Originally Posted by bgsda

truth speaker im not quite understanding what you mean or by what you are understanding what im saying about the bible. There is one Bible as in the Word of God. I was refering to that there are lots of diff. bibles out there. You have the satans bible 2. Jehova witness bible 3. Muslims Bible 4. catholic Bible and the list goes on and on. There is only one Bible, yes diff. versions or translations, that we Christians use. That one Bible is the one that many take and twist to their own destruction 2Pet. 3:15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation--as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
Truth if you really want to know if He does have a end time church you have to do what Jesus said in John7:17 If anyone wants to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God or whether I speak on My own authority. The Holy Spirit will guide us to all truth John 15:8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; 11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged. 12 I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. When you read the epistle of John Chp. 14-16 count how many times John wrote being inspired by the Holy Spirit about those that love Jesus will keep His Commandments. It all ties together troughout the Bible about His commandments all the way to Revelation as I wrote in the earlier thread on this topic. That is one of the major characteristic about those that really love Him and his end time church. Not out of works because we there is nothing we can do to make us rightheous. But we are to do it out of LOVE and OBEDIENCE.
Its simple like someone put it lets say you break a law like speeding right. You get pulled over by a police officer. Cop gives you a ticket. you go to court. after 3 hrs you get called to the judge. The judge after seeing its your first time or for whatever reason rips the ticket and says do not do speed again. Now when you drive home are you going to speed again. NO,NO,NO. You will obey and not speed again. You will keep the law. Now you mix that with LOVE that we have from God and that will be why we ought to keep Gods Ten Commandments. Yes we will fall short but we have to confess and Hell cleanse our sins and repent try not to do it again. Remember that 1John 3:4Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Hope this helps.

Drifting from the title of the thread.

The ten commandments are a subcategory of the Mosaic Law.

We are not members of the covenant God made with Israel at mount
Sinai. Read Galatians bqsda, you have been mislead like so many others.

Sorry guys but we are sticking to this thread. as i said before there are many many doctrines of man that have been passed down from pastor to pastor and taught to individuals. Its the same thread cause as i showed in the other reply that i made its in the Bible the characyeristics of Gods elect or remnant or end time people or church. Read the reply that i made i believe it was the first one and the keeping of Gods commandment and the faith of Jesus is there.
The same individual that wrote galations inspired by the same Holy Spirit wrote all of Romans 7. He wrote Rom7:7What shall we saythen? Is the law sin? God forbid . Nay, I hadnot knownsin, but by the law: for I hadnot knownlust, except the law had said , Thou shaltnot covet . Now did the Holy Spirit say its done away with NO. The Law or Ten Commandments points out our sin. That is what sin is! 1John 3: 4Whosoever committethsin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Dont forget what Jesus said in Matt. 5:17Thinknot that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I amnot come to destroy , but to fulfil .18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass , one jot or one tittle shall in no wise passfrom the law, till all be fulfilled . I dont think heaven and earth has passed.
The Holy Spirit also said Rom. 7:12Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. Also Rom. 7:14For we knowthat the law isspiritual: but I amcarnal, soldunder sin. Rom. 7:22For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:23But I seeanother law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringingme into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. Guys did you notice that there is 2 laws. 1. the Ten commandments that is holy,just, good, and spiritual. 2. the other mosaic law written by moses leads to death. More on this on another thread about the Ten Commandments.
See there cant be confusion or contradiction in the scriptures. There just cant be. One of us is wrong and I truly believe after careful study on this its you guys. See i too believed that" saved by grace no longer under the law" because i was taught that way by a pastor and the majority think like that. That is why i wrote all of that on my last threads David and Truth. Alot of traditions and commandments of man. Dont be deceived. Study about the two laws and which one was nailed to the Cross. remember contradiction or confusion CANNOT be found in the WORD of GOD. You cannot disregard what it says 3 times in Rev. but many many times throughout the New testament about how we Christians should be living NOW. Rev. 12:17And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. Rev. 14:12Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. Rev.22:14Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. Thf these are just 2 of the characteristics of Gods end time people. Please dont disregard this. Very important.

