolutely necessary to discount the "heart of the earth" as referring to the tomb, or at the earliest to the moment when the Messiah's spirit left His body at the time of His death?
 
Member
oldhermit,
re: "In the heart of the earth" is the same thing as “into the hands of men.”

That's a pretty big stretch. What is there in scripture which makes it absolutely necessary to discount the "heart of the earth" as referring to the tomb, or at the earliest to the moment when the Messiah's spirit left His body at the time of His death?

It is no stretch at all. In both accounts, Jesus is talking about the same thing, In the Greek, there are two words that Jesus could have used to refer to a burial place. There is μνῆμα and τάφος. It is curious that Jesus does not uses either of these two words. If Jesus had meant to imply the grave, then why use such a cryptic tern as γῆς which has a rather broad application and is never used anywhere else in the NT to mean a place of burial (at least not in any example I have ever been able to find.). γῆς generally refers to the ground or soil or the planet itself but is used metaphorically throughout scripture to refer to the world of man. See such passages as Rev 3:10, Acts 1:8, Luke 12:49-53, Matthew 10:34, Luke 18:8, etc.... So, when Jesus says in Matthew 17:22-23 that he would be "delivered into the hands of men, and they will kill Him, and He will be raised on the third day," it seems clear he is establishing the parameters of time. The three days begins with the moment he is delivered into the hands of men, not from the time of his burial. This is precisely what the timeline revealed in the gospels confirm. It is also what the typology of the three feast days declare.
 
Member
Mark shows us that Jesus was buried on the evening just before the Sabbath.

Apparently the writer of Luke didn't know that in Hebrew tradition days are counted from sunset, not sunrise.

Luke 23
52 This man went unto Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus.
53 And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid.
54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath began to dawn (ἐπιφώσκω).
55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.

ἐπιφώσκω: to grow light, to dawn
 
Member
This is precisely what the timeline revealed in the gospels confirm.

According to Luke's account the body was in the tomb for around 24 hours.

Matthew 12
38 Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee.
39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.
42 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

Luke 11
29 And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet.
30 For as Jonas was a sign unto the Ninevites, so shall also the Son of man be to this generation.
31 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with the men of this generation, and condemn them: for she came from the utmost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.
32 The men of Nineve shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

Matthew 16
1 The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven.
2 He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red.
3 And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times?
4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.
 
Member
Apparently the writer of Luke didn't know that in Hebrew tradition days are counted from sunset, not sunrise.

Luke 23
52 This man went unto Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus.
53 And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid.
54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath began to dawn (ἐπιφώσκω).
55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.

ἐπιφώσκω: to grow light, to dawn
Luke was quite aware of how the Jews count time. What Luke wrote, he wrote by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. He made no mistakes in his gospel account. The dawn of the Sabbath dose not mean the beginning of the Sabbath. The Sabbath began at sunset of the previous evening. When dawn came, the Sabbath was half over.
 
Member
According to Luke's account the body was in the tomb for around 24 hours.
Perhaps a bit more. All four gospel accounts confirm the same length of time in the tomb. The four gospels do not contradict one another. All four accounts are inspired accounts. Jesus was placed in the tomb just before the Sabbath. He spent the entire Sabbath in the tomb and was raised sometime between sunset at the beginning of Sunday and sunrise Sunday morning.
 
Member
Luke was quite aware of how the Jews count time. What Luke wrote, he wrote by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
The writer of Acts didn't distinguish between Ruach haQodesh (the Holy Spirit) and Ruach Elohim (Sprit of Elohim).
The Holy Spirit was supposedly present at Pentecost, yet in Acts 2:16 Peter quotes Joel 2, which is about the day of YHWH in which "my people shall never be ashamed", which contrasts with Zechariah 13:4 "the prophets shall be ashamed every one of his vision" (from Matthew 26:31).

The dawn of the Sabbath dose not mean the beginning of the Sabbath.
The point is that according to Luke the body wasn't laid in the tomb until dawn.

Luke 23
54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath began to dawn (ἐπιφώσκω).
55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
ἐπιφώσκω: to grow light, to dawn

The four gospels do not contradict one another.
John contradicts Matthew, Mark, and Luke about the soldier with the spear from John 19:34. If the soldiers were in fear as described in Matthew 27:54 then it would be absurd for them to spear the body.
 
Member
The writer of Acts didn't distinguish between Ruach haQodesh (the Holy Spirit) and Ruach Elohim (Sprit of Elohim).
The Holy Spirit was supposedly present at Pentecost, yet in Acts 2:16 Peter quotes Joel 2, which is about the day of YHWH in which "my people shall never be ashamed", which contrasts with Zechariah 13:4 "the prophets shall be ashamed every one of his vision" (from Matthew 26:31).


The point is that according to Luke the body wasn't laid in the tomb until dawn.

Luke 23
54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath began to dawn (ἐπιφώσκω).
55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
ἐπιφώσκω: to grow light, to dawn


John contradicts Matthew, Mark, and Luke about the soldier with the spear from John 19:34. If the soldiers were in fear as described in Matthew 27:54 then it would be absurd for them to spear the body.

1.There is no distinction between Ruach haQodesh (the Holy Spirit) and Ruach Elohim (Sprit of Elohim). The Holy Spirit and the Spirit of Gard the same person.
I do not know what point you are trying to make with Zech 13:4. It has absolutely nothing to do with the prophets of God. In Zech 13, God is talking about false prophets, the prophets of the idols mentioned in verse 2.

2. No, that is not what Luke is saying, I misunderstood your question earlier and should have reread the text myself before answering. I do not know what translation you are reading but I compared more than 20 English translations and not one of them translate ἐπιφώσκω as dawn in verse 54. Granted, the basic meaning of ἐπιφώσκω indeed means to dawn or to grow light but, that is not to only thing it means. The word also means to commence or about to begin. Every translation I compared use the latter meaning and rightly so. All you are dong is trying to force a translation that you feel will conflict with the other three gospels. That is not going to work. I have a background in NT Greek. Jesus was laid in the tomb before sunset on Friday evening. Just as all four gospel writers confirm. Luke records that he was laid in the tomb early enough on Friday that the women still had time to return home and prepare more spices before the Sabbath began.

3. John does not contradict the other three gospels. He simply records a fact that the others do not. This is certainly not uncommon. John records many things that the others do not. This does not mean they disagree or contradict. If your argument is that the soldiers could not have pierced his side simply because they were afraid, that is absurd.
 
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