Well you said that you want to give your explanation.

Come on. Go ahead and give your explanation.

Science does not disprove God. God is a God of order. God created science. It's our simple minds that can't conceive these things that is why we need logical explanations.

We do not know that we are the only life form, as science has only come so far, however with the sheer massiveness of the universe it is reasonable to infer that we are infact NOT the only life form.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad the sun is 400 times the size of the earth's moon, 400 times further away from earth than the moon, yet they look both proportionally the same size in our sky?

Not sure what you mean by this. Its called proportionate observation. If you have a basketball several meters behind a tennis ball then they look the same size. How is this an amazing coincidence?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad the sun lights the days nicely, while the moon glimmers in the night sweetly and the clouds bring forth rain to water our crops, which bring forth food in your stomach?

The sun's light, the moons light and rain are easily explained. The sun works by fusion, the way the moon glimmers is a result of the reflection of the sun off its surface, clouds are droplets of water which fall when the density reaches a certain level. Again, these explanations work without an omnipotent controller.

Birds have territorial songs and mating calls which are not whistled for our amusement and they have practical purposes. What you call 'dogs' are domesticated versions of wild dogs who would otherwise be roaming about the countryside killing for food. Their love depends on us providing them with food.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad your body heals naturally when you cut yourself, or you become sick and it goes away?

Again, this is explained in biology. The body has a natural process of protecting itsself which it has inherited for thousands of years to the level it is today. Today's bodies are immune to certain older diseases as evolution has toughened up our cells from attack. This is once again explained without the need of an omnipotent being outside space-time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad humans have intangible senses, called emotions where we feel love, hate, anger, sadness, happiness, shock, confused, hurt, healed, and so forth?

Not sure what you mean by this. Humans have emotions? Why is it neccessary for these to be given to us and why is it unreasonable to assume that these are nothing but biological reactions to certain situations.

Well we know its not a coincidence that I was born of a womb. I don't feel that I need to explain why only women can give birth, and why people die without choosing how. Once again, the scientific explanation does not require any outside being acting upon us.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad the complexity of dna is so mind boggling, that scientists worldwide now have gone from 'no god' to claiming a "Divine Creator"?

This is just plain wrong. I think you will find that the vast majority of scientists are atheists or not religious, I have a book with cited facts that prove this and I can get it if you don't believe me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad your body's anatomy is complex, so fine and so articulate that you wonder how this "accident" came to be?

Well I would hate to say the 'E' word, but this is explained through the natural process of evolution. By infering that evolutionists think we came about by 'accident' shows how little you know of evolution.

Not sure what you mean by this, is it a coincidence food exists? Plants would exist even without us, before the time of humans there were a vast array of plants, fruits, and vegetables. Obviously these weren't 'put there' for solely our enjoyment.

Once again this makes no sense, why would it be a coincidence that animals exist? Once again, evolution and natural selection.

I could keep going but I really don't feel like it, of course I will if you really press me.

Its a shame that billions of objects in the galaxy and yet only one, Earth has abundance of life, creativity, etc etc doesn't satisfy your understanding that there must be a divine Creator.

You think its not a coincidence? I can tell you why you think that. Because your lacking some great knowledge about the Design of everything in the galaxy. If the sun or the earth moved off axis the slightest tid bit, it would end every living thing on earth immediately. This is a fact. Tell me know, the sun being 400 times the size of the moon and nicely proportionate is still not a coincidence to you?

Their love depends on us providing them with food? Really? Where is your proof of this? Science's opinions?

http://www.talkjesus.com/scriptural-...evolution.html

Why is it necessary to be given to us? Honestly, the question is so disturbing that I cannot find an answer to give you. Its basically unbelievable that you even ask such a question. While you disagree with me, ask yourself what you'd be like without them and how you would function?

Why would you not explain why only women give birth? You trust in biology but not GOD. Why?