Oh! The teachings of men handed down, bqsda you are in error
in trying to obey Jewish law.

This is no doubt one of the greatest errors handed down
through churches over many centuries. Even the sects
absorbed the same error. They cling to the ten commandments
(Jewish law) as if these ten laws are different to the other
laws contained within the Covenant of God and Israel.

Bqsda please read the following extract from Galatians.

<sup>Galatians 2

15</sup> “We are Jews by nature and not sinners from among the Gentiles;
¹⁶ nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law
but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus,
so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law;
since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.

Line 15 states "sinners from among the Gentiles", the Gentiles
were regarded as filthy and unclean. Gentiles never had the Law
of Moses, not even the ten commandments. Contrary to what
has been taught through traditions, the ten commandments
apply to the flesh. We are spiritual in Christ.

We Gentiles are justified through faith in Jesus, not faith in
Jesus plus obedience to the law bqsda. How could we be
justified by the law when no flesh is justified by the law.

The Holy Spirit convicts us regarding sin, not the law.

You will never succeed in obedience to the ten commandments,
you will fail. Justification is impossible.

Also stated in the very book you read from bgsda Romans ch 4 vs 14 (For if they which are of the law be heirs,faith is made void,and the promise made of none effect:) 15 (Because the law worketh wrath:for where no law is,there is no transgression.) 16 (Therefore it is of faith,that it might be by grace;to the end the promise might be sure to all seed;not to that only which is of the law,but to that also which is of faith of Abraham;which is father to us all,) Also how can we as gentiles be under the law when we where never part of his plan the Jews where his chosen people and we the gentiles where just heathens it wasn't until acts ch 10 when peter went to the gentiles and he said it wasn't lawful Acts ch 10 vs 28 (And he said unto them,Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company,or come unto one of another nation;but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man commoñ or unclean.)

david I guess you didnt read fully my last reply. Is there still sin in this world? what is the definition of sin? So is there still a Law? If youll read my thread and not quickly jump to what you've been taught you'll see what the Bible has to say. See you have to understand that there is two laws by what Paul usually was writting about. Mosaic Law written by Moses Duet.31:24 And it came to pass, when MOSES had made an end of WRITING THE WORDS of this law in a book, until they were finished . Wrtten because of transgression of Gods Law Gal.3:19Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made ; and it was ordainedby angels in the hand of a mediator. Mediator was Moses.
Gods law on the other hand was written with the finger of God and spoken by Him directly to his people Exo. 20/ 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the FINGER of God. Gods Law is eternal Matt. 5:17Thinknot that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I amnot come to destroy , but to fulfil .18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass , one jot or one tittle shall in no wise passfrom the law, till all be fulfilled .19Whosoever therefore shall breakone of these least commandments, and shall teachmen so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall doand teach them, the same shall be calledgreat in the kingdom of heaven. Moses law temporary Col.2:14 Blotting out the HANDWRITTING of ordinances that was against us, which wascontrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; and Heb. 8:13In that he saith , A new covenant, he hath made the first old . Now that which decayethand waxeth old is ready to vanish away.
I could spend all day giving you texts of how there are two laws. one still needed today as long as sin is here on earh , the other abolished at the Cross. AMEN. Oh new covenant could be found in Heb. 8:.10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will putmy laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people. See He only changed the location from tablets of stone to our minds. I know its alot to swallow. I felt the same way when I was shown this and i was only a Christian for 2 yrs at the time. But the least we can do is study this most important characteristic of Gods end time church or people. If you want to know more just inbox me a message. Remember what it says in John 10:16And other sheep I have , which are not of this fold: them also I must bring , and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. Also in Rev. 18:4And I heard another voice from heaven, saying , Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. There is a church or people that God has chosen for these end times we are living. For more info inbox me.
This doesnt mean that this end time people or church are stuck up ans private like some cults. These people or church has a message to give to all as it says in Revelations to come out of Spiritual Babylon or Confusion. Please the least we can do is to study to show ourselves approved unto God, dividing his Word rightly. God bless

