because we can only assume some things
assumptions can be later reviewed if they can be proven. so thats why i gave my view.

Why would you want to assume, where it may not be warranted
to make an assumption in the first place.

The natural reading of Acts 5, is the selection of Ananias from the believers Jari.
To assume Ananias was not in fact under Grace would be a crude assumption indeed.
Much safer to not make the assumption.

If you are wrong in your assumption you pay the price.

With no assumption, no mistakes are possible.

This seems are more straight forward approach.

Hello, David

not the way i read Bible. I hope we can agree to disagree then.

I disagree. assuming he was among belivers is crude assumption because it goes against everything we learn from God's love and nature in the bible.

theres no risk as i admit its assumption that i cannot prove. I so wish others would admit the same from their positions.

there's no price that needs to be paid when some one joins bible study with an idea. different is to claim it as fact.

God bless you David

Hi gdemoss:
I do not believe demon influence is characterized by odd thoughts popping into ones head. (Quote--These attacks come in the form of thoughts that seem to originate out of nowhere.) The account of Ananias shows he must have cultivated the desire for greed and the plaudits of men. Because he could have given all the money to the Christian cause, instead he schemed and lied, and was able to bring his wife on board to go along with it, who must also have been a born again Christian, and this is an important point, "she was not influenced by Satan," she too wanted the feelings associate with popularity, by pretending to give all the money away, while greedily keeping some of it back. This does not sound like an odd thought popping into ones head. This sounds like a carefully cultivated feeling and desire in both of them.

That being the case, we must be careful to monitor not just our odd thoughts that flush in and out of everyones mind every day, and also focus on feelings and desires that do not line up with the bible.

I think after reading all these replies, that is the key, any random thought, feeling or desire in our mind and heart that does not line up with God's word is to be rejected. That is quite a challenge!!!

a gift of the spirit called discernment of spirits is one thought but not everyone has this gift.

my question in return is why does it matter? sin is sin.

funny how people believing God slays everyone dead who err's somehow. I believe Joh 3:17 says Jesus came to world to SAVE the world not Condemn it. Which is why ananias died because joh 3 also says who doesn t believe is condemmed already - so God must known ananias would never believe to give this judgement.

but if dead people are being carried out from your church every sunday i might not want an invatation.

James 3
13Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? let him shew out of a good conversation his works with meekness of wisdom.

14But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.

15This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.

16For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

17But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

18And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.


Colossians 3:9
Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;


No warnings in scripture about being killed if you lie. God is merciful. We have grace.

This is never personal and never should be taken as personal.

This is what you stated in your previous post:

funny how people believing God slays everyone dead who err's somehow.
I believe Joh 3:17 says Jesus came to world to SAVE the world not Condemn it.
Which is why ananias died because joh 3 also says who doesn t believe is condemmed already
- so God must known ananias would never believe to give this judgement.

Do you see what I see in your reply.

Acts 5 says that Ananias lied to men, which amounted to lying to the Holy Spirit.
It does not say what you said in the highlighted blue line.

You are stretching this judgement in Acts 5, you are saying that Ananias did not believe in Jesus.
That is separate from what is recorded in Acts 5. It states Ananias was judged for lying.

Of course God knew Ananias completely, but the text does not say what you said Jari.

true and thats why we need to look in rest of the bible to learn of God's righteuess judgements .
to have some clue what happened there

By all means lets look at other scripture to see whether your proposition has support. Feel free to quote.

I am different and speak from the heart as man to man, with what I learn in life with the guidance from God.

So I made the statement that God killed Ananias and Sapphira. I was so very wrong. You see it is something we do as men, we so wish to protect our beloved God and to condemn all sin that we put words in his mouth sometimes. God just grins at us and teaches us different as honest mistakes made with a good heart are but guided to the truth.

So I ask all of you, where in the Bible, in any place, do you not see the goodness of God?

Do you see it say God killed them. No it simply says the fell down dead. It does not say God killed them, it says they died, fell down. How do you suppose that happened??

John 10:10 to me convicts Satan as the destroyer. Satan is the killer, not God. It is Satan that kills .

Luke 21: 26 speaks of a fear so great that mens hearts fail them out of fear. So if you believe in the gifts of the spirit, you can see that Peter had the gift of knowledge and Satan provided the great fear and they died of fear of the heart.......or a heart attack.

So you have a couple who are like some today, they want to be so very important....and impress everyone , and they wish all to honor them and to know they are important......so they sell their possession, which Peter reveals to be land......keep back a part of it so they can splurge and enjoy.......but Satan is already working on them and they are already fearful of being found out. Shhhheee.....do not tell........no one knows......now we will be important.

So the man enters the presence of the church and Peter and out of the blue Peter asks him why he has not only lied to him but do you not know you have lied to God also....Uh oh........how did Peter know this...by the spirit of knowledge......that is how. God revealed it to him . So the couple died out of fear. They let Satan get hold of them and they were already fearful and when they saw the Power that God does have, this allowed their fear planted by Satan to kill them.

This is the way I see it....in its truth. They fell down and gave up the Ghost........God did not kill them.

Kit