Is it? Yes, they're atheists like yourself and again, you placed your trust in this book about scientists. What about placing trust in the Bible? What valid reason is stopping you? While you think of an answer to defend the trust of men (scientists), remember to answer my question about disputing every miracle GOD has performed on believers worldwide. Those believers are my "cited facts". They're living proof, living witnesses of the miracles they encountered with Jesus. I am one of them. You cannot dispute that. You could try, but its "just plain wrong" of you to even try.

Actually, your knowledge-less assumption of what I know and how much I know goes to show you how much you know about me and my understanding of evolution in this case. It doesn't hurt me, my credibility when I speak truth nor my Salvation :)

You believe your ancestors were monkeys? Very disturbing. Everything you said was just ignorant faith in science alone.

In response to your belief in evolution: http://www.talkjesus.com/scriptural-...evolution.html

What proof can you show us that plants would exist without us and also, explain what "us" has anything to do with plants existence or not? Now you say they were not solely put there for our enjoyment. I never said that, but you did. What proof do you have of the reasons they were put there? Also, who put them there? If you have proof of why they were put there, you must definitely know WHO put them there too in order to make your claim valid.

You don't feel like continuing? Are you out of untruthful theories? You solely put your faith in science which is run by sinful, imperfect limited knowledged men. But, you put no bit of faith in Jesus, GOD. Why?

Here you go: Evidence, Prophecy, Facts - Talk Jesus

I challenge you to pick any thread and try to dispute the evidence. Let's see who you grab your knowledge from and whom your putting your trust in to be fully knowledgeable to claim whatever they claim.

You will see that your also without knowledge to understand GOD due to your hardened heart and trust in man instead of GOD Himself who made you. You will realize your answers are completely without merit and without evidence. If you give GOD a chance to prove Himself, you will then gain real knowledge, real wisdom from the Creator Himself.

Let's see if you can give *one* solid reason why you refuse to give GOD a chance to prove Himself to your hardened heart and instead place your trust in men who have very limited knowledge.

Tell me about miracles from Jesus Christ witnessed by millions of believers worldwide since He was born up until this day. Can you dispute these all and call the believers liars or deceived?

I honestly do not care for man's theories after all. I enjoy Truth over man's guess or "thoughts" about some subject. My trust and faith is in GOD, the Author of Wisdom.

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

Psalm 118:8
It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man.

I guess what you are essentially asking in that post is why I am an atheist. Also, why I trust science over religion. Well it is very simple really, science and the scientific method has been tried and proven hundreds of thousands of times whereas there is not one thing supporting religion or claims of an omnipotent god existing outside the realm of space-time.

Science has provided us with endless knowledge. Splitting atoms, flight, genetics, modern medicine, automobiles, engineering, power stations among other things have spawned through scientific knowledge, research and the scientific method. Whereas Bible study, prayer has no solid evidence of working ever, merely just testimonials and heresay evidence. This sort of evidence doesn't hold up in our courts most of the time so why trust it in a matter as important as the origin of our species?

You use science every day and you don't realise it. Eating breakfast, scientific principles sculpted your toaster, your refrigirator, your oven, your kettle down to the finest detail. Scientists designed these things because they did reasearch and applied their knowledge for the befefit of mankind. Science does so much for your and you still criticise scientists and atheists. You trust science with so much but when it comes to a matter of your faith you question it? What right do you have? If you don't trust 150 years of research on evolution then you don't deserve to use the other fruits of the scientific method. Throw out all appliances that science has given you, throw out your car, and everything in your house. Scientific research has been PROVEN in millions of cases and you simply discard it on the basis of your faith? I would have no problem with you having a scientific objection to evolution, but to simply reject it for no reason is simply ludicrous.

Now, what has religion given us? It has made no risky prediction whatsoever. Making broad statements that are open to interpretation any which way does not constitute an accurate prediction. If I were to write 'And let it be known that in 1,500 years man may walk on a distant land' that does not constitute evidence since it is so open to interpretation. The bible makes no risky predictions and has given us nothing to support its claims. Infact, in certain cases such as the age of the earth and divine creation it has been proven dead wrong by 1,000's of years of scientific research by millions of people. Why do you trust a piece of literature that essentially has been proven wrong and contradicts itsself numerous times?