The law was given unto Moses,therefore the way to heaven was by the law with sacrifices and such,but when Jesus Christ was crucified he was the ultimate sacrifice,so at that point the law ended and grace was given,yes the commandments still stand but its no longer the law,now we are saved by grace.Nowthe only way to make it to heaven is John ch 3 vs 5 ( Jesus answered,Verily verily,I say unto thee,except a man be born of the water and of the Spirit,he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.) Now born of the water is simply being baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins Acts ch 2 vs 38 Now to born of the Spirit one will speak in a new tongue as the Spirit give the utterance such as was done on the day of Pentecost Acts ch 2,read it for better understanding when filled with the Holy Ghost,this is the comforter Jesus spoke about when he said i will send you a comforter Also once filled with the Holy Ghost you will receive power from on high,this is the miracle working power and no miracle can be done by flesh alone,know ye not you body is the temple of God,Also that is why Jesus said i make all things new because everything changed

Truth I thought you were open to what God has to say in this as your the one who started this thread. this has to do with this thread. You said yes the commandments are not done away with thats good. So you know that it points out our sins right Rom.3:20/7:7 like a mirror James 2:23-25. and we'll be judged by it James 2:11For he that said , Do not commit adultery , said also, Do not kill . Now if thou commit no adultery , yet if thou kill , thou art become a transgressor of the law.12So speak ye , and so do , as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
So then if one of the characteristics is the KEEPING of HIS COMMANDMENTS are you knowingly sinning, by breaking Gods Law, intentionally. What if i was to tell you that I kill someone each week. or that i cheat on my wife once a week. or that i like t.v more than worshipping God. You'll probably be like He's no Christian right or would have doubts about me. But do you know that people do sin each and every week and dont ask forgiveness for this sin. Some do it ignorantly others defy it openly without giving it study. They'll just run like i did to my pastor or elder and whatever they say i'll believe because they are "holy".
What I'm talking about is the 4th commandment smack dab in the middle Ex.20:8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy . 9Six days shalt thou labour , and do all thy work:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. This points to our Creator. the only one that starts with REMEMBER cause He knew we'll forget. You know there would be no atheists if we would hve been faithful and keep this commandment because it makes Him the Creator of everything. remember its one of the characteristics of God's end time people or church. This is the one i told you seperates or narrows it down alot. im talking about the true Sabbath. not the one that was changed by a human to Sunday. if you dont believe me ask any catholic priest or your pastor. Changed by a man when god wrote His law not once but twice cause He did not want us to mess it up. God bless.
truth this is alot to swallow I know. when i found out I tell you after 2 weeks of fasting i did not know. my wife had to tell me that i fasted from her and the kids. I think i did or had the urge to even vomit cause it was a fight. It made me sick. But you know what we have to hold on to truth no matter what. My wife stayed at the other church i was in. She ran to the pastor, pastor told her something, probably the same he told me, to stay away from the guy who was showing me the truth. I couldnt i wok with the guy and i used to carry a Bible in my back pocket at all times so this guy guide by the holy spirit would show me from my bible, everything from God's Word , not his. my pastor would not even say anything but stay away ffrom him. Now should i have believed my pastor or the Word of God.
I hope youll consider this and study it. Very,very important

how can i start a thread. IDK how to. wanna do one on the Commandments or the 4th commandment only.

Im lost bgsda are we talking about the law or are we talking about the Sabbath,I myself also understand that saturday is the Sabbath and Sunday is the first day of the week,but in the Gospel of Matthew ch 12 Jesus talks about the Sabbath,old testament you where supposed to fast and keep it holy,but Jesus changed all that and as far as working on the Sabbath Matthew ch 12 vs 11 (And he said unto them,What man shall be there among you,that shall have one sheep,and if it fall into a pit on the Sabbath day,will not lay hold on it,and lift it out?) 12 (How much then is a man better than a sheep?Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the Sabbath days,) So as far as working on the Sabbath to take care of your family in Gods eyes is to do well but to those who abuse the Sabbath for their own lusts is forsaken the Sabbath day

