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  1. #1
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    Free Will Synergism Vs. Free Grace Monergism

    This was something that I found on monergism.com that I thought I would share given the amount of discussion we have had on this topic lately. I feel John Hendryx puts it very well.

    Free Will Synergism Vs. Free Grace Monergism

    by John Hendryx

    Synergists teach '... and as many as believed were ordained to eternal life.' but The Bible teaches 'AND AS MANY AS WERE ORDAINED TO ETERNAL LIFE BELIEVED.' (Acts 13:48)

    Synergists teach that 'salvation depends on human will', but the Bible teaches that 'it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy." (Rom 9:16)

    Synergists teach '...'no one knows the Father except those who choose the Son.' But the Bible teaches that 'no one knows the Father except the Son and anyone to whom the Son chooses to reveal Him' (Matt 11:27) They are the ones who 'choose' the Son.

    Synergists teach that 'All can come to Christ of their own free will', but Jesus teaches that 'no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.' (John 6:65) and all whom He grants will come (John 6:37) Free Will Synergism Vs. Free Grace Monergism

    Synergists teach that 'you are not Christ's sheep because you do not believe', but Jesus teaches that 'you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.' (John 10:26)

    Synergists teach that 'the reason you are not of God is because you are unwilling to hear and believe God's words.' Jesus, on the other hand, taught, 'The reason why you do not hear [God's words] is that you are not of God." (John 8:47)

    Synergists teach that 'salvation is so easy a cave man can do it" but the Bible teaches that "What is impossible with man is possible with God." (Luke 18:27)

    In the Divine economy men are responsible to believe the gospel, but are morally impotent to do so (when drawing from their own native resources). This inability (due to our intimate solidarity with Adam's sin) is something we are culpable for, much like owing a debt we cannot repay. So God has every right to call us all to account to 'repay our debt', so to speak, even though fallen man does not have the resources to do so. The Church has a privilege and an obligation to call all men to repent and believe the gospel (an imperative) but, left to themselves, no one believes. But God, in his great mercy, still has mercy on many, opening their hearts to the gospel that that might believe.

    To this sometimes a synergist often quotes "whosoever will may come" to which we reply that this quote does not teach an indicative of what we are able to do, but rather, teaches what we 'ought' to do. As Martin Luther said, "Does it follow from: 'turn ye' that therefore you can turn? Does it follow from "'Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart' (Deut 6.5) that therefore you can love with all your heart? What do arguments of this kind prove, but the 'free-will' does not need the grace of God, but can do all things by its own power...But it does not follow from this that man is converted by his own power, nor do the words say so; they simply say: "if thou wilt turn, telling man what he should do. When he knows it, and sees that he cannot do it, he will ask whence he may find ability to do it..." Luther BW,164

  2. #2
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    Answer this please.

    My dear friend Mr Rojocolo.

    Matthew 11:11

    "Truly I say to you, among those born of women there has not arisen anyone greater than John the Baptist! Yet the one who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he."

    This is an example of God's will, no argument here.

    We know John was assigned to the job, before he was born.

    Why is he least in the kingdom of Heaven?

  3. #3
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    Another question


    1 Corinthinians 15:8
    "and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also."

    Paul was hand picked like the disciples for the job.

    No one argues with that Mr Rojocolo.

    No one would come to Jesus without the influence of the Holy Spirit.
    It is not free will, or foreknowledge.

    The rest of us can resist the Holy Spirit of course.

    But, read this next quote.

    2 Peter 3:9
    "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

    God does everything in His power to save everyone.
    In fact, He already did, Jesus Christ.
    He draws all men to himself. We resist.
    Even Christians resist as you and I know.

  4. #4
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    Originally Posted by David777 View Post
    2 Peter 3:9
    "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

    God does everything in His power to save everyone.
    In fact, He already did, Jesus Christ.
    He draws all men to himself. We resist.
    Even Christians resist as you and I know.
    I believe this to be a horrible misinterpretation that many give to this verse. I agree that it saddens God to see people perish but that verse is not one to support this. The word used in that verse for "wishing" is boulomai. It refers to the absolute decrees of God. The Greek word used for God's desires and wishes is different. Therefore, a literal translation of this verse would be:

    "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, and has absolutely decreed that none perish but for all to come to repentance."

    We know many will unfortunately perish because they reject God (being that their unregenerated nature compels them to) so we also know "wishing" is not the proper English word to be used. I love the NASB but they use this word as well. This is one instance where I agree with the KJV's translation because they are closer to a literal translation in their usage of the word "willing" instead of "wishing."