Now I am sure that you will just skim over my post and respond with your various stickies that you have posted, but let this be known. Science has provided you with so much and 'god' with so little. Read up on evolution, keep an open mind and consider all options before entrusting your life to a 2,000 year old book. I challenge you to read 'The God Delusion' by Richard Dawkins, or any piece of atheist literature and keep your faith. I know this post will not sway your faith Chad, but heres hoping I have at least provoked someone to questioning their faith even in the slightest.

Well!!!!! You say that Splitting atoms, flight, genetics, modern medicine, automobiles, engineering, power stations among other things have spawned through scientific knowledge, research and the scientific method.

Very good.

No doubt scientists invented many good things.

You mentioned about "splitting atoms". Now my question is, "Well did the scientists create atoms?".

No doubt spitting atoms is a great deal, you can use it as a form of nuclear energy. But who created the atoms (The most basic part of matter).

Even though I'm an engineering student, I say that scientists did not create even one single atom even though they gave so many theories about atoms.

There's a famous statement in science:

"Matter can neither be created nor destroyed, but can be converted to energy and vice versa."

Then who created this universe. Certainly not the scientists (even though they spent billions of dollars of research about the universe), if they can make such a statement.

There should be a creator. He is God Almighty - our Heavenly Father.

Well you say that man came out from a monkey. Then where did the monkey come from?

It is absolutely ridiculous to even believe in that. How can man be the offspring of a monkey? Just think about it carefully.

Well if you believe that man came from a monkey, then we should still see people born from monkeys even today.

You know what, Scientists cannot explain many things in the universe. Even though they proposed so many theories about atoms, they still have a very little knowledge about atom.

Then how can you trust them when they don't know many things, why don't you trust in God who knows everything?

God cares for you no matter what you are? He loves you. If you accept Him in your heart, you will feel the difference and will be even more realistic.

NOTE:

1) Even I was like you, I never believed in God, but one day God proved himself to me to be very very real. He changed my life forever.

Now by God's grace I'm an engineering student and I'm looking forward to become a scientist.

2) On discovery channel, I seen about a scientist who went deep into the sea, diving. When he came back he said, " Now I know that God is real. How amazing it is to see the way He created the seas and the entire universe."

He said this after he came back from diving. His life was changed after that.

But I'm sorry to tell you that I don't remember his name. He came on 'Discovery channel'.

3) Scientists copied the bible. Many of them did it and chose to mock God and get credit for themselves.

4) Scientific developments are very good indeed to develop our life style, but let us not forget our creator.

You realise that there really is no need for there to be a creator. The Big Bang theory in a nutshell is that approximatly 13.7 billion years ago the universe was an extremely dense black hole, which expanded (and still expands) to its current form of what it is today.

I will agree that the conservation of energy does pose a problem for this theory however physicists are theorising certain explanations to solve this, all of which (in my opinion) are more logical than a divine creator. This of course is disregarding that the Bible says that the Earth (and by extent, the universe) is only approximatly 6-10,000 year old (a ludicrous statement).


Well this just proves how little you know of evolution. Man did not 'evolve from a monkey' man shares a common ancestor with primates. Infact the DNA of man shares something in the region of 99% of the characteristics of the DNA of primates (a compelling argument in its self would you not agree?).

Evolution suggests (although there are many theories) that life began as single cell organisms, as the Earth stabalised simple animals emerged etc. This has continued for 4.54 billion years to what we have today. So please, stop the ignorant comments about evolution.


It is good to hear that you are an engineering student (what field of engineering?) because your studies of science will only lead you towards questioning your beliefs. Science and religion are mutally exclusive, the two cannot exist together, and if one has knowledge in both one generally regects religion.

Skim over your post? No, much how you skimmed over mine and purposely ignored the links I gave you because you have a hardened heart and your too ignorant.

You skimmed over this too:

Tell me about miracles from Jesus Christ witnessed by millions of believers worldwide since He was born up until this day. Can you dispute these all and call the believers liars or deceived?

You have no answer to that, your a liar. You also did not bother reading the links I gave you about evidence of Jesus and the Bible. These are SCIENTIFIC facts. Goe