And all that we discuss pertains to this thread because if people take somebody's word for the truth or deceiving someone with twisting of Scriptures how will they come to the knowledge of the true church lest we show them
and just curious,does the sda baptize in the name of Jesus Christ for remission of sins,And do the sda speak in an unknown tongue,simply born of the water and of the spirit,this is just a question of my curiosity,I've never spoken to an sda,this is not for any other purpose just for my knowledge of the church

Originally Posted by bgsda

david I guess you didnt read fully my last reply. Is there still sin in this world? what is the definition of sin? So is there still a Law? If youll read my thread and not quickly jump to what you've been taught you'll see what the Bible has to say. See you have to understand that there is two laws by what Paul usually was writting about. Mosaic Law written by Moses Duet.31:24 And it came to pass, when MOSES had made an end of WRITING THE WORDS of this law in a book, until they were finished . Wrtten because of transgression of Gods Law Gal.3:19Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made ; and it was ordainedby angels in the hand of a mediator. Mediator was Moses.
Gods law on the other hand was written with the finger of God and spoken by Him directly to his people Exo. 20/ 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the FINGER of God. Gods Law is eternal Matt. 5:17Thinknot that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I amnot come to destroy , but to fulfil .18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass , one jot or one tittle shall in no wise passfrom the law, till all be fulfilled .19Whosoever therefore shall breakone of these least commandments, and shall teachmen so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall doand teach them, the same shall be calledgreat in the kingdom of heaven. Moses law temporary Col.2:14 Blotting out the HANDWRITTING of ordinances that was against us, which wascontrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; and Heb. 8:13In that he saith , A new covenant, he hath made the first old . Now that which decayethand waxeth old is ready to vanish away.
I could spend all day giving you texts of how there are two laws. one still needed today as long as sin is here on earh , the other abolished at the Cross. AMEN. Oh new covenant could be found in Heb. 8:.10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will putmy laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people. See He only changed the location from tablets of stone to our minds. I know its alot to swallow. I felt the same way when I was shown this and i was only a Christian for 2 yrs at the time. But the least we can do is study this most important characteristic of Gods end time church or people. If you want to know more just inbox me a message. Remember what it says in John 10:16And other sheep I have , which are not of this fold: them also I must bring , and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. Also in Rev. 18:4And I heard another voice from heaven, saying , Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. There is a church or people that God has chosen for these end times we are living. For more info inbox me.
This doesnt mean that this end time people or church are stuck up ans private like some cults. These people or church has a message to give to all as it says in Revelations to come out of Spiritual Babylon or Confusion. Please the least we can do is to study to show ourselves approved unto God, dividing his Word rightly. God bless

Hello bqsda, I do understand exactly what you are saying.

Your argument is an old argument and one that generates
much debate.

You divided the law of Moses into two parts, one section
of the law applies to Gentiles and the other section of the
law does not.

You have selected the ten commandments but excluded
the other commandments.

In this process of separation which you performed the error
becomes manifest. Mosaic law applies to the flesh of man,
the law is prohibition. You will not do this, you will not
do that, etc. The law is made for murderers, rapists, thieves, etc.

You have failed to notice a profound spiritual separation
which God has enacted.

Romans 8 (Life Through the Spirit)

1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,

2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set
you free from the law of sin and death.

3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh,
God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering.
And so he condemned sin in the flesh,

4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us,
who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Bqsda the law applies to the flesh, if you hold to the ten commandments you
are still enslaved by the flesh. Paul in Romans 7 is explaining the fleshly
struggle and failure by attempting to (by the flesh) obey the law.

The cross is where the Spiritual Law comes into play, the law of Christ.
"...who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit."

Christ fulfilled the requirements of the law for us bqsda.

We Gentiles never had the law of Moses or any part thereof.

Yet Christ poured out His Holy Spirit upon us too.

Now that we have been liberated in Christ you want to place the
law of Moses on our heads. That is impossible bqsda
we were never members of that old covenant.

The ten commandments were etched in stone bqsda and given
to Israel not the Gentiles. Just where in the scriptures does
it say that the Gentiles have been placed under the law of
Moses?

We are of the spirit not the flesh, the law and any component of
the law belongs to the flesh and is death.