  5. #5
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    If you wish

    2 Peter 3:9
    "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not WILLING for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

    This replacement still does not alter the meaning.

    Can you expand further Mr Rojocolo.

  6. #6
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    Originally Posted by David777 View Post
    2 Peter 3:9
    "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not WILLING for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

    This replacement still does not alter the meaning.

    Can you expand further Mr Rojocolo.
    The structure of the sentence is saying that God's purposeful decree is that none of the "you" will perish. It is not written as a description of God's desires. It is an account of God's active decree. Because of this, we know none of the "you" will perish because God has actively decreed it to be so in the usage of the Greek word boulomai. As a result, we now know the "you" is limited to a certain group out of necessity since we know many will perish. Some will perish but none of "you" will perish because God has decreed it to be so. In accordance with the rest of Scripture, we know the "you" refers to those whom Christ will not lose. Who are these people? It is those called by God. It is those predestined by God. It is the Elect. It is written "To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ" as noted in chapter 1 verse 1.It is a carefully aimed statement directed toward a very distinct group of people.

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    Originally Posted by rojoloco View Post
    The structure of the sentence is saying that God's purposeful decree is that none of the "you" will perish. It is not written as a description of God's desires. It is an account of God's active decree. Because of this, we know none of the "you" will perish because God has actively decreed it to be so in the usage of the Greek word boulomai. As a result, we now know the "you" is limited to a certain group out of necessity since we know many will perish. Some will perish but none of "you" will perish because God has decreed it to be so. In accordance with the rest of Scripture, we know the "you" refers to those whom Christ will not lose. Who are these people? It is those called by God. It is those predestined by God. It is the Elect. It is written "To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ" as noted in chapter 1 verse 1.It is a carefully aimed statement directed toward a very distinct group of people.
    What is your source on this definition Rojo?
    Religion is an ugly tyrant.

  8. #8
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    In reply

    Fascinating the way you read this passage, Mr Rojocolo.

    We obviously approach the verse from different angles.

    Why don't we get down to business and select a verse

    that is much more definitive.

    Romans 9:13 Just as it is written, "JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED."

    This should make you happy.

  9. #9
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    Originally Posted by jiggyfly View Post
    What is your source on this definition Rojo?
    My source is both the Strong's Exhaustive Concordance as well as my Lexicon. The simple fact is that the word boulomai most commonly refers to the purposeful will of God. There are only a handful of instances where it is referring to a desire but it is clear in those instances that there is no way for it to speak of a decree because it wouldn't even make any sense. However, more than 30 times in the New Testament it speaks of an absolute decree. 2 Peter 3:9 is no exception.

    Really, just looking at the context gives it away. The whole epistle is aimed at Christians. It speaks of Christians as "you" and "your" on many occasions. 2 Peter 1:1 starts off by telling us it was written to those with a like faith. The first part of 2 Peter 3 speaks of those who will perish. It then starts off verse 9 by speaking of a promise made by God. This promise is that those who believe will have eternal life. That promise is that the Son will not lose any whom the Father has given him. That promise is that all whom the Father calls will be saved. Verse 9 then goes on to speak of God's patience. Believe it or not, not all of us Christians were ever perfect from birth. :angel: We all were depraved beings on the fast track to Hell at one point before we were saved. If at any point God decides He is going to destroy the world and send Jesus back, He would be full justified in doing so. We really have no reason to continue living in a world that blasphemes God. He has every right to destroy His creation. However, patience is an attribute of God that He is choosing to employ. He made a promise and He intends to keep it regardless how long it takes and how much "bullying" He must endure until it is kept. Who is the promise made to? Is it made to everybody? Certainly not! We know people go to Hell. Furthermore, we know that since all whom God calls will be saved, not all are called. This is out of necessity. On top of this, verse 9 also tells us who the promise was for. It was for "you." We already covered that the "you" it speaks of is those of like faith. The "you" is Christians as well as Christians to come. God's promise was for Christians and He is patiently awaiting the day that all whom He has called/predestined come to Him. How do we know they will come? Is there a chance the end will never come if those whom He has called never come? Not at all! We are promised those whom He calls will come because the purposeful will of God (boulomai) decrees it to be so. Not only will none of the "you" ever perish but they will also all come to repentance. While the wicked spoken of in the preceding verses will perish, we can take comfort in knowing His promise to us will be kept.

  10. #10
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    Mr Jiggyfly

    You can take over if you wish.
    We can not expect Mr Rojocolo to reason with us both.
    In Christ